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Speculation: New American AAdvantage FF Program Features (Discussion)

Speculation: New American AAdvantage FF Program Features (Discussion)

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Old Dec 1, 14, 10:53 pm   -   Wikipost
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What’s next

We plan to bring current Dividend Miles accounts into the AAdvantage program in 2015
(date as yet unspecified - JD). That means we will combine your award mileage balances, your Million Miler™ balances, and your elite-qualifying activity from both programs. In the meantime, continue to book travel and earn miles as you normally would. We will follow up with you when we begin the process of integrating accounts, but rest assured your miles and elite status are safe as we work to combine the two programs.

It will take some time to fully integrate our loyalty programs, including everything from the systems that support them to bringing our terms and conditions in line with one another. We will be sure to keep you updated as changes occur
.
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Old Jul 22, 14, 4:15 am
  #871  
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Originally Posted by Fanjet View Post
But didn't DL recently announce that their 77Ls are going to have fewer J seats in lieu of more Y seats? So obvioulsy more Y is the direction most airlines are heading towards.
Less J and more Y is DL's 777 and 77L plan but it looks like they're sticking with 3-3-3 in coach for now.
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Old Jul 22, 14, 8:11 am
  #872  
 
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Originally Posted by Shareholder View Post
And those same 777s have 1-2-1 in business class while UA's 777s for most of the fleet have 2-4-2! And the rest have 2-2-2. So which would you prefer to fly? Plus AA elites have access to the greyer pitch 3-3-3 seats.
I agree AA's 77W's have the best business seats of their main competitors. It is my favorite of all the business seats I have sat in. In MCE, the 77W is on par with UA and DL extra legroom seats. However, in regular Y, AA's 77W trails other airlines with 9-accross. Interesting the 77W would have the best business seats and the worst regular coach seats.
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Old Jul 23, 14, 11:25 am
  #873  
 
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Waiting for the merged program is bad enough, but I have resigned myself to it. But what makes it worse is the uncertainty.

Has there been any indication of when the merged plan features for next year will be announced? I have been planning travel to meet the CP/ExPlat level for this year, but have no idea what I will get when next year kicks in.

My apologies if this has already been answered . . . I have been following this thread since its inception, but have not necessarily seen everything posted to date.
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Old Jul 23, 14, 11:57 am
  #874  
 
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Originally Posted by PhoenixCMC View Post
Waiting for the merged program is bad enough, but I have resigned myself to it. But what makes it worse is the uncertainty.

Has there been any indication of when the merged plan features for next year will be announced? I have been planning travel to meet the CP/ExPlat level for this year, but have no idea what I will get when next year kicks in.

My apologies if this has already been answered . . . I have been following this thread since its inception, but have not necessarily seen everything posted to date.
I don't understand why people keep obsessing over this?? It is not a big deal. It is almost a certainty that the new program will eventually be a spend based program for both elite status and mileage accrual. This is what their two largest competitors are doing and AA will do the same thing. No way that the program will be anywhere NEAR as rich as AAs has been and frankly it shouldn't be.
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Old Jul 25, 14, 3:12 pm
  #875  
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Originally Posted by PhoenixCMC View Post
Waiting for the merged program is bad enough, but I have resigned myself to it. But what makes it worse is the uncertainty.

Has there been any indication of when the merged plan features for next year will be announced? I have been planning travel to meet the CP/ExPlat level for this year, but have no idea what I will get when next year kicks in.

My apologies if this has already been answered . . . I have been following this thread since its inception, but have not necessarily seen everything posted to date.
You can be pretty sure when that date is announced it will be reflected in the wiki - as will a link to the new thread dealing with the new AAdvantage FFP's features (as opposed to this thread, which is largely speculative in nature) when the features and Rules are announced.

All AA and US have announced is that the FFPs will merge "in 2015".
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Old Jul 25, 14, 3:45 pm
  #876  
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Maybe I'm completing a circle. I've been flying AA since the 1940s, as well as a number of other airlines (most of which no longer exist), and consolidated my status to AA after some years of split second tier status with AA and CO; I had a lot of miles with TW Aviators, assimilated into AAdvantage during that merger. I travelled for business and leisure.

I retired this year. The new merged FFP details will be the crux of an important decision for me, both in determining if I pursue further years of Executive Platinum status as well as my future relationship to the new AA / AAdvantage.

If the new FFP is revenue based, has four status tiers with higher requirements for Emerald, holds lifetime Platinum as second tier rather than third, I'm flying the most convenient and reasonable airline for my destination (and that will apply to AA as well).

In that case, I'll also drop my Club membership (I'll access lounges via class of service, AMEX lounges or Priority Pass); I'll become a net spender of miles rather than a net earner; I'll forget about earning further AAdvantage status beyond my lifetime position, and may even seek and maintain status on Alaska.

Loyalty goes both ways. Or, perhaps it should.
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Old Jul 26, 14, 11:30 am
  #877  
 
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Originally Posted by JDiver View Post
Maybe I'm completing a circle. I've been flying AA since the 1940s, as well as a number of other airlines (most of which no longer exist), and consolidated my status to AA after some years of split second tier status with AA and CO; I had a lot of miles with TW Aviators, assimilated into AAdvantage during that merger. I travelled for business and leisure.

I retired this year. The new merged FFP details will be the crux of an important decision for me, both in determining if I pursue further years of Executive Platinum status as well as my future relationship to the new AA / AAdvantage.

If the new FFP is revenue based, has four status tiers with higher requirements for Emerald, holds lifetime Platinum as second tier rather than third, I'm flying the most convenient and reasonable airline for my destination (and that will apply to AA as well).

In that case, I'll also drop my Club membership (I'll access lounges via class of service, AMEX lounges or Priority Pass); I'll become a net spender of miles rather than a net earner; I'll forget about earning further AAdvantage status beyond my lifetime position, and may even seek and maintain status on Alaska.

Loyalty goes both ways. Or, perhaps it should.
JDiver,

That was a very sad post. For a lot of FT'ers like me, you epitomize AA and AAdvantage. 99% of what I know about the AAdvantage program comes from you (via your posts) and FT.

I know that those of us that had wished for Horton to stay on have lost our battle and thus I don't think of it anymore. For a rare time, there was an airline CEO that actually cared about the customer experience. I do NOT believe that there will ever again be an airline CEO that gives two hoots about the customer experience.

Whether it was intended or not, we have moved to a "no-choice" monopolistic airline structure in the United States. The "record" profits come on the backs of ever rising fares (far faster than inflation) and a record number of "fortress hubs" in the US that have effectively no competition. I live in DFW and AA dominates it so thoroughly that even Virgin America had to move away. Well, guess what happened? (Hint: go and check RT DFW-SFO fares before Oct and then after Oct 25)

Doug Parker certainly has his defenders on this board. He will certainly make the shareholders of AMR very happy (atleast for the short term). However, a GREAT CEO should always know that she/he stands on the happiness/satisfaction of three equal legs: SHAREHOLDERS, CUSTOMERS, EMPLOYEES. If you don't balance between the three, you will always have issues

AA is now well on its way to being an airline where loyalty is of no importance. I feel that Doug Parker believes that with no effective choice is his "fortress hubs", where else can we go.

He is right as far as today is concerned. As I am based in DFW, I have no choice but to use AA if I want to travel non stop anywhere. So no matter how much he devalues the product, or the FF program or raises fares, for a while I will be stuck with AA

However, the beauty of the Free Market system is that choice eventually does arise. For the first time this year, I am going to make my business trips to Asia/India on airlines OTHER than AA. I am traveling on Qatar and later in the year on Etihad, instead of always taking AA to LHR

JDiver, even if Doug Parker does not care about your loyalty, on behalf of those of us that are loyal AA fliers/employees, I thank you for all that you have done on behalf of AA.

Doug may not realize it but the FT board is probably the NUMBER ONE customer service tool for AA. It solves more issues that AA's general help desk ever does

Cheers and may the airways always be smooth for you...

Panjabi

Last edited by panjabi; Jul 26, 14 at 12:24 pm
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Old Jul 26, 14, 12:16 pm
  #878  
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When I switched back to AA a year ago next week, I had some serious thought about going for BA Silver instead. I would have lost the ability to upgrade, but still would have gotten double RDM on AA and AC access. And the 600 Tier points would have taken about the same amount of effort as the 10k EQP for my Platinum challenge, albeit with a December flight to Europe on BA to get the 4 BA segments instead of a few more YUPs on AA.

My main fear was, however, that somehow AA would restrict OW Sapphire from getting MCE at ticketing. That's pretty much all I care about... I've spent the last 20 years of business travel trying to get either 34" of pitch on an aisle, or 32" of pitch with nobody sitting next to me. I can do four hours of ORD-SFO that way in coach, everything else is just gravy.

It turned out that I made the right decision to go with AA Plat, as at the beginning of this year my job responsibilities changed to a lot of west coast flying and I'll somehow make EXP. That's probably a one-year event, however.

I'm experimenting later this summer with flying BA WT+. I have a feeling it's basically the same as the original J flights I took on United back in 1992. If I like it, then if status on AA goes spend-based for status in the vein of WN, I'll probably switch to BA to earn OW Sapphire each year, and augment that with paying for Economy Comfort on DL from time to time as a nobody. Spend based for RDM, I actually average about $0.14/mile right now for most work trips, so I can't bring myself to care.
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Old Jul 26, 14, 1:35 pm
  #879  
 
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Originally Posted by ElmhurstNick View Post
When I switched back to AA a year ago next week, I had some serious thought about going for BA Silver instead. I would have lost the ability to upgrade, but still would have gotten double RDM on AA and AC access. And the 600 Tier points would have taken about the same amount of effort as the 10k EQP for my Platinum challenge, albeit with a December flight to Europe on BA to get the 4 BA segments instead of a few more YUPs on AA.

My main fear was, however, that somehow AA would restrict OW Sapphire from getting MCE at ticketing. That's pretty much all I care about... I've spent the last 20 years of business travel trying to get either 34" of pitch on an aisle, or 32" of pitch with nobody sitting next to me. I can do four hours of ORD-SFO that way in coach, everything else is just gravy.

It turned out that I made the right decision to go with AA Plat, as at the beginning of this year my job responsibilities changed to a lot of west coast flying and I'll somehow make EXP. That's probably a one-year event, however.

I'm experimenting later this summer with flying BA WT+. I have a feeling it's basically the same as the original J flights I took on United back in 1992. If I like it, then if status on AA goes spend-based for status in the vein of WN, I'll probably switch to BA to earn OW Sapphire each year, and augment that with paying for Economy Comfort on DL from time to time as a nobody. Spend based for RDM, I actually average about $0.14/mile right now for most work trips, so I can't bring myself to care.
I switched back to BAEC last year myself (where I was pre AA).
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Old Jul 26, 14, 6:28 pm
  #880  
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Originally Posted by panjabi View Post
...Doug may not realize it but the FT board is probably the NUMBER ONE customer service tool for AA. It solves more issues that AA's general help desk ever does..
There's no "may" about it (although I realize that was probably a rhetorical "may") and agree that FT -should- be used/monitored/engaged more, but, even well before this merger, FT was largely written off-- for both valid and invalid reasons-- and resources put elsewhere (milepoint for a while-- a complete and total waste of time/resources-- and then even dumber projects.).

AA's social media strategy, IMO, is a complete shambles after a brief promising period not long ago. And that sure 'aint about to improve vis-à-vis flyertalk in the immediate future. It has very little to do with Parker/merger, FT was abandoned long before that.
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Old Jul 26, 14, 6:59 pm
  #881  
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Originally Posted by panjabi View Post
JDiver .... For a lot of FT'ers like me, you epitomize AA and AAdvantage....
Could not agree more. JDiver is a gentleman of the old school, apart from being a fountain of knowledge that we are all privileged to drink from..

Originally Posted by panjabi View Post
....As I am based in DFW, I have no choice but to use AA if I want to travel non stop anywhere. So no matter how much he devalues the product, or the FF program or raises fares, for a while I will be stuck with AA...
Er, not quite. For the inconvenience of a connection, you can always vote with your feet and fly someone else. If enough of you do that, surely Doug Parker and his minions will notice.

Your ex-wife may have been the best wife you would ever have, but there is no point in telling her that after she has left you
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Old Jul 26, 14, 9:39 pm
  #882  
 
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Originally Posted by KopiKosong View Post

<snip>
Er, not quite. For the inconvenience of a connection, you can always vote with your feet and fly someone else. If enough of you do that, surely Doug Parker and his minions will notice.

Your ex-wife may have been the best wife you would ever have, but there is no point in telling her that after she has left you
I do agree with you. That is broadly what I am saying. If the AAdvantage program is devalued significantly (as seems to the consensus on this thread), some of y'all may be able to jump ship very quickly. If you are in SFO or LAX or ORD or JFK/LGA, you do have choices

What I said was that "for a while" I (being in DFW) won't have a choice. Currently DFW is so thoroughly dominated by AA, that one effectively has no choice. It is not that I am just opposed to a connection. It is the fact that no realistic option to AA exists in DFW. Part of what has made DFW great for a lot of domestic travelers is that we can do DAY trips to most continental destinations. I routinely fly to LAX, SFO, MIA, NYC, ORD on day trips where I leave anywhere from 6-8 AM in the morning, have a productive full business day at my destination and make it back home by 9 -11:30 PM

With a connection, that is not doable. Even a simple trip to CLE (just over 2 hours non stop, one way, via AA) becomes a 5-7 hour trip with United or Delta or Frontier. That kills the "day trip" portion and entails me spending a night in a hotel, that I don't have to spend with AA.

Love Field is not an option in most cases, as it takes me an hour longer to get there and (due to the limited number of gates) it has far fewer direct flights nationwide than AA. Also, as an aside, SWA has an even crappier FF program

As, I mentioned in my post, the beauty of a genuine free market system (and not a "crony" and "lobbyist" free market system) is that eventually competition will arise.

For DFW, it may be a few years before we get that competition. I had high hopes for Virgin America, but they got scared of big daddy AA and ran away to Love Field

I do remain hopeful and optimistic that a "new way" will emerge...soon
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Old Jul 27, 14, 5:09 pm
  #883  
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FF programs are becoming devalued. Airlines will continue to fall over each other to attract the premium paid transcon and International/Long haul flyer. But for the mostly domestic business flyer or heavy leisure flyer the days of glory are fleeting fast. This is what happens when competition is reduced to several large providers. If there are any new entrants, probably unlikely, they will likely be of the Spirit and now Frontier genre.
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Old Jul 27, 14, 7:13 pm
  #884  
 
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Originally Posted by panjabi View Post
For DFW, it may be a few years before we get that competition. I had high hopes for Virgin America, but they got scared of big daddy AA and ran away to Love Field
I don't think I agree. Virgin saw a unique opportunity to differentiate and serve Love Field instead of DFW, which is more convenient to all of Dallas and probably most of the population of the Metroplex than DFW (especially the affluent and Downtown/Uptown).

Even though DAL is closer and more convenient for me, I'll continue to stick with AA out of DFW. DAL is constrained and will only serve a few domestic destinations even when the Wright Amendment is fully lifted.
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Old Jul 27, 14, 8:08 pm
  #885  
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Originally Posted by panjabi View Post
Love Field is not an option in most cases, as it takes me an hour longer to get there and (due to the limited number of gates) it has far fewer direct flights nationwide than AA. Also, as an aside, SWA has an even crappier FF program
As opposed to VX's, which is also revenue-based on earn and burn?

You're not going to see new competitors come up with a distance-based program again, not when they can just push the easy button and do revenue-based. It's just never going to be 1983 again. Oh well.

Originally Posted by newyorkgeorge View Post
FF programs are becoming devalued. Airlines will continue to fall over each other to attract the premium paid transcon and International/Long haul flyer. But for the mostly domestic business flyer or heavy leisure flyer the days of glory are fleeting fast. This is what happens when competition is reduced to several large providers. If there are any new entrants, probably unlikely, they will likely be of the Spirit and now Frontier genre.
Well, bankruptcy and the tremendous amount of capital destruction in the airline industry through Kilkenny cats-style competition has a bit to do with "being reduced to several large providers". I don't think that a business model that's predicated on every so often demoralizing employees through pay cuts, pension cuts, broken contracts is particularly one that's worthy of celebrating as the ideal of competition.

Originally Posted by aamilesslave View Post
I don't think I agree. Virgin saw a unique opportunity to differentiate and serve Love Field instead of DFW, which is more convenient to all of Dallas and probably most of the population of the Metroplex than DFW (especially the affluent and Downtown/Uptown).
Agreed, not to mention the fact that VX isn't just targeting AA.
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