F Lap Child run amok

 
Old Feb 1, 08, 5:44 pm
  #91  
 
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Originally Posted by LCS View Post
IMHO lap children should not be allowed at all. Everything else in the airplane has to be secured. The child is going to become a projectile even in a small event such as a serious turbulence encounter. I am aware of more than one instance where a lap child suffered serious injury in sudden turbulence. Parents are putting their child at risk by not having them secured in their own seat. I predict we will see a change in the regulations to prohibit lap children at some point in the future.

Second, lap children should not be allowed in F. The well behaved one is the exception rather than the rule.
I agree with you too! I can't understand how a lap child equates to "safe". Didn't we outlaw lap children in cars for that reason?
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Old Feb 1, 08, 5:49 pm
  #92  
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Originally Posted by stbeeman View Post
And who teaches the business flyers to behave appropriately, politely, and to be tolerant?
Ah, "tolerant." A parent codeword meaning, "you have to put up with whatever my kid does." NOTE: I am not referring to kids with autism or other problems.
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Old Feb 1, 08, 5:52 pm
  #93  
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Originally Posted by PTravel View Post
Ah, "tolerant." A parent codeword meaning, "you have to put up with whatever my kid does." NOTE: I am not referring to kids with autism or other problems.
We don't need a code word. Cause the fact of the matter is that you do have to put up with whatever the kids around you do.
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Old Feb 1, 08, 5:57 pm
  #94  
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It's always funny how quickly folks jump on the "screaming babies have no place in F, nor do kids" bandwagon.

In this case, I noted spcifically that that's NOT what my concern was. Those kiddies are a fact of life. The issue was kids running up and down the aisles during take off, FAs allowing (and nearly encouraging) the use of an iPhone to calm the kid during taxi-out and take-off.

I'll ask the original question again - does this merit reporting to AA? (and by reporting, I do NOT mean "ask for compensation" because I don't think I'm due any)
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Old Feb 1, 08, 6:08 pm
  #95  
 
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Originally Posted by PTravel View Post
Ah, "tolerant." A parent codeword meaning, "you have to put up with whatever my kid does." NOTE: I am not referring to kids with autism or other problems.
I never suggested you should only be tolerant of kids (mine or otherwise)...you should be tolerant of people in general. Even adults have undesirable behavior from time to time...I try to tolerate them too. But at least the adults are fully in control of their own behavior and decision-making.
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Old Feb 1, 08, 6:10 pm
  #96  
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Originally Posted by stbeeman View Post
...you should be tolerant of people in general.
Ok, so I was totally with you on your first post, but now you've gone too far ....
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Old Feb 1, 08, 7:14 pm
  #97  
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Originally Posted by shoodawg View Post
Put your Bose on and stop whining.
Originally Posted by shoodawg View Post
Put your Bose on and stop whining.
Twice in two threads. I'm going to vote for parent of misbehaving child here.

Cheers.
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Old Feb 1, 08, 7:31 pm
  #98  
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Originally Posted by stbeeman View Post
I never suggested you should only be tolerant of kids (mine or otherwise)...you should be tolerant of people in general. Even adults have undesirable behavior from time to time...I try to tolerate them too. But at least the adults are fully in control of their own behavior and decision-making.
First, I want to be clear: tolerance, compassion, etc. are absolutely appropriate for the parents of an autistic child, a child with medical conditions (or, for that matter, adults with medical conditions). However, when these threads come up, the "I'll take my child wherever I want so get over it," contingent always drags out the "compassion" talking point (along with "the plane is a big bus in the sky and public transportation"). I'm not saying you did it -- I'm just a little tired of "compassion" always seeming to be demanded only in one direction. I would strongly suggest that the parents of little skymonsters have a little compassion for the rest of the passengers on the plane and consider the other passengers on the plane. I have absolutely no compassion for someone who says, "I don't care who my child bothers, I paid for his seat and if he wants to run up and down the aisles, too bad!"
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Old Feb 1, 08, 8:01 pm
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Originally Posted by easyfour View Post
From what I understand, most parents prefer Benedryl.
Fine, let the parent take it
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Old Feb 1, 08, 8:02 pm
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Originally Posted by sinanju
And remember the days when, if a neighbor disciplined you, and you complained to your folks, they'd respond, "What did you do to deserve it?"

Nowadays, said neighbor would be in jail for raising their voice to the precious snowflake.
Depends on if the parents are trying to raise their child right.

My parents were picking up their gradeschool age grandchildren (my neice and nephew) and the neighbor's daughter from their busstop to take them home (just 3 blocks away, but past a registered sex offender's house, thus this is the daily routine that some adult is there waiting to carpool them those few blocks).

The door closed, and I wasn't seeing them put on their seatbelts, so I reminded them they needed to. I got "lip" back, and my parents said it was okay as it was just a few blocks. I reminded them about the statistics that some 85% of vehicle accidents occur within a few miles of home, but they poo-poohed me! (To say I was flabbergasted and extremely disappointed in their poor attention to safety is an understatement).

That evening, during dinner there was a phone call from the neighbors. It was the neighbor girl's mother calling to say that the seatbelt "incident" came up in conversation at their dinner table. She then put her daughter on the phone to have her apologize to me for not putting on her seatbelt and for not obeying a safety instruction from an adult.

I was vindicated, and now all three of the kids make sure that their parents and grandparents belt up too.

There are still a few parents putting in the effort, and they should be recognized too.

Steve
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Old Feb 1, 08, 8:18 pm
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Originally Posted by PTravel View Post
I'm just a little tired of "compassion" always seeming to be demanded only in one direction. I would strongly suggest that the parents of little skymonsters have a little compassion for the rest of the passengers on the plane and consider the other passengers on the plane. I have absolutely no compassion for someone who says, "I don't care who my child bothers, I paid for his seat and if he wants to run up and down the aisles, too bad!"
You know PTravel - I think that's fair! My point really wasn't "Grumpy FC Flyer Bad, Misunderstood Kid Good." Just wanted to highlight that it's easy to point the finger at somebody and make a snap judgement when we're upset without bothering to wonder why the behavior is happening. To be clear, we try really hard to be considerate of other travelers when we fly with my son. We plan ahead, board early, bring all kinds of stuff to entertain him, and supervise him continuously (in Y!) throughout the flight. And most of the time life is great. Sometimes it's not. We do the best we can, try to calm him when he has a meltdown, and try to apologize and make amends to our fellow travelers who are inconvenienced. In more than 5 years of flying with an autistic child, I've only ever had one negative experience with pax, and that person apologized before the flight was over. So you're right - parents should try and control their kids and make the flight enjoyable for everyone...as much as they can. Sometimes, even with a neuro-typical kiddo, it's not in your control anymore.

Believe me, when my son has a meltdown your frustration is a drop in the bucket compared to the frustration, fear, embarrassment, and anger going on inside my skull...
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Old Feb 1, 08, 8:19 pm
  #102  
 
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Originally Posted by Blumie View Post
Ok, so I was totally with you on your first post, but now you've gone too far ....
Yah, I know...I was momentarily in tune with my closet-liberal! ROTFL

Still...seems like this is "small stuff" in Mazwell's Hierarchy of Stuff that Pisses Me Off...
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Old Feb 1, 08, 8:22 pm
  #103  
 
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Originally Posted by McFlyPHL View Post
The issue was kids running up and down the aisles during take off, FAs allowing (and nearly encouraging) the use of an iPhone to calm the kid during taxi-out and take-off.

I'll ask the original question again - does this merit reporting to AA
I think yes. The issue in my mind is that the FA's allowed the child to run loose and play with an object that is supposed to be stowed. This is a risk to the child and to others on the plane.

I say this, as a parent of a child who has travelled in F and comported himself well. (OK, with the exception of the drink he spilled on me and which dripped below us to the rear passenger's carryon. I was mortified - but I've had drinks spilled on me by adults and by FA's before, so the spilled drink had less to do with my son's age than with turbulence itself.) I do believe parents are responsible for controlling their children's behavior, and accountable to others around them.

Oh yeah, and one of my 3 kids does have developmental delays that result in outbursts at times. He is NOT the child I take on the plane with me in F. Nor did I travel with my infant(s).

And IMHO lap children should NOT be permitted. You can't put a seat belt around them and they're a risk to others as well as themselves. Any "parent" looking to save a couple hundred bucks and risk their child's life -well, I just have nothing to say to them. they probably don't use car seats properly either.
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Old Feb 1, 08, 9:03 pm
  #104  
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Originally Posted by stbeeman View Post
You know PTravel - I think that's fair! My point really wasn't "Grumpy FC Flyer Bad, Misunderstood Kid Good." Just wanted to highlight that it's easy to point the finger at somebody and make a snap judgement when we're upset without bothering to wonder why the behavior is happening. To be clear, we try really hard to be considerate of other travelers when we fly with my son. We plan ahead, board early, bring all kinds of stuff to entertain him, and supervise him continuously (in Y!) throughout the flight. And most of the time life is great. Sometimes it's not. We do the best we can, try to calm him when he has a meltdown, and try to apologize and make amends to our fellow travelers who are inconvenienced. In more than 5 years of flying with an autistic child, I've only ever had one negative experience with pax, and that person apologized before the flight was over. So you're right - parents should try and control their kids and make the flight enjoyable for everyone...as much as they can. Sometimes, even with a neuro-typical kiddo, it's not in your control anymore.

Believe me, when my son has a meltdown your frustration is a drop in the bucket compared to the frustration, fear, embarrassment, and anger going on inside my skull...
From the tone of this post, I'd say that you and your spouse are exceptional parents. Sadly, not the norm. Based on the statistics above, more than 99% of the children we see on planes are not autistic. Odds are that a misbehaving kid is simply misbehaving. And that happens. All too often, though, parents permit this, generally by ignoring this, and getting upset with anyone who brings this up. No, it's not all, or even most parents, but they're not that hard to find. These are the people that many of us are talking about. The parents who think it's ok for their kid to run in the aisles, yell and scream, kick seats, etc.

Parents like you are a blessing...to your kids- where it really matters- and to us grumpy FC travelers, who are far less important in this context.

Cheers.
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Old Feb 1, 08, 9:48 pm
  #105  
 
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Originally Posted by brp View Post
Parents like you are a blessing...to your kids- where it really matters- and to us grumpy FC travelers, who are far less important in this context.

Cheers.
Thanks, but remember - I never said I wasn't one of the grumpy FC travelers too sometimes!!! Besides, we screw up the parental control thing too...nobody's perfect (least of all me)!
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