ANC RED-EYE

1 - I agree...it would be tough. As you point, out - AS essentially has a monopoly on ANC - SEA travel (on all AK travel for that matter). It would be a tough market to break into, and it probably wouldn't work, because Alaska would play HUGE fare wars like they have any other time they've had competition (when CO and UA both did ANC-SEA we always had $99 fares to SEA...now SEA to west coast is super cheap to compete with VX). I, for one, would LOVE it if they'd try, because at least we'd enjoy a few months of reasonable fares.

your point 3 - I don't buy it. Is operating out of ANC that much more expensive than Chicago or MSP in the winter? Yet, you still can get reasonable deals out of ORD or MSP...but not out of ANC. Yes, it's probably more than LA, but...

As for the text I bolded...so, are you confirming what Alaskan's have been saying for years - that we pay a premium for our travel to subsidize your services up and down the west coast? Lets face it - you put your capacity where the demand and market exist for you to make a profit...and I personally don't think AS flys in and out of ANC and the rest of Alaska as a public service... And, btw...isn't that what Hawaiian and Aloha airlines said about Hawaii travel before the arrival of go! And isn't one of them out of business now...and airfares in Hawaii are STILL cheaper than before?

While I must admit I enjoy F upgrades with status, and the other nice services AS provides, I have to say that I love to travel and flying is simply a means to that end (I don't simply fly to be in the air...). I prefer a more upscale experience...but would trade it ANY day for the ability to be able to afford to travel more. Just like I'll stay in the Holiday Inn instead of the Hyatt if the Holiday Inn saves me money that I can spend on activities in the place I'm visiting. I'm being careful what I'm wishing for...and I'm wishing for affordable airfare out of Anchorage. I don't think I'm alone here.

FACT - on Alaska Airlines right now, the lowest r/t fare to Seattle in the month of August is $500. You can travel SEA - ORD or SEA - DFW for about $300, or SEA - MSP for about $350. All of the routes are similar in length - so why the 50-60% markup on ANC - SEA? Competition. WN is welcome in ANC by this MVPG any day.

AKronin

I agree with your point, with just one clarification. Many from AK do not consider AS our "hometown" carrier. They enjoy our namesake, but make it hard to forget they are based in the Lower 48. They are Air Seattle after all, right?

jackal

You're not alone there.

Because of the nature of my work, I understand completely about wanting to charge a fare that offers a reasonable return and not being able to do that in many markets.

But let me run this by you. What do you think a reasonable rental car daily rate (say, for a typical midsize car) is? When renting for personal reasons (say, your vacation), what kind of a rate would you like to pay, and at what point would you start looking for alternate arrangements? $10 per day? $30 per day? $50 per day? $100 per day?

I'll wait for your answer before continuing this train of thought.

beckoa

Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry9000/4.6.0.167 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/102)

If it includes everything (under 21 fee & additional driver fees) $30 (AI)/day...

jackal

Underage fee of $25 per day and additional driver fee of $5...so you want a free car?

channa

Those are both just junk fees anyway.

Underage fee = they have insurance, if the car is wrecked, insurance covers it. So not a concern there.

Add'l driver fee = same issue, how is the cost any higher to the agency if a second person drives the vehicle? If anything, if you're on a road trip and share the driving, it's probably safer.

As long as companies are going to charge junk fees that have no relevance to actual costs, customers can also expect crazy discounts that have no relationship to the costs of providing the service.

jackal

Underage fee: riskier drivers. More likelihood of not collecting on damages. If the rental company is able to collect the full administrative fee and full loss-of-use fees, they'll likely just about break even on the damage. Given that so many times those fees are waived or negotiated down or not able to be collected, rental agencies still take a loss even if the customer has insurance and pays for the damage. And throw in the fact that a significant portion of damage is noncollectable at all (because it's not found until later or there's other disputes), and young drivers do present a significant risk to the company, even if they don't purchase the rental agency's coverage. (And in places like New York, which put the responsibility for liability coverage fully on the rental agency and allow unlimited vicarious liability against rental companies [and, on top of that, require rental agencies to rent to anyone over 18], it's a HUGE risk, which is why those underage fees in those states are in the neighborhood of $70 per day.)

Additional drivers: statistically, vehicles get driven a LOT more when multiple drivers are on the contract. And since very, very few agencies can get away with charging for mileage anymore (due to intense competition), this is a way to pay for the additional diminished resale value (or lease over-mileage charges) caused by higher mileage.

hgdf

We're so OT, but who cares?

$30/day weekend, $45/day weekday. Anything over that and I start shopping around and/or contemplating Priceline. Zipcar, who I use a lot in SFO, CHI, and BOS charges around $70/day, but it includes gas and insurance.

N830MH

I didn't realize know that for ANC-LAS has been discontinuation. What is more specific info about AS wasn't doing very well. How is PHX-ANC nonstop doing? How is the loaded out of PHX-ANC lately? I would assume it will becoming year-round long for PHX-ANC instead of summer seasonal.

COpltASgldPHX

There is no PHX-ANC non-stop. There is one direct flight (same flight #, stops in SEA) in each direction daily. IIRC there has always been at least one direct flight.

formeraa

They will definitely get rid of the Airbus sub-fleet as quickly as reasonably possible.

As for international destinations, it has been a limitation of their computer reservation system. They will not have the capability to fare international itineraries (complex taxes and fees) until their current system upgrade is complete. That being said, they could have done an upgrade earlier if they had wanted to fly international. In addition, they have stated intentions to -- at least -- codeshare with international carriers.

I_Can_Fly_US_Airways

Couldn't even imagine (and don't want to either) think about being on Cattle Car Airlines for a flight that is 5:37. I'll fly WN on flights of >1 hour if there's no alturnative. More than 1 hour, "fo ge about id"...

Elite Status Is Not A Matter of Life Or Death, it’s Much More Important Than That!

hgdf

Elites so often forget what it's like to be common people...

In my experience the MVPG boarding call on most transcons is the true cattle call. My favorite example is a flight to ORD. As an MVPG I rarely get the upgrade, but if I don't join the initial stampede I end up having to stow my bag somewhere aft of the exit row. On WN, all I have to do is check in at the 24 hour mark and I'm usually amongst the first 20 pax to board, which takes place in an orderly single file line.

Once on board I usually score my coveted 4F or 5F, stretch out my 6' frame, and marvel at the extra inch of shin/knee clearance. When snack-time arrives it's all Nabisco products, but hey, they're free and you can have as much as you can scarf down. Whenever I use a complimentary drink coupon, one of them is usually good for seconds and thirds, and as a result I have a drawer full of them.

I really think that people who have this negative image of WN must not have flown with them very much, because IMO they invented the whole idea of North of Expected. They under-promise, over-deliver, and in the end you get off the plane not feeling like chattel, but like a valued customer who hasn't been taken for granted.

RASMguy

No, you are NOT subsidizing the L48. Take a look where our capacity is allocated. AK makes up a relatively small % of where we fly. What you are subsidizing is the ability to fly from ANC to 90 + destinations from SEA, PDX, LAX, etc. with nearly hourly flights to SEA. Those flights aren't taking Alaskans just to SEA, they are taking you to more places with a high degree of convenience then any other carrier in the state. Heck, we'd love to offer more non-stops to more places from AK, but there just isn't enough of you to do it (for the person that claims we're Seattle Airlines).

In terms of cost, yes, look at the number of flights we operate from ANC in the winter to all the places and the cost of operations with deicing, diversions, etc., is much higher than say our operation at ORD with 3-4 flights a day.

Also factor in the steep drop in demand that comes at the end of Sept and you can see why fares are high in the summer when the planes are packed to the gills....you need something to float you through January when the flights are a ghost town.

ChugiakAk

Good point on elites forgetting what it is like for most people to fly. While I always enjoy a first class upgrade, it isn't as special as it used to be when I first flew Alaska Airlines in the 1970s and 80s. Times have changed and first now gives you a bigger seat, better legroom (except for the great legroom in the exit rows), and a fairly decent snack. Fly coach and it's a bag of snack mix and a Jones soda with a charge for everything else.

Wife and I flew Southwest a few years ago and actually enjoyed the experience. Flight attendants were upbeat and very personable and seemed to like what they do. Certainly better than service we've received on Northwest, United or Delta.

I'm not particularly fond of their boarding system but the in-flight experience was quite professional and enjoyable. Alaska Airlines remains my carrier of preference but Southwest is not as bad as some say they are.