Emotional Support Animals. Are you kidding me? A rant.
#91
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: SJC
Posts: 214
I actually have an emotional support animal, and though I have not taken her on any flights yet I have taken her to crowded weekend long events for over 3 years. She is always bathed and teeth brushed and everybody loves her. I do have medication and the proper documentation for her.
Entire post
Entire post
I am not disputing the fact that some people need and should have emotional support dogs. One of the retired guide dogs I raised now works as a therapy dog with kids with speach issue, but that dog is more qualified as a therapy dog & not emotional support dog. Mr. Cynnamin used to work with a guy who had a son with Aspergers syndrome, and he would usually bring his son to the office when Mr. Cynnamin brought our retired guide dog to the office. The 11 year old visibally relaxed around the dog, so I have seen "emotional support dog" in action. My main issue with emotional support dogs is the people who knowingly abuse this privilege and make it difficult for actual working service dogs to access public facilities.
Last edited by Cynnamin; Nov 20, 2008 at 4:02 pm
#92
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Seattle, WA
Programs: Mucci Diamond Hairbrush Elite, AA Plat, BA Blue, and a host of others.
Posts: 364
After reading the posts in this thread my thoughts and attitudes have changed a bit on this topic.
I now better understand the need for emotional support animals (ESA). This thread has promted me to do a little internet research on service animals so I also now think that more than ever ANY service animal needs to go through proper service animal training. Those that use service animals should get the proper education on keeping a service animal. From the posts of those who have taken these steps I would imagine that if all service animals were trained and kept properly we would probably not even give them a second thought.
The posts from those who legitimately use ESA show that these posters, at least, are mindefull of those around them and the effect their animal may have on others.
I do still think that there are those who are using the ESA rules to selfishly get their way so that they can bring common pets with them. As with anything there are those who abuse. This thread has helped me to not lump all ESA users in that group.
The FA on the OP's flight still could have handled the situation better. On that my opinion has not changed.
I now better understand the need for emotional support animals (ESA). This thread has promted me to do a little internet research on service animals so I also now think that more than ever ANY service animal needs to go through proper service animal training. Those that use service animals should get the proper education on keeping a service animal. From the posts of those who have taken these steps I would imagine that if all service animals were trained and kept properly we would probably not even give them a second thought.
The posts from those who legitimately use ESA show that these posters, at least, are mindefull of those around them and the effect their animal may have on others.
I do still think that there are those who are using the ESA rules to selfishly get their way so that they can bring common pets with them. As with anything there are those who abuse. This thread has helped me to not lump all ESA users in that group.
The FA on the OP's flight still could have handled the situation better. On that my opinion has not changed.
#93
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 77
To the OP. you got a bad attitude. Take an allergy pill. I too have lots of allergies. If you got it that bad , BRING MEDICATION.
You say they they were show dogs. How can you tell? Just because the owners were considerate enough to get them groomed before the trip.
People that complain about clean well behaved dogs, these are not happy people. What else is lacking in your life.
You say they they were show dogs. How can you tell? Just because the owners were considerate enough to get them groomed before the trip.
People that complain about clean well behaved dogs, these are not happy people. What else is lacking in your life.
A lot of people have allergies to a lot of different things that are encountered in everyday life that they don't have any control of (fabric types, perfume, soap, dander, pollen, etc.) I have a friend who takes medication daily due to severe allergies. OP carries medication for his allergies... so all he had to do was take them.
Life is short. There's a lot worse things to worry about in the world (endless war , bad economy ) than show dogs... sorry, emotional support dogs... being on a flight uncaged.
#94
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: SNA and BNA depending on work and time of year
Programs: UA Silver/ AA EXP/Hyatt Globalist/Marriott Lifetime Titanium/Hilton Diamond
Posts: 2,189
I will admit that I've slept since then, but I can recall a thread in the US forum about a small horse on the flight as a service animal. One thing I remember is people on board talking about the smell. You might find it in search, but it was pre-merger US Airways so I don't know. I just remember thinking Oy. lol
#95
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: DC Metro (WAS--DCA/IAD/BWI)
Programs: AA Plat 2MM, OW Sapphire, QF Bronze, Marriott Silver, Starwood Gold; National Emerald
Posts: 2,533
Here are AA's policies on Service Animals, and specifically Emotional Support Animals.
http://www.aa.com/aa/pubcontent/en_U...iceAnimals.jsp
I believe we have found a big motivating factor for some passengers to lie about their pets being "emotional support animals"--waived pet fee.
According to AA's policy, it is not a judgement call at the time of embarkation as to the credibility of an animal qualifying as an emotional support animal. In that case it must be documented.
Only service animals (like seeing eye dogs), where the evidence of their training is so obvious as to not require documentation, can skate through the gate without documentation (which I'm sure that the owner has available on him anyways).
The dog shown in the photograph appeared to be "too large" and should have been put in a kennel in the cargo bay.
While most/all seeing eye dogs are also that large, they are sufficiently trained that I would never question their presence in the cabin.
We are looking at the untrained pet being brought on in violation of policies and regulations.
And ammo to include in the letter/e-mail/phone-con requesting compensation.
Steve
http://www.aa.com/aa/pubcontent/en_U...iceAnimals.jsp
Service Animals
American Airlines and American Eagle welcome service animals used by persons with disabilities. An animal may accompany a customer with a disability in the aircraft cabin, provided the animal can be accommodated without obstructing an aisle. Service animals may not block an aisle or other area used for emergency evacuations.
There is no fee for service animals used by customers with disabilities. A harness, tag or vest indicating status as a service animal will be helpful in distinguishing them to airport personnel. However, credible verbal assurance that the animal is providing a service to assist with a disability will suffice should an inquiry be made.
American Airlines and American Eagle welcome service animals used by persons with disabilities. An animal may accompany a customer with a disability in the aircraft cabin, provided the animal can be accommodated without obstructing an aisle. Service animals may not block an aisle or other area used for emergency evacuations.
There is no fee for service animals used by customers with disabilities. A harness, tag or vest indicating status as a service animal will be helpful in distinguishing them to airport personnel. However, credible verbal assurance that the animal is providing a service to assist with a disability will suffice should an inquiry be made.
Emotional Support Animals
Emotional support service animals are service animals that provide emotional support to an individual with a mental health-related disability. Per the Department of Transportation, we require appropriate documentation to permit emotional support animals to travel in the passenger cabin.
Advance notice is strongly recommended to ensure all paperwork is in order. Specifically, we require a letter on letterhead from a mental health care professional (physician or psychologist) stating the following:
*that the passenger has a mental health-related disability
*a mental health-related disability (any individual who has a mental impairment that, on a permanent or temporary basis, substantially limits one or more major life activities, has a record of such an impairment, or is regarded as having such an impairment)
*major life activities (functions such as caring for one's self, performing manual tasks, walking, seeing, hearing, speaking, breathing, learning, and walking)
*that the person providing the documentation is a licensed mental health care professional or physician
*that the passenger is under his or her professional care for the mental health related disability for which the passenger needs an emotional support animal
*and that having the animal travel with the passenger is necessary to the passenger's mental health and/or treatment or to assist the passenger with his or her mental health-related disability
All of the above specific criteria must be provided to accept your emotional support animal for travel in the passenger cabin. To make arrangements for the transportation of an emotional assist animal, please call Reservations at 1-800-433-7300 and ask to speak with a Special Assistance Coordinator.
Emotional support service animals are service animals that provide emotional support to an individual with a mental health-related disability. Per the Department of Transportation, we require appropriate documentation to permit emotional support animals to travel in the passenger cabin.
Advance notice is strongly recommended to ensure all paperwork is in order. Specifically, we require a letter on letterhead from a mental health care professional (physician or psychologist) stating the following:
*that the passenger has a mental health-related disability
*a mental health-related disability (any individual who has a mental impairment that, on a permanent or temporary basis, substantially limits one or more major life activities, has a record of such an impairment, or is regarded as having such an impairment)
*major life activities (functions such as caring for one's self, performing manual tasks, walking, seeing, hearing, speaking, breathing, learning, and walking)
*that the person providing the documentation is a licensed mental health care professional or physician
*that the passenger is under his or her professional care for the mental health related disability for which the passenger needs an emotional support animal
*and that having the animal travel with the passenger is necessary to the passenger's mental health and/or treatment or to assist the passenger with his or her mental health-related disability
All of the above specific criteria must be provided to accept your emotional support animal for travel in the passenger cabin. To make arrangements for the transportation of an emotional assist animal, please call Reservations at 1-800-433-7300 and ask to speak with a Special Assistance Coordinator.
Only service animals (like seeing eye dogs), where the evidence of their training is so obvious as to not require documentation, can skate through the gate without documentation (which I'm sure that the owner has available on him anyways).
If service animals are disruptive or too large to fit under the seat or at the passenger's feet without encroaching on another passenger's space or protruding into the aisle, it will need to travel in a kennel (provided by the passenger) in the cargo hold. The kennel must meet IATA kennel and size requirements for the animal.
While most/all seeing eye dogs are also that large, they are sufficiently trained that I would never question their presence in the cabin.
We are looking at the untrained pet being brought on in violation of policies and regulations.
And ammo to include in the letter/e-mail/phone-con requesting compensation.
Steve
#96
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Washington DC Metro Area
Programs: A: PP, LTG/1.5M | UA: SLV | Bonvoy LTT | IHG PLT| Hertz 5 Star | Nat'l Emerald Club EE
Posts: 1,067
I sympathize with your GF, but I hope that she doesn't get a doctor's note saying that she needs to travel with an emotional support animal. A person who needs an emotional support dog should be able to qualify whatever emotional issue as a chronic disability, which in her case is not I assume. Needing a dog because a person is an anxious flyer and wanting to avoid cost associated with flying the 7 pound dog as a regular cabin animal should not be enough reasons to travel with an "emotional support dog".
Sorry if I come across as rude, but like I mentioned before I have friends who travel with guide dogs or diabetic detection dogs who encounter difficulty when traveling because more & more people are abusing this "emotional support dog" loophole.
I don't think the OP would have been as upset if the dog was a guide dog, but that is exactly the point. The poodles weren't guide dogs or other actual service animals, but pet dogs that were masquerading as a service dogs. Shame on the owners and shame on the FA for not handling the situation better.
Sorry if I come across as rude, but like I mentioned before I have friends who travel with guide dogs or diabetic detection dogs who encounter difficulty when traveling because more & more people are abusing this "emotional support dog" loophole.
I don't think the OP would have been as upset if the dog was a guide dog, but that is exactly the point. The poodles weren't guide dogs or other actual service animals, but pet dogs that were masquerading as a service dogs. Shame on the owners and shame on the FA for not handling the situation better.
And just to be clear, she'd had panic attacks in flight and got the dog at the suggestion of a counselor--I think that qualifies.
You may disagree, and that's okay. As I said already, you won't know it's a therapy dog because she's very small and usually crated--not much inconvenience to anyone, really.
cheers!
#97
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Living the dream in Antigua and the nightmare in Florida
Programs: AA PLAT 2MM, *A Gold, WN detractor
Posts: 49,590
It's about the size of St. Bernards. There is only one school in the U.S. that I know of that train miniature horse to do guide work. They are actually really cute.
The Guide Horse Foundation
The Guide Horse Foundation
I have to draw the line at small horses... However, I do have a bottle of rum that provides me with a lot of emotional support...
#99
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 17,769
Personally, I find the presence of babies that make noise and soil themselves on board revolting...FAR more offensive than any lovely dog. The restrictions placed on bringing animals on board (or into restaurants in the USA) are absurd. If you can bring your soiled baby into a restaurant, and I have to tolerate it, you should be able to tolerate a dog.
#100
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Newport Beach, California, USA
Posts: 36,062
Excellent. ^^^^
Personally, I find the presence of babies that make noise and soil themselves on board revolting...FAR more offensive than any lovely dog. The restrictions placed on bringing animals on board (or into restaurants in the USA) are absurd. If you can bring your soiled baby into a restaurant, and I have to tolerate it, you should be able to tolerate a dog.
Personally, I find the presence of babies that make noise and soil themselves on board revolting...FAR more offensive than any lovely dog. The restrictions placed on bringing animals on board (or into restaurants in the USA) are absurd. If you can bring your soiled baby into a restaurant, and I have to tolerate it, you should be able to tolerate a dog.
#101
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: SJC
Posts: 214
Birkins or Kellys provide me with a lot of emotional support, and Mr. Cynnamin will surely agree.
Last edited by Cynnamin; Nov 20, 2008 at 9:18 pm
#102
Join Date: May 2004
Location: DFW-In Plano & CDG-In the 11th
Programs: DL Diamond, AA revenue negative, Bonvoy Titanium +, Avis likes me
Posts: 3,206
1. When "upon further review" the incident was so agregious,and out of the norm,
2. And they, the airline and their personel, screwed up by the numbers, with no excuses,
3. And the agrieved party is a premium passenger, in danger of taking their business somewhere else (potentially),
it will trigger a phone call, and perhaps a personal visit from a senior executive, looking to spread oil on troubled waters.
Who knows what you will get-let them do all the talking first. Ask for a FULL explanation of what they know, and what they intend to do.
If it were me, 1st. I'd ask for the 2 emotional support animals (and the 2 dogs) be admonished , plus a permanent life time ban from the passenger cabin for the dogs and perhaps their owners (it does appear that they were cheating and flaunting the Americans with disabilities act,) and 2nd, a suspension and sensativity training for the FA. (Whatever they do, they can't share that with you.)
Good luck!
#104
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: LAX
Programs: AA-PLT Pro 1.9 MM, Hyatt-Explorer, Marriott-Gold, Super 8--Formica
Posts: 17,391
I am mentally unstable and would love to take a young (insert female dog name here) on a flight with me. Does this count?
Oops -- I forgot to say it was for emotional support... My SO would definitely not support me emotionally or in any other fashion for this.
Sorry -- I wanted to do this several pages ago.
Oops -- I forgot to say it was for emotional support... My SO would definitely not support me emotionally or in any other fashion for this.
Sorry -- I wanted to do this several pages ago.
#105
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: SJC
Programs: AA EXP, BA Silver, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton diamond, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 33,511
I am mentally unstable and would love to take a young (insert female dog name here) on a flight with me. Does this count?
Oops -- I forgot to say it was for emotional support... My SO would definitely not support me emotionally or in any other fashion for this.
Sorry -- I wanted to do this several pages ago.
Oops -- I forgot to say it was for emotional support... My SO would definitely not support me emotionally or in any other fashion for this.
Sorry -- I wanted to do this several pages ago.
Cheers.