Jan 7, 2019, 9:29 pm
Last edit by: JDiver
FAQ: What's a Systemwide Upgrade SWU (ex-VIP / VIPOW / "eVIP") 2017 on
Please read this wiki for important information not documented elsewhere.
NOTE: As of January 2017
"The way your upgrade request is prioritized is you'll be listed according to your elite status level followed by (the type of upgrade - SWU and Upgrade Award, aka miles + copay), the number of EQD (Elite Qualifying Dollars) earned in the (rolling) last 12 months."
Upgrades are prioritized first by the following elite status levels:
Concierge Key SM . (up to 120 hours out)
Executive Platinum (up to 100 hours out)
Platinum Pro . . . . (up to 72 hours out)
Platinum . . . . . . . (up to 48 hours out)
Gold . . . . . . . . . . (up to 24 hours out)
After status tier, upgrades are prioritized by the type of upgrade (SWU and miles + copay before 500 Mile e-upgrades /UDU; your last 12 months' Elite Qualifying Dollar spend on AA. See FAQ: Earning EQD / Elite Qualifying Dollars on AA and partner airlines (2017 on) (EQD will include the EQD offset one might earn from spend on their Barclaycard Aviator Red or Silver card, as announced elsewhere in this forum.)
Date of request has no bearing on upgrade priority other than after all other priorities have been met and there’s a highly unlikely tie.
From AA.com... "Before you get to the airport, requests for systemwide and mileage award upgrades are processed independently from 500-mile upgrade requests.
At the airport, upgrades requested will be prioritized in this order: See: https://www.aa.com/i18n/aadvantage-p...am-updates.jsp
Systemwide Upgrade FAQ:
Q. What are Systemwide Upgrades, exactly?
Electronic Systemwide Upgrades, abbreviated SWU, also previously referred to as eVIPs or VIPs, are electronic instruments earned as stated previously. SWU generally allow the owner to upgrade up to three segments, more or less in the same direction, on any flights AA flies with their own aircraft (not valid on partners or codeshares - must be marketed and operated by AA), on most paid, published fares to the next class of service. (Successful upgrades on a single SWU include EZE-MIA-JFK-LHR, NRT-LAX-DFW-LHR.)
Q. When do SWU clear?
Upgrades can clear immediately if the appropriate inventory is available (e.g., Coach to Business (and domestic First on two class aircraft) requires "C" class to be available, Business to First requires "A" class to be available). Otherwise, SWU may be waitlisted in priority of AAdvantage status, followed by last 12 months EQD spend (and within those, by fare class if they are full fare Y). SWU and EXP UDU have the same priority once the flight and associated upgrade / PALL list has passed to airport control.
Q. Can I use SWU on codeshares operated by AA?
No. (Though 001 AA ticketing is not a requirement), the flight must be marketed and operated by AA.
Q. Are any fare classes ineligible / invalid for SWU upgrades?
Some government and consolidator fares may not be upgraded; Basic Economy flights may not be upgraded. Award flights may not be upgraded with SWU. See post #683 by JonNYC:
[quote]Invalid (for SWU upgrade)
*The reason for not allowing SWU / eVIP upgrades to be used in conjunction with a military/government fare is not based on the fare level (although they are discounted), but rather it is based on the full flexibility those fares provide. Military/government fares provide a huge benefit to the customer already in that they can be booked at the last minute and canceled or changed with no advance notice and no penalties. As such, they are not allowed to be used in conjunction with a SWU.
Can I still make use if my SWU and credit the flight(s) to another airline?
You are not supposed to. If switching from AAdvantage to another scheme's FFN, please be aware: Benefitting from a privilege granted for your AAdvantage status and changing your FFN to earn on another airline is generally prohibited by AAdvantage Terms and Conditions. Doing so might risk that benefit (e.g. upgrade).
From the AAdvantage Terms and Conditions (link)
Q. Can I see SWU eligible flights on aa.com? If not, where?
aa.com will also reflect if a SWU can be used as you book - not that there is availability. One can see required inventory (A or C) using ExpertFlyer or other tools.
Q. What is the priority order for SWU wait list clearing?
Priority for wait listing is based first on AAdvantage status of requestor, then by rolling EQD earning during las 12 months; within those criteria, full fare (J or Y) trumps discounted fares.
NOTE: once the booking goes to airport control you may have to request your SWU request be reactivated. Those travel companions previously prioritized by the sponsor's status no longer revert to their own status at airport control.
Q. How do I know if my SWU request has been waitlisted?
You can see it online only 2-3 days prior to your depature. It will say "Systemwide Upgrade Requested". Otherwise, there is no way to know unless you call AA again and ask. In AA app you can see upgrade waiting list from 4 hours prior to the departure. Thank you (link) MrJBoy for clarifying).
If my SWU clears on AA but the flights is cancelled or delayed, and I get put on another AA or partner flight, will my Upgrade be preserved / honored?
On AA and Joint Business Venture partners (AY, BA, IB, JL, QF), AA will attempt to honor the upgrade. On other airline partners it is unlikely.
Q. Can I gift SWUs to others, and will my or their status apply?
You may certainly gift SWU to others. They will have to provide you their information, including PNR, and you will have to call it in. Your status can carry over to one treeling companion (on your itinerary) until the SWU passes to airport control; otherwise, SWU priority will depend on the user's AAdvantage status followed by date of upgrade request.
Q. What if I apply a SWU to a traveling companion?
That traveling companion "borrows" your status in terms of priority on the upgrade waitlist until the waitlisted passes to airport control.
Q. Can I sell or purchase SWUs to / from others (e.g. on eBay or CraigsList)?
While SWU may be gifted to others, AAdvantage rules prohibit selling / purchasing, trading or bartering various instruments, including SWU. A sold SWU will, if caught by AA Corporate Security AAdvantage Fraud (and they actively seek these out), cause SWU / upgrade cancellation at minimum and may even include closing the seller's account with forfeiture of miles, upgrade instruments and even elite status.
Further useful details about using SWU
. . . . ● Four SWUs are earned by Executive Platinum AAdvantage members when they cross the threshold to EXP, and their expiration is essentially the same as the earned status - January 31 of the ensuing status year (e.g. earn May 5 2017, the status and SWUs are good through 31 Jan 2019).
. . . . ● Two SWUs are earned by Executive Platinum AAdvantage members when they cross the 150,000 and 200,000 EQ EQ Miles; their expiration is essentially the same as the earned status as described above. (Further increments of 50,000 EQM past 200,000 earn no more SWU.)
. . . . ● Two SWUs (more) are earned by Concierge Key members.
. . . . ● Four SWUs are earned by those crossing Million Miler thresholds of 2MM and every Million Miles milestone thereafter.
. . . . ● SWUs may be transferred or gifted (not bargained, bartered or sold) to anyone the owner chooses - the owner must authorize the transfer and provide at minimum the designated person's name, frequent flyer #, and PNR. Note fees and taxes may be due, such as APD / Air Passenger Duty due for flights originating in the UK (or with connections exceeding 23:59).
. . . . ● AA tends to protect passengers granted upgrades with SWUs if IROPS move them to other oneworld flights, particularly JBV partners (AA, AY, BA, IB, JL, preserving already granted upgrades (not waitlisted).
. . . . ● N.B. AA will no longer attach expiring (31 Jan 2017 or -18) SWUs to be attached to existing upgrade inventory 1 Feb and after unless one is a very high value customer; AA now has software in place to prevent this, but if you consider yourself a high value customer, you can ask. Speculatively, EXP through 31 Jan 2018 with Concierge Key and / or 4 or 5 Helix / "Eagles" rating and lots of D and above revenue. See FAQ: New changes 90%+ eliminate post-expiration SWU use (Jun 2014)
. . . . ● If you don't want to wait list your SWU so that it automatically encumbered when a domestic segment becomes available for upgrade, but only want the domestic segments to clear if the international segment clears, ask the AA EP agent to waitlist the international portion but "DSR" the domestic segments; that way, the domestic segments will only clear if the international segment clears.
. . . . ● SWU application can include co-terminals: JonNYC, post #601: "This is the current list of MAC airports, and, as far as I understand it, are generally recognized for revenue tickets including SWU application to same: . . . . ● UK Air Passenger Duty / APD for LHR/UK departures: (Often incorrectly called "Luxury tax"): Departing from the UK (or on a layover of 24:00 or longer via the U.K.), you'll be charged the full APD (the lowest cabin class - usually economy - pays only half APD). This applies for upgrades to business only. Upgrading business to first doesn't incur this, (since your business ticket already included the full APD). This does not apply TO the U.K. or to connecting in under 24:00 in the U.K. Other airports may impose other taxes, e.g. HKG is USD $2.80.
. . . . ● Through (two flights with the same flight number, or through flights with stops) flights pose challenges insofar as upgrade availability must exist on all sectors. You may have to call AA to use a SWU on through flights.
Updated 30 Aug 2017 - JDiver
A. Not for most. The option was possible due to software limitations. New software, AAcoRN, put into place 26 June 2014, will prevent this from occurring for "unqualified" members; only "qualified" members will be allowed to encumber SWU past their expiry date in the future. (See post #1)
Q. How do I know if I am a "qualified" member?
A. You can try to call and encumber expiring SWU past their expiry. If you are not allowed to, you aren't.
Q. So, exactly who does AA consider "qualified"?
A. A very high value AAdvantage member, as measured by the internal "Helix" system, which assigns an "Eagles" ranking from 1 to 5 (the more, the better).
Q. I've never heard of this. When did it start?
A. AA's rating system was originally based on three colors, green, yellow and red, which changed to 1-3 Eagles and was later expanded to 1-5 Eagles.
Q. How are Eagles scores assigned? Are they static, or do they change?
A. It has been said spend and fare classes (think lots of annual travel in fare classes of D and above) may affect your Eagles score, as well as OSO and negative incidents you have experienced that might result in your moving your custom to another airline. It is also said your Helix score is updated periodically, perhaps even nightly.
Q. How can I find out my Helix score / how many Eagles I have?
A. You can't. AA employees are not empowered to discuss the Helix system with customers. If you normally get extra SWU once you've made EP, are allowed to extend SWU use and find EP desk agents are willing to bend rules for you often, speculative, you might have 4-5 Eagles rating.
Q. So, this is a hidden tier higher than Executive Platinum?
A. No, because it doesn't give you privileges beyond EP beyond those mentioned, e.g. courtesy Club membership or additional priority for boarding or upgrades, like Concierge Key may.
Q. Do others than Executive Platinum have Helix / Eagles scores?
A. It can be safely assumed all AAdvantage members have such scores.
For further information, see discussions on:
JonNYC's Traveing Better
The Boarding Area
Thanks to JonNYC for most of the information available to the public on this topic.
Updated 6 Oct 2016 - JDiver
Please read this wiki for important information not documented elsewhere.
The current thread can be reached here.
NOTE: CHANGES
NOTE: Upgrade waitlist priority is 1) Status, followed by 2) Rolling EQD earning for last 365 days as of 20 May 2017. Link to FT thread.
(No further SWUs are forthcoming at 250,000 EQM or after, though CK often have access to two more.)
Remember: EQM earning will vary from 0 to 3.0 EQM per base mile, based on eligible fare class and marketing airline, on EQM earning fares.
NOTE: Upgrade waitlist priority is 1) Status, followed by 2) Rolling EQD earning for last 365 days as of 20 May 2017. Link to FT thread.
- Executive Platinum members automatically earn four SWU when they earn 100,000 EQM (these expire at the end of the following status year).
- Executive Platinum members will automatically earn two further SWU at 150,000 and 200,000 EQM
Remember: EQM earning will vary from 0 to 3.0 EQM per base mile, based on eligible fare class and marketing airline, on EQM earning fares.
"The way your upgrade request is prioritized is you'll be listed according to your elite status level followed by (the type of upgrade - SWU and Upgrade Award, aka miles + copay), the number of EQD (Elite Qualifying Dollars) earned in the (rolling) last 12 months."
Upgrades are prioritized first by the following elite status levels:
Concierge Key SM . (up to 120 hours out)
Executive Platinum (up to 100 hours out)
Platinum Pro . . . . (up to 72 hours out)
Platinum . . . . . . . (up to 48 hours out)
Gold . . . . . . . . . . (up to 24 hours out)
After status tier, upgrades are prioritized by the type of upgrade (SWU and miles + copay before 500 Mile e-upgrades /UDU; your last 12 months' Elite Qualifying Dollar spend on AA. See FAQ: Earning EQD / Elite Qualifying Dollars on AA and partner airlines (2017 on) (EQD will include the EQD offset one might earn from spend on their Barclaycard Aviator Red or Silver card, as announced elsewhere in this forum.)
Date of request has no bearing on upgrade priority other than after all other priorities have been met and there’s a highly unlikely tie.
From AA.com... "Before you get to the airport, requests for systemwide and mileage award upgrades are processed independently from 500-mile upgrade requests.
At the airport, upgrades requested will be prioritized in this order:
- Status tier
[^]Rolling 12 month EQD - Systemwide and mileage + copay upgrades
- 500-mile upgrades on purchased tickets
- 500-mile upgrades on award tickets"
Systemwide Upgrade FAQ:
Q. What are Systemwide Upgrades, exactly?
Electronic Systemwide Upgrades, abbreviated SWU, also previously referred to as eVIPs or VIPs, are electronic instruments earned as stated previously. SWU generally allow the owner to upgrade up to three segments, more or less in the same direction, on any flights AA flies with their own aircraft (not valid on partners or codeshares - must be marketed and operated by AA), on most paid, published fares to the next class of service. (Successful upgrades on a single SWU include EZE-MIA-JFK-LHR, NRT-LAX-DFW-LHR.)
Q. When do SWU clear?
Upgrades can clear immediately if the appropriate inventory is available (e.g., Coach to Business (and domestic First on two class aircraft) requires "C" class to be available, Business to First requires "A" class to be available). Otherwise, SWU may be waitlisted in priority of AAdvantage status, followed by last 12 months EQD spend (and within those, by fare class if they are full fare Y). SWU and EXP UDU have the same priority once the flight and associated upgrade / PALL list has passed to airport control.
Q. Can I use SWU on codeshares operated by AA?
No. (Though 001 AA ticketing is not a requirement), the flight must be marketed and operated by AA.
Q. Are any fare classes ineligible / invalid for SWU upgrades?
Some government and consolidator fares may not be upgraded; Basic Economy flights may not be upgraded. Award flights may not be upgraded with SWU. See post #683 by JonNYC:
[quote]Invalid (for SWU upgrade)
- Basic Economy tickets, regardless of status level
- Military fares*
- Government fares*
- Agency/industry discounts
- Employee travel booked in E
- AAdvantage/promotion free or companion tickets
- Ticket designators that require a certificate (CEN20, etc.) - contact MSD to verify
- MSD Site products (ticket designator SITE)
- CAT25/CAT25 Group Fares for MCLA
- Charter flights
- Infant tickets
- Purchased extra seats (one passenger)
- Opaque fares
- Award tickets
Can I still make use if my SWU and credit the flight(s) to another airline?
You are not supposed to. If switching from AAdvantage to another scheme's FFN, please be aware: Benefitting from a privilege granted for your AAdvantage status and changing your FFN to earn on another airline is generally prohibited by AAdvantage Terms and Conditions. Doing so might risk that benefit (e.g. upgrade).
From the AAdvantage Terms and Conditions (link)
Q. Can I see SWU eligible flights on aa.com? If not, where?
aa.com will also reflect if a SWU can be used as you book - not that there is availability. One can see required inventory (A or C) using ExpertFlyer or other tools.
Q. What is the priority order for SWU wait list clearing?
Priority for wait listing is based first on AAdvantage status of requestor, then by rolling EQD earning during las 12 months; within those criteria, full fare (J or Y) trumps discounted fares.
NOTE: once the booking goes to airport control you may have to request your SWU request be reactivated. Those travel companions previously prioritized by the sponsor's status no longer revert to their own status at airport control.
Q. How do I know if my SWU request has been waitlisted?
You can see it online only 2-3 days prior to your depature. It will say "Systemwide Upgrade Requested". Otherwise, there is no way to know unless you call AA again and ask. In AA app you can see upgrade waiting list from 4 hours prior to the departure. Thank you (link) MrJBoy for clarifying).
If my SWU clears on AA but the flights is cancelled or delayed, and I get put on another AA or partner flight, will my Upgrade be preserved / honored?
On AA and Joint Business Venture partners (AY, BA, IB, JL, QF), AA will attempt to honor the upgrade. On other airline partners it is unlikely.
Q. Can I gift SWUs to others, and will my or their status apply?
You may certainly gift SWU to others. They will have to provide you their information, including PNR, and you will have to call it in. Your status can carry over to one treeling companion (on your itinerary) until the SWU passes to airport control; otherwise, SWU priority will depend on the user's AAdvantage status followed by date of upgrade request.
Q. What if I apply a SWU to a traveling companion?
That traveling companion "borrows" your status in terms of priority on the upgrade waitlist until the waitlisted passes to airport control.
Q. Can I sell or purchase SWUs to / from others (e.g. on eBay or CraigsList)?
While SWU may be gifted to others, AAdvantage rules prohibit selling / purchasing, trading or bartering various instruments, including SWU. A sold SWU will, if caught by AA Corporate Security AAdvantage Fraud (and they actively seek these out), cause SWU / upgrade cancellation at minimum and may even include closing the seller's account with forfeiture of miles, upgrade instruments and even elite status.
Further useful details about using SWU
. . . . ● Four SWUs are earned by Executive Platinum AAdvantage members when they cross the threshold to EXP, and their expiration is essentially the same as the earned status - January 31 of the ensuing status year (e.g. earn May 5 2017, the status and SWUs are good through 31 Jan 2019).
. . . . ● Two SWUs are earned by Executive Platinum AAdvantage members when they cross the 150,000 and 200,000 EQ EQ Miles; their expiration is essentially the same as the earned status as described above. (Further increments of 50,000 EQM past 200,000 earn no more SWU.)
. . . . ● Two SWUs (more) are earned by Concierge Key members.
. . . . ● Four SWUs are earned by those crossing Million Miler thresholds of 2MM and every Million Miles milestone thereafter.
. . . . ● SWUs may be transferred or gifted (not bargained, bartered or sold) to anyone the owner chooses - the owner must authorize the transfer and provide at minimum the designated person's name, frequent flyer #, and PNR. Note fees and taxes may be due, such as APD / Air Passenger Duty due for flights originating in the UK (or with connections exceeding 23:59).
. . . . ● AA tends to protect passengers granted upgrades with SWUs if IROPS move them to other oneworld flights, particularly JBV partners (AA, AY, BA, IB, JL, preserving already granted upgrades (not waitlisted).
. . . . ● N.B. AA will no longer attach expiring (31 Jan 2017 or -18) SWUs to be attached to existing upgrade inventory 1 Feb and after unless one is a very high value customer; AA now has software in place to prevent this, but if you consider yourself a high value customer, you can ask. Speculatively, EXP through 31 Jan 2018 with Concierge Key and / or 4 or 5 Helix / "Eagles" rating and lots of D and above revenue. See FAQ: New changes 90%+ eliminate post-expiration SWU use (Jun 2014)
. . . . ● If you don't want to wait list your SWU so that it automatically encumbered when a domestic segment becomes available for upgrade, but only want the domestic segments to clear if the international segment clears, ask the AA EP agent to waitlist the international portion but "DSR" the domestic segments; that way, the domestic segments will only clear if the international segment clears.
. . . . ● SWU application can include co-terminals: JonNYC, post #601: "This is the current list of MAC airports, and, as far as I understand it, are generally recognized for revenue tickets including SWU application to same:
- WAS (DCA, IAD)
- DFW (DFW, DAL)
- HOU (HOU, IAH)
- NYC (JFK, LGA) (I think there is a separate rule that says EWR is always part of NYC for this purpose as well)
- LON (LGW, LHR, STN)
- SLU (UVF, SLU)
- TYO (HND, NRT)"
. . . . ● Through (two flights with the same flight number, or through flights with stops) flights pose challenges insofar as upgrade availability must exist on all sectors. You may have to call AA to use a SWU on through flights.
Suggested reading:
aa.com: SYSTEMWIDE UPGRADES AND FAQS
FlyerTalk: Upgrades / SWUs / eVIPs and UK APD / Air Passenger Duty questions
New *internal* changes will 90%+ eliminate post-expiration use of SWUs by JonNYC
This post in the thread entitled "Reversing Use of SWU. Is this possible?" (it is not. AA no longer allows cancelling a SWU and substituting "stickers".)
aa.com: SYSTEMWIDE UPGRADES AND FAQS
FlyerTalk: Upgrades / SWUs / eVIPs and UK APD / Air Passenger Duty questions
New *internal* changes will 90%+ eliminate post-expiration use of SWUs by JonNYC
This post in the thread entitled "Reversing Use of SWU. Is this possible?" (it is not. AA no longer allows cancelling a SWU and substituting "stickers".)
Updated 30 Aug 2017 - JDiver
MODERATOR NOTE
Posts prior to 2016 may be read here: ARCHIVE: SWU / VIP / eVIP Systemwide Upgrade questions
NOTE: This thread is for the discussion of the mechanics of AA systemwide upgrades. For "chance of upgrade clearing" questions, please use this thread: 2015 Chances of Upgrade Clearing and Upgrade Availability Discussion (consolidated)
Please note there is a separate thread discussing lost / missing/ misappropriated SWUs:
Missing / someone else used / unauthorized use my SWU / VIP / eVIP (merged)
American AAdvantage Forum Moderator Team
Posts prior to 2016 may be read here: ARCHIVE: SWU / VIP / eVIP Systemwide Upgrade questions
NOTE: This thread is for the discussion of the mechanics of AA systemwide upgrades. For "chance of upgrade clearing" questions, please use this thread: 2015 Chances of Upgrade Clearing and Upgrade Availability Discussion (consolidated)
Please note there is a separate thread discussing lost / missing/ misappropriated SWUs:
Missing / someone else used / unauthorized use my SWU / VIP / eVIP (merged)
American AAdvantage Forum Moderator Team
FAQ: Internal IT changes eliminate 90+% of post-expiry SWU use 26 Jun 2014
Q. I've been able to encumber expiring SWU past their expiration date if I find the proper upgrade inventory available prior to that date. Is this feature still available to Executive Platinum members?A. Not for most. The option was possible due to software limitations. New software, AAcoRN, put into place 26 June 2014, will prevent this from occurring for "unqualified" members; only "qualified" members will be allowed to encumber SWU past their expiry date in the future. (See post #1)
Q. How do I know if I am a "qualified" member?
A. You can try to call and encumber expiring SWU past their expiry. If you are not allowed to, you aren't.
Q. So, exactly who does AA consider "qualified"?
A. A very high value AAdvantage member, as measured by the internal "Helix" system, which assigns an "Eagles" ranking from 1 to 5 (the more, the better).
Q. I've never heard of this. When did it start?
A. AA's rating system was originally based on three colors, green, yellow and red, which changed to 1-3 Eagles and was later expanded to 1-5 Eagles.
Q. How are Eagles scores assigned? Are they static, or do they change?
A. It has been said spend and fare classes (think lots of annual travel in fare classes of D and above) may affect your Eagles score, as well as OSO and negative incidents you have experienced that might result in your moving your custom to another airline. It is also said your Helix score is updated periodically, perhaps even nightly.
Q. How can I find out my Helix score / how many Eagles I have?
A. You can't. AA employees are not empowered to discuss the Helix system with customers. If you normally get extra SWU once you've made EP, are allowed to extend SWU use and find EP desk agents are willing to bend rules for you often, speculative, you might have 4-5 Eagles rating.
Q. So, this is a hidden tier higher than Executive Platinum?
A. No, because it doesn't give you privileges beyond EP beyond those mentioned, e.g. courtesy Club membership or additional priority for boarding or upgrades, like Concierge Key may.
Q. Do others than Executive Platinum have Helix / Eagles scores?
A. It can be safely assumed all AAdvantage members have such scores.
For further information, see discussions on:
JonNYC's Traveing Better
The Boarding Area
Thanks to JonNYC for most of the information available to the public on this topic.
Updated 6 Oct 2016 - JDiver
ARCHIVE: 2017 FAQ: What's a Systemwide Upgrade / SWU / eVIP / VIP? master thread
Feb 10, 2017, 12:16 pm
#136
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2014
Programs: Top Tier with all 3 alliances
Posts: 11,663
Also, who knows what the upgrade priority will be in Oct (EQDs? time of booking?) or what may happen with retrofitting the 77w with PE, probably not by then though.
Feb 10, 2017, 12:38 pm
#138
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2014
Programs: Top Tier with all 3 alliances
Posts: 11,663
If low EQDs, he could chance it on the PHL-VCE route, which is less likely to have EXPs waitlisted (I assume the OP is EXP; If not EXP, he should probably resign to MCE via LAX).
Last edited by nk15; Feb 10, 2017 at 12:55 pm
Feb 10, 2017, 12:48 pm
#139
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 2,384
As a data point, I booked PHL-MAD on A330, 1 month prior to Christmas, for a flight a week prior to Christmas. Option was DFW-MAD on 789.
PHL-MAD I cleared as number 2 at the gate. No more cleared after that. I was monitoring DFW-MAD. That same day flight cleared 1. With a larger J cabin. So definitely if low on the pecking order (I was due to short time of booking), odds are better on lower J demand flights.
PHL-MAD I cleared as number 2 at the gate. No more cleared after that. I was monitoring DFW-MAD. That same day flight cleared 1. With a larger J cabin. So definitely if low on the pecking order (I was due to short time of booking), odds are better on lower J demand flights.
Feb 10, 2017, 2:56 pm
#140
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: TPA/DFW/K15
Programs: AA EXP, Mar AMB, HH LT DIA
Posts: 1,650
I had a similar situation last week I had 1/12 remaining SWU expiring 2/28/17 and 8/8 expiring 1/31/18, a total of 9 available. I called AA to confirm r/t SWU business to first on JFK-SFO for travel in March. I now have 0/12 expiring 2/28/17 and 7/8 expiring 1/31/18, new total of 7 available. Despite my previous understanding, they still applied a SWU to my flight beyond its expiry date of 2/28/17... Not that I'm complaing.
I totally forgot about the fuzzy SWU math which before booking had me at 3/12 expiring on 2.28.17 and 8/8 expiring 1.31.18. After the transaction was complete, I now have 0/12 & 7/8 in my account. The tickets I purchased were for July!
Feb 10, 2017, 2:59 pm
#141
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Yellow Springs
Programs: AS 75k
Posts: 1,523
+1 although I just flew LAX-LHR and return last week and the loads in J and Y were light. I had booked 2-3 weeks prior and the SWU upgrades came through before T-48. I'm pretty sure everyone on the waitlists cleared and on the return, it looked as if 1/3 of the J cabin was empty!
Feb 10, 2017, 6:21 pm
#142
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SFO
Programs: AA Plat, IHG Plat, HH Diamond, Hyatt Plat, Hertz Gold
Posts: 1,933
Just as a warning, there were reports earlier this year about the system automatically pulling expiring SWU first (as expected) even for travel beyond expiry, but then an audit catching it and pulling new SWU that are valid during date of travel. No idea if that's new implementation of old policy or one-off exceptions, but be aware that it may happen.
Feb 10, 2017, 11:23 pm
#143
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: SFO/STS
Programs: AA EXP, HH Diamond
Posts: 396
Looking at traveling to Venice later this year. One option is the A330 from PHL direct or the 773 from LAX with a connection in LHR. The LHR flight is less expensive but if the SWU odds are substantially less, then that's a factor (I read somewhere here that this route is one of the hardest to get upgrades on). However, the MCE section on the 773 is far better than the non-existent MCE on the A330 if the upgrade doesn't happen.
Any opinions from the SWU veterans?
Any opinions from the SWU veterans?
Feb 11, 2017, 8:18 am
#144
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: NYC
Programs: AA EXP (4 MM)
Posts: 15
Just as a warning, there were reports earlier this year about the system automatically pulling expiring SWU first (as expected) even for travel beyond expiry, but then an audit catching it and pulling new SWU that are valid during date of travel. No idea if that's new implementation of old policy or one-off exceptions, but be aware that it may happen.
Feb 11, 2017, 8:22 am
#145
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: NYC
Programs: AA EXP (4 MM)
Posts: 15
So... Now T72 out from DFW-GRU (787-9) with SWU request made in October... Although J7, R7, D7, I0 and seat map showing 16/30, no upgrade yet... So weird.
Feb 11, 2017, 8:59 am
#146
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 51
Are you sure it is cheaper? Are you considering the taxes that are imposed when flying into LHR? I believe the tax on an SWU is over $500 for the "premium class". I seem to remember being quotes this a year or two ago but have no real experience so I'll defer to others wo take the route regularly.
Feb 11, 2017, 9:18 am
#147
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 57
Thanks for everyone's feedback. What's the opinion on DFW-LHR-DFW? Same business demand as LAX-LHR or more towards the leisure mix. I'm guessing the former since they've put a 77W on the route.
How does the new dfw-cdg route look on the 789? That gives the opportunity for non-SWU upgrades to Econ plus as a backup.
It's a hard call. EF shows literally an empty or nearly empty J cabin on oct 4 lax-lhr and oct 16 lhr-lax but the same dates for phl-vce and vce-phl are already at least half booked.
If it was me I'd just book a j class flight and pay for it. But this is for four and the all up cost would be substantial. The lack of availability coupled with the wide variety of product variation makes this a maddening exercise. But you already knew that!
Feb 11, 2017, 1:47 pm
#148
Join Date: May 2007
Location: MCI/ORD/CDG
Programs: AA Exec Plat, Marriott Lifetime Titanium
Posts: 771
I have LIS-LHR-PHL flights coming up. LIS-LHR on BA and LHR-PHL on AA. I am SWU waitlisted on LHR-PHL. If it clears, will it be subject to the wonderful premium cabin tax?
I'm only connecting in LHR. All flights in same PNR.
I'm only connecting in LHR. All flights in same PNR.
Last edited by BlindPilot; Feb 11, 2017 at 1:56 pm
Feb 11, 2017, 1:57 pm
#149
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: TPA/DFW/K15
Programs: AA EXP, Mar AMB, HH LT DIA
Posts: 1,650
Just as a warning, there were reports earlier this year about the system automatically pulling expiring SWU first (as expected) even for travel beyond expiry, but then an audit catching it and pulling new SWU that are valid during date of travel. No idea if that's new implementation of old policy or one-off exceptions, but be aware that it may happen.
My trailing EQD's is close to $30K. I don't know if this is relevant, or a datapoint in SWU being granted where otherwise not available.
Feb 11, 2017, 1:58 pm
#150
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: DEN
Programs: AA EXP, AA Million Miles, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 2,585
If both of these are yes, then no you are not subject to APD.