SAN-man

In the press release it's called the American Airlines Business Lounge, and sounds like they're the ones building it. This doesn't sound all that dissimilar from the business lounges in the Caribbean and Latin America, that aren't really ACs either. Except that this one will likely be nicer than the little one I was in in Jamaica.

GentleGiant

Doesn't BA have a lounge at Stansted?

What do BA customers use - surely as they are OneWorld we can use their lounge?

bernardd

BA doesn't operate from STN - it's predominantly used by LCC's.

WingNaPrayer

In case it already hasn't been posted, here it is. If it has already been posted - I don't care.

In conjunction with the inaugural flight, American opened a new lounge at London Stansted for business class customers. The lounge offers high-speed Internet access and a complimentary breakfast buffet. American will operate out of a temporary location with plans to open a permanent Business Class lounge in 2008.

WingNaPrayer

Odd that you should mention that since that is exactly what AA has become as of late, an LCC!

kappa

To me it is obvious why it is not an AC. AA is flying to STN only because of the all-business class service of Eos and Maxjet. I have used them, as well as L'avion to Paris. Without a lounge, AA would not be competitive.

My loyalty to AA does not exceed my loyalty to my bank balance. The base fares are less and the Exchequer doesn't nick me for the premium fare surtax when I upgrade. Above all, I avoid LHR. (And I no longer need miles to maintain status.)

If it were an AC, then any member flying in coach could enter. With a 48 person capacity it fits nicely into the potential use by J class pax based on a 2x/day scheduling.

prof1950

If I were flying between JFK and STN, and I have, I would fly EOS for about the same price. They use the Emirates lounge at JFK and they have their own lounge at STN. My wife and I flew this route as recently as August and it was wonderful, EOS has only 48 pass on a 757, real meal service, great bevs..a truly class act!

spanishflea

This loophole is now being closed though.

kappa

What have I missed?

If there is (or will be) an additional APD tax based solely on a "better" seat, it is in the fare on a single class flight like Eos, MaxJet and SilverJet - just as it is now in the F/J fares of multi-class flights.

That is not true with a mileage upgrade on the two-class AA flights where I pay $315 to AA, or with a VIP - and then have to pay the additional APD.

graraps

They are thinking of imposing the APD "per plane" as opposed to per pax.
Obviously this is a stupid system, as it'll confuse the hell out of everyone due to connections via the continent.
But, if it keeps a few civil servants in jobs....

kappa

Thanks, I've now found press clippings about it being changed in 2009. But I would hardly use the word "loophole", as did spanishflea. I always assumed the all-business seats carriers paid the per-pax APD at the 'reduced' rate and it partially reflected the difference in the fares east vs. west bound. So the airlines would continue to bundle it in their fares.

I'm not sure how it will confuse those with connections via the continent since it will be per-plane, reflected in the fare, notwithstanding the final destination of the pax. But if per-plane includes a tax differential based on the number and type of seats (similar to the existing 'standard' and 'reduced' per-pax tax) and if that results in a differential in ticket costs reflecting seating on a connecting flight, yes it will be chaotic. (As an aside, the intra-continent seating difference between up-front and in-the-back is so minimal and adjustable via a curtain that I think it would be a nightmare to keep track of and pay.)

But I do know from many posts here and my own strong feelings that the existing APD is costing BA and BAA a lot of money. It is one of the reasons I simply refuse to connect in the UK unless it is absolutely unavoidable. But a simple per-plane basis will make it practically invisible to pax. Thanks again for the update.

graraps

No offense, but I think you are quite confused. I will explain why.

It's a loophole, because the passengers are charged half the tax. Essentially, a £1000 business ticket on BA would include £80 tax, while a £1000 ticket on Silverjet would include £40 tax. BA (AF/LH/VS/any multi-class carrier) have to charge pax an extra £40 in order to receive the same amount of money.

There are FOUR rates. £10 for short-haul economy, £20 for short-haul premium, £40 for long-haul economy, £80 for long-haul premium. It does not matter whether the business cabin is physically different from economy or separated with a curtain. You can pay the £20 rate plus a massively inflated fare for the business class ticket and still be stuck in a middle seat all the way to Lisbon or Athens (or, even better, pay the £80 and be stuck in a middle seat to Beirut!). The tax is charged based on the destination of the ticket, not on where the first international segment terminates. So, if I fly MAN-PRG-ICN on one ticket, I will have to pay the long-haul rate (you can get around this if you buy separate tickets, but they usually come out more expensive due to fare construction).
What will happen if the proposed changes go through, is that somebody flying a turboprop to Paris will pay the same APD as the person next to them on the turboprop who is going to CDG to connect to Buenos Aires. This is obviously a crazy policy if it ever gets implemented, and will disadvantage BA and VS, as their taxes will be markedly higher than what the competition would charge.

Transfer passengers (i.e. those who have a connection under 24 hours) are exempt from the APD, so I don't see why you would want to avoid transiting in the UK for that reason. If, however, the connection is via LHR, I can understand why you would avoid it- it's not a nice place, and it has assisted BA in becoming Europe's champions of lost luggage by quite a margin!

kappa

Thanks for taking the time to clarify matters. I will go along with the use of the word 'loophole' based on the presumption that the single business class airline didn't exist when the APD was initiated. I think it would be difficult to administer other than on a difference in fare basis (as is done in the wording of the tax law as I read it. Eos, et als) would simply give their single-class product another name.

I was aware of all of what you point out about connections under the current APD law because I have followed several threads discussing it. But it seems to me that all of that unfairness would be cured if the APD were applied per-plane. And it would

I'm also aware that it is not supposed to affect connecting pax. But in the first days of its existence, I was transiting BA to AA through LHR on an AA paper ticket and using a paper VIP cert for a standby UG. At the AA connection desk in T-3 I had to sign a CC charge slip for the ADP (I think it was £20 back then) in order to get the BP for the UG that had cleared. AA refused a refund. I seem to recall there was a lot of initial uncertainty about its application. Incidentally I was somewhat mollified when I received mileage credit for paid J; but that was just an AA mistake. The BP read "C".

You are correct, LHR is a jungle. I have used MAN and LGW to transit when the connect is OK. And I have used STN when Ryanair or Easyjet had connections. But with no through ticketing, that can be a crapshoot. I prefer to use BRU, CDG or FRA. In any case it has cost BA my business. I was once Silver.

GentleGiant

On this subject - when we flew on the first flight we were told that there was NO lounge - otherwise we would have used it.

However AA have said to me and I quote...

"The departure lounge has seating capacity for 28 people. It offers services such as computers two with Internet access/ WI FI, T-mobile UK and complimentary breakfast buffet and waitress service for alcoholic and non alcoholic drinks"

There is a Weatherspoons near to the gate - so my guess is this is it.

They are building a lounge - this is currently boarded off - but apparently will allow direct boarding of the aircraft from the lounge - no going to the gate with others.

AA-Platinum

Which flights are being dropped?