Seemingly Unexplainable Flight Cancelations
Jun 14, 2011, 7:34 pm
#31
Join Date: Mar 2010
Programs: AA Plat, Marriott Plat
Posts: 736
I had asked AA to book me on any airline, at any time (hey, didn't I just sound like that CapitalOne commercial? :-P). Finally told the AAgent that they ruined my Memorial Day. Plenty of DL flights were open to MSP that day. Two AAgents refused, third AAgent was sympathetic and offered the voucher and full refund.
Jun 14, 2011, 7:40 pm
#32
Moderator: American AAdvantage
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OTOH, I have been rebooked due to both mechanical and weather conditions - due to weather, on BA, UA and US, as far as a quick recollection goes.
Hmmm....interesting. Because I did get through to AA Plat on 5/24 and the agent told me she saw an Alaska flight that she could put me on, but when she tried to do it, it was not available; then she said there was a USAirways flight, and the same thing happened. Maybe she didn't realize she couldn't book me on another carrier (makes sense).
I think I learned something new today! thanks
I think I learned something new today! thanks
Jun 16, 2011, 12:35 am
#33
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Las Vegas
Programs: DL Platinum, AA Lifetime Gold, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Platinum, Radisson Premium
Posts: 6,638
Bad weather day at ORD. Same weather for all.
Case in point via flightstats:
Total cancellations, United Airlines mainline. Departures: 1, Arrivals: 2
Total cancellations, American Airlines mainline. Departures: 34, Arrivals 34
On time departure/arrival rates for UA mainline at ORD: 59%/70%
On time departure/arrival rates for AA mainline at ORD: 5%/52%
I don't know how much bigger of a gap there can be in all the statistics, time after time. What is the issue at AA with departures and cancellations?
Case in point via flightstats:
Total cancellations, United Airlines mainline. Departures: 1, Arrivals: 2
Total cancellations, American Airlines mainline. Departures: 34, Arrivals 34
On time departure/arrival rates for UA mainline at ORD: 59%/70%
On time departure/arrival rates for AA mainline at ORD: 5%/52%
I don't know how much bigger of a gap there can be in all the statistics, time after time. What is the issue at AA with departures and cancellations?
Jun 16, 2011, 7:40 am
#34
FlyerTalk Evangelist
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On the bright side, AA isn't much behind in the ontime arrival statistics...for the flights that went out
Cheers.
Jun 16, 2011, 8:02 am
#35
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 706
I have one statistic to add.
On May 13, I am scheduled to fly from ORD-YOW at 1pm. Flight cancelled and rebooked to the flight at 3pm. 3pm flight is also cancelled and rebooked to the one at 9pm. Finally the flight at 9pm operated.
The 9pm 50-seat CRJ plane is not full - probably has around 10-20 empty seats. I was expecting a full load of people when 3 flights all lumped into 1.
I am speculating that weather @ ORD is the trigger to cancel flights, but the real intention is to cut cost and makes easier to recover after severe weather.
I phoned the PLT desk and ask to rebook to an UA flight at 4pm, without checking even for 1 second - the agent said the UA flight is full. My Company's travel agent said the UA flight is bookable.
On May 13, I am scheduled to fly from ORD-YOW at 1pm. Flight cancelled and rebooked to the flight at 3pm. 3pm flight is also cancelled and rebooked to the one at 9pm. Finally the flight at 9pm operated.
The 9pm 50-seat CRJ plane is not full - probably has around 10-20 empty seats. I was expecting a full load of people when 3 flights all lumped into 1.
I am speculating that weather @ ORD is the trigger to cancel flights, but the real intention is to cut cost and makes easier to recover after severe weather.
I phoned the PLT desk and ask to rebook to an UA flight at 4pm, without checking even for 1 second - the agent said the UA flight is full. My Company's travel agent said the UA flight is bookable.
Jun 16, 2011, 8:41 am
#36
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: FLL or MIA
Posts: 181
Bad weather day at ORD. Same weather for all.
Case in point via flightstats:
Total cancellations, United Airlines mainline. Departures: 1, Arrivals: 2
Total cancellations, American Airlines mainline. Departures: 34, Arrivals 34
On time departure/arrival rates for UA mainline at ORD: 59%/70%
On time departure/arrival rates for AA mainline at ORD: 5%/52%
I don't know how much bigger of a gap there can be in all the statistics, time after time. What is the issue at AA with departures and cancellations?
Case in point via flightstats:
Total cancellations, United Airlines mainline. Departures: 1, Arrivals: 2
Total cancellations, American Airlines mainline. Departures: 34, Arrivals 34
On time departure/arrival rates for UA mainline at ORD: 59%/70%
On time departure/arrival rates for AA mainline at ORD: 5%/52%
I don't know how much bigger of a gap there can be in all the statistics, time after time. What is the issue at AA with departures and cancellations?
Jun 16, 2011, 9:21 am
#37
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: ORD
Programs: HHonor Diamond, AA Gold, Hyatt Diamond
Posts: 241
One more to add:
May 13th, PHX-ORD around 10:15am departure, cancelled. According to EXP desk, Air Craft pulled out of service. Rebooked on 4:30pm flight, was able to change to a connection through DFW and got in ORD an hour late than original direct flight.
May 13th, PHX-ORD around 10:15am departure, cancelled. According to EXP desk, Air Craft pulled out of service. Rebooked on 4:30pm flight, was able to change to a connection through DFW and got in ORD an hour late than original direct flight.
Jun 16, 2011, 10:56 am
#38
Join Date: Mar 2011
Programs: Delta Gold, Hilton Diamond, SPG Gold, IHG Plat, AMEX Plat
Posts: 220
There were three of us flying into LGA Saturday, returning Tues or Weds. My sister on AA out of ORD - had both her in-bound and out-bound flight canceled. Luckily, enough flights on that route that she was rebooked into something less than 90 minutes different. On return they called her early enough in day that she was able to confirm new flight and save the 90 minutes of quality time at LGA.
My niece was flying United (also ORD); I was flying Delta - no issues on either. Because I was checking flight status over the course of trip, I did notice that AA had canceled a few flights on that route both days - not so on United or Delta.
Did not seem to be weather issues in any of our cities - but I suppose the weather dominoes could have been falling somewhere else.
My niece was flying United (also ORD); I was flying Delta - no issues on either. Because I was checking flight status over the course of trip, I did notice that AA had canceled a few flights on that route both days - not so on United or Delta.
Did not seem to be weather issues in any of our cities - but I suppose the weather dominoes could have been falling somewhere else.
Jun 16, 2011, 11:28 am
#39
Join Date: Dec 2007
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UnfortunatelyI've noticed this for awhile now. Reliability seems to be not a concern for American. When theres bad weather at a station it affects all airlines, but AAs departure delays and cancellations appear to be significantly higher than everyone else's in every metric.
If you look at flightstats you will see this is true for on-time departures, taxi times (also higher on AA).
UnfortunatelyI've noticed this for awhile now. Reliability seems to be not a concern for American. When theres bad weather at a station it affects all airlines, but AAs departure delays and cancellations appear to be significantly higher than everyone else's in every metric.
If you look at flightstats you will see this is true for on-time departures, taxi times (also higher on AA).
Jun 16, 2011, 2:27 pm
#40
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: LAX
Posts: 3,267
It isn't a concern at all. Remember, we have a dimwitted accountant running (ruining?) the airline. Accountants are myopic by definition. The mind of the accountant is always focused on the immediate details rather than the long term strategic picture. An accountant will save a penny by screwing the customer right now even if it means losing a dollar in future revenue due to the loss of good will.
Fire Arpey, save American Airlines. It really is that simple.
Fire Arpey, save American Airlines. It really is that simple.
Jun 16, 2011, 2:43 pm
#41
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: SJC
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No kidding. I sent an email about a particular flight that is routinely delayed (the stats are terrible). It arrives to DFW late, but there still should be enough time to turn it (45 minutes or more). Still goes out late. "Cleaning." Disappearing GAs....
In an email from them, the respondent pretty much said "we're not responsible (in any compensatory way) even for the things under our control."
Cheers.
In an email from them, the respondent pretty much said "we're not responsible (in any compensatory way) even for the things under our control."
Cheers.
Jun 16, 2011, 5:15 pm
#42
Original Poster
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Resolution to OP
Just wanted to follow up after my original post:
My friend sent an email to AA Customer Relations and they emailed back with the simple apology, nothing we can do etc...(PM me if you'd like to see the response.)
My friend was dissatisfied, as he should be, provided they told him all of the other flights were canceled, when in fact they weren't. After all of the back and forth, AA apologized and refunded him the full price of both his and his companion's ticket.
Thanks to those of you supplying Flightstats data - It was very valuable information when making his case.
My friend sent an email to AA Customer Relations and they emailed back with the simple apology, nothing we can do etc...(PM me if you'd like to see the response.)
My friend was dissatisfied, as he should be, provided they told him all of the other flights were canceled, when in fact they weren't. After all of the back and forth, AA apologized and refunded him the full price of both his and his companion's ticket.
Thanks to those of you supplying Flightstats data - It was very valuable information when making his case.
Jun 16, 2011, 7:03 pm
#43
Join Date: Dec 2007
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Most welcome. I sure do hope one day we can move forward with better performance
Most welcome. I sure do hope one day we can move forward with better performance
Jun 16, 2011, 7:37 pm
#44
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: stl
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I am starting to show my age. 15 years ago I can remember sweating out 3 or 4 inches of snow at ORD and wondering if that would cancel my flights. Now
I worry about flurries, dark clouds and light drizzle. It's hard to believe how far things have fallen. To a certain extent I blame whoever is in charge of allowing the airlines to add whatever flights they want at whatever time they want them, because they are now defining a system that only works under perfect conditions. If slot control is the answer it would actually work to AA's advantage over all but UA.
I worry about flurries, dark clouds and light drizzle. It's hard to believe how far things have fallen. To a certain extent I blame whoever is in charge of allowing the airlines to add whatever flights they want at whatever time they want them, because they are now defining a system that only works under perfect conditions. If slot control is the answer it would actually work to AA's advantage over all but UA.
Jun 16, 2011, 8:05 pm
#45
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: SF Bay Area
Programs: Marriott Bonvoy Ambassador, AA EXP
Posts: 2,704
The question is whether airlines should be liable for weather delays or not. Airlines can position themselves to cripple if there is bad weather, but they can also choose routes and hubs that can reduce the load during bad weather rather than crippling the entire network. Bad weather is a normal part of operating an airline, and airlines should be prepared to deal with their effects. But as of now, with zero liability, there is no incentive to do so at all.