Star Alliance; New Route Map

Old May 19, 05, 5:03 pm
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Star Alliance; New Route Map

Great information can be found on HP's website including this statement:

Q: Will the merged airlines participate in the Star Alliance and the codeshare agreement with United Airlines ?
A: The merger envisions continued participation in the Star Alliance and code sharing with United Airlines. Now that the merger agreement is complete and announced, we can begin discussions with Star Alliance carriers and United to address the issues .

The FAQ page is:

http://www.americawest.com/aboutawa/...ir/us_faqs.htm

Also, check out this combined route map.

http://www.americawest.com/aboutawa/...s_routemap.htm
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Old May 19, 05, 5:10 pm
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This certainly puts a question mark on Star Alliance membership (from the Q&A):

"(US's) continued participation in the Star Alliance is dependent upon its domestic code-share relationship with United Airlines. The proposed merger would need to be approved by United as a modification to the terms of the United/US Airways code-share agreement for the purpose of being a member of the Star Alliance. At this time no discussions regarding the code-share agreement with United Airlines have taken place.
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Old May 19, 05, 5:21 pm
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WOW! Awesome route map!
Also, more routemaps at www.freewebs.com/flyingisfun
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Old May 19, 05, 5:52 pm
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That route map needs to be interactive. You can't tell where the routes go.

Originally Posted by AZ Travels the World
This certainly puts a question mark on Star Alliance membership (from the Q&A):

"(US's) continued participation in the Star Alliance is dependent upon its domestic code-share relationship with United Airlines. The proposed merger would need to be approved by United as a modification to the terms of the United/US Airways code-share agreement for the purpose of being a member of the Star Alliance. At this time no discussions regarding the code-share agreement with United Airlines have taken place.
Well, it looks like US is UA's b*****d child in the *A afterall. I'm personally hoping that UA says buh-bye to US.
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Old May 19, 05, 6:21 pm
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Originally Posted by ByrdluvsAWACO
That route map needs to be interactive. You can't tell where the routes go.



Well, it looks like US is UA's b*****d child in the *A afterall. I'm personally hoping that UA says buh-bye to US.


Ok the merger is announced. Are you going to continue to be a NEGATIVE NELLY about this? If you don't like it then move your business to another airline. I'm sure no one would care. There are a lot of positive aspects for this merger. If you can't see any of them then move on. Your postings are getting boring.
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Old May 19, 05, 6:36 pm
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Originally Posted by trvlr64
Ok the merger is announced. Are you going to continue to be a NEGATIVE NELLY about this? If you don't like it then move your business to another airline. I'm sure no one would care. There are a lot of positive aspects for this merger. If you can't see any of them then move on. Your postings are getting boring.
trvlr64, this is not the place to level your personal assault on another poster, regardless of how negative or annoying you find them. Take it up one-on-one in a PM, or use the IGNORE function so that you don't have to read any of the crap, but don't get personal with it or the TOS violation is yours. There's no rule against being a constant "negative nelly."

ByrdluvsAWACO, there's no need for a response -- please. Let's go back to the topic at hand, everyone.

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Old May 19, 05, 6:52 pm
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Originally Posted by AZ Travels the World
This certainly puts a question mark on Star Alliance membership (from the Q&A):

"(US's) continued participation in the Star Alliance is dependent upon its domestic code-share relationship with United Airlines. The proposed merger would need to be approved by United as a modification to the terms of the United/US Airways code-share agreement for the purpose of being a member of the Star Alliance. At this time no discussions regarding the code-share agreement with United Airlines have taken place.
Upon some further reflection, it seems hard to imagine that HP & US would be pushing forward with this deal unless they had some unofficial, back-channel nod from UA with respect to the ongoing code-share agreement and the Star Alliance membership. Those factors have a huge impact on the economics of the new airline. To give UA this amount of power on what could become a wild card issue doesn't seem like a very wise strategy; I think everyone involved is too smart for that.
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Old May 19, 05, 6:53 pm
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There may not be rules about negative nellys but he's managed to have a negative comment on the HP and US boards. Guess that doesn't matter to you.
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Old May 19, 05, 7:08 pm
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Originally Posted by trvlr64
There may not be rules about negative nellys but he's managed to have a negative comment on the HP and US boards. Guess that doesn't matter to you.
That's not exactly accurate. I'm both a FlyerTalk member and a volunteer moderator.

As a member, I have my own opinions about the negativity and its value to the FT community. As a member, it does matter to me, but there is nothing I can do about it.

As a moderator, there's no rule against being negative. But there are rules against taking on another member personally. Those are the rules I'm charged with enforcing.

But this isn't a thread about moderation, it is about HP, US, their route maps and future participation in the Star Alliance. So that's where we need to focus our energy.
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Old May 19, 05, 7:29 pm
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AC is doing the heavy maint on all the widebody aircraft and the non Airbus aircraft. I think I saw one of the news outlets reporting AC was contributing money to this venture. If this is the case, it sure looks like one *A airline helping out another *A airline. Just like what happened during AC's bankruptcy where I believe it was LH who stepped in and contributed cash.

I'd be very surprised with this going on if the new US did not remain in *. If anything * needed a stronger U.S. partner then UA. UA does not look like they are in that good of shape after 30 months of bankruptcy. This merger will enable * to maintain a very good footprint in the U.S. in the event UA implodes. Even if UA doesn't implode, * ends up with even better coverage in the U.S. then it had prior to just UA & the old US.

Looking at the combined route map, all I can say is IMPRESSIVE!!!! I will be able to fly my home carrier to everywhere I want to go in the U.S. Did I misread the map or are the only states that the new US does not fly to are the following: Delaware, North Dakota, Hawaii, & Wyoming.
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Old May 19, 05, 7:38 pm
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Originally Posted by wr_schwab
Looking at the combined route map, all I can say is IMPRESSIVE!!!! I will be able to fly my home carrier to everywhere I want to go in the U.S. Did I misread the map or are the only states that the new US does not fly to are the following: Delaware, North Dakota, Hawaii, & Wyoming.
Hawaii will get service from PHX per a press release.
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Old May 19, 05, 7:39 pm
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Originally Posted by wr_schwab
. . . Did I misread the map or are the only states that the new US does not fly to are the following: Delaware, North Dakota, Hawaii, & Wyoming.
You can scratch Hawaii off that list. Parker specifically mentioned it as an area of expansion for the new airline.

As for North Dakota and Wyoming -- I'm sure you can get there via UA Express -- a Star Alliance Partner!
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Old May 19, 05, 7:59 pm
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Scratch North Dakota

AWA and Fargo Airport announced last month working to have AWA service to PHX from Fargo by fall.
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Old May 19, 05, 8:04 pm
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Cool

I'd be very surprised with this going on if the new US did not remain in *.
Yes, but the AC deal has nothing to do with UA. In fact, I would say it really has nothing to do with *. This is merely a deal that benefits AC's mx operation. If HP were to leave * the mx deal would continue and AC would still benefit.

Now LH contributing to the merger financing would be a better indicator of HP's future in *. However, UA still has sole discretion over HP's alliance membership.
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Old May 19, 05, 10:32 pm
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Bruce Lakefield is not an airline person. He is a finance person. He orchestrated this complex merger using non traditional sources of financing. As critical as I and many other people have been on US's mgmt team, looking at what he has done just to pull this off reminds me more of a good game of chess then anything else.

In chess you alway have to presume that your opponent will always make the best possible move for him and you have to think several moves in advance in order to counter and strike when the momemt presents itself. I think he looked at the board at 30,000 feet came up with a game plan needed to pull off a merger.

Looking at the entire industry at 30,000 can give you an interesting perspective on the entire playing field. By themselves, each were weak on their opposite coasts. Their individual route structures complement each other beautifully.

SEA_Tigger reported in this thread , UA makes about $300 million from US codeshares annually. UA had a reported loss for the 2004 of about $617 million. UA can't afford to loose an extra $300 million in revenue on top of their current losses.

It behooves UA not to do anything to oppose the continued existance of US in *. Even if they did oppose US in *, UA alone does not *A make. *A needs to look at what is best for *A. The U.S. is too big of a market for the world's largest airline alliance to not have a presence in. They need a plan B if UA implodes. This merger gives *A a very good plan B to serve the U.S. market.

Unfortunately, I have not been able to find the reference that AZ Travels the World used with UA and *. The best I found was here

Q: Will the merged airlines participate in the Star Alliance and the codeshare agreement with United Airlines ?
A: The merger envisions continued participation in the Star Alliance and code sharing with United Airlines. Now that the merger agreement is complete and announced, we can begin discussions with Star Alliance carriers and United to address the issues .
and here from the press release.

In addition to the operating synergies created by the merger, the new relationship with Air Canada provides for even greater operating improvements. The merged airline and Air Canada plan to work together to create value for each other through maintenance contracts, airport handling agreements and the eventual expansion of the Star Alliance agreement, which could include codesharing with Air Canada, consistent with the U.S.-Canada bilateral aviation agreement.
All of this would seem to point that one way or another the new US will continue to be a member of *.

Originally Posted by AZ Travels the World
As for North Dakota and Wyoming -- I'm sure you can get there via UA Express -- a Star Alliance Partner!
You probably can get there on UAX, but there is just something nice about being able to go to a location on your home airline. Besides think of the marketing possibilities to be able to say US serves ALL 50 States. It would help drive home the point that there is a new national low cost carrier in town. Although serving Delaware doesn't make much sense with PHL being so close by.

Both airlines have opened a new chapter in their histories today. Some people have said this is like lashing the Titanic to a lifeboat in a desperate attempt to save one airline by dragging down another.

I see it as something else. They have opened a new book. The pages are blank. In the coming days and weeks this new entity is going to start putting words in the book. The book is called Opportunity. The first chapter is New Year's Day. This new entity will draw its strengths from both airlines, and hopefully learn from the mistakes and weakness from both its predecessors. Where they go from here is anyone's guess, but they are off to a very good start.

A new door has opened. The future is now. It's time for all of us to step through that door and into a new beginning, because whether we like change or not. It is coming.
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