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JFK-LAX Flight Diverted to MCI After Y Pax Made Threats When Denied Access to F Lav

JFK-LAX Flight Diverted to MCI After Y Pax Made Threats When Denied Access to F Lav

Old Sep 27, 19, 11:12 am
  #1  
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JFK-LAX Flight Diverted to MCI After Y Pax Made Threats When Denied Access to F Lav

You can't make up this stuff. Jets fan threatens to kill pilot.
The most shocking part of this is learning that there is at least one AS FA that actually enforces the F lav for F pax rule.

https://newyork.cbslocal.com/2019/09...over-bathroom/
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Old Sep 27, 19, 11:41 am
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Yikes! Wonder why it took so long to get going again after landing in MCI?

On my flight Tues I heard the F announce that the F lav is reserved for F pax "unless the cart is blocking the aisle."
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Old Sep 27, 19, 12:51 pm
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Originally Posted by SFO777 View Post
The most shocking part of this is learning that there is at least one AS FA that actually enforces the F lav for F pax rule.
LOL... so he was arrested for getting upset about not being able to do something that probably 95% of AS flight crews allow.

I'm a proponent of F pax at least having priority for a dedicated lav, but to play devil's advocate, maybe this guy flies a few times a year and is used to being able to use the F lav when seated near the front of Y. And, quite unfortunately for him, he ended up on one of the 5% of flights where the crew actually enforces that rule, and perhaps he thought there was some sort of discrimination at play... who knows.

In any case, his reaction was ridiculous. Are people like this actually employed? Are they not worried their employer or even just friends/family/coworkers may see such videos?

On the other hand, if AS FAs were actually consistent in this regard, it may have saved a diversion and arrest here.
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Old Sep 27, 19, 1:49 pm
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If it really wasn't being used, as an F passenger, I would be annoyed for the 4-hour delay more than someone using the F lav.

While his reaction was ridiculous, I also wonder what happened before the video. Did he feel disrespected in how they handled it? Could the FA have been a bit better on how they handled it? Did it really need to get to the point that they made an emergency landing so he could be arrested?
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Old Sep 27, 19, 1:55 pm
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Originally Posted by Bellerina View Post
If it really wasn't being used, as an F passenger, I would be annoyed for the 4-hour delay more than someone using the F lav.

While his reaction was ridiculous, I also wonder what happened before the video. Did he feel disrespected in how they handled it? Could the FA have been a bit better on how they handled it? Did it really need to get to the point that they made an emergency landing so he could be arrested?
if, as mentioned, he started to make threats against the crew, absolutely yes

as for your first two questions, I strongly suspect the answer to each is "yes" also (that said, imo, "feeling disrespected" is unfortunately the cause of WAY too much yell-first-think-later over-reaction nowadays; too many people simply don't have -- or choose not to exercise -- a modicum of self-control)
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Old Sep 27, 19, 2:05 pm
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Agreed, once he started making threats, I can see the reason for the landing/arrest.

In my experience, after you tell someone they can't do something, you can let them vent their displeasure (yell a bit), but continuing to engage with them only makes it worse. If they had stopped responding to him after they explained the first time why he couldn't use the lavatory, would have had sat down and just grumbled a bit? Sometimes engaging makes it all worse. Threatening to call the police doesn't help deescalate situations (it may totally have been warranted, but I just don't know). *shrugs* Obviously, none of us really know the "right" answer in this case. I don't think anyone except those maybe on the plane know what the best answer should have been, but just some questions to think about. I hope Alaska thinks these same questions. Likely the answer will be the FA did everything correct, but maybe it's something they can be trained to handle better in the future.

To be fair, I have found all AS agents to be generally polite, respectful. Nothing like you get on other airlines. So I doubt the FAs were what I would consider disrespectful. However, that doesn't mean they are all perfect all of the time.
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Old Sep 27, 19, 3:05 pm
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Alaska flight crews are very consistent in announcing that the First Class lav is reserved for First Class passengers unless the aisle is blocked by carts. And, contrary to the gentlemanís claim, no Alaska aircraft has two lavs up front. Most have three aft, which typically allows a line of eight people to move very quickly.
As for whether the forward lav was empty, I donít take any claims seriously from someone whose claim about the number of lavs was inaccurate.
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Old Sep 27, 19, 3:06 pm
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Originally Posted by metallo View Post
LOL... so he was arrested for getting upset about not being able to do something that probably 95% of AS flight crews allow.

I'm a proponent of F pax at least having priority for a dedicated lav, but to play devil's advocate, maybe this guy flies a few times a year and is used to being able to use the F lav when seated near the front of Y. And, quite unfortunately for him, he ended up on one of the 5% of flights where the crew actually enforces that rule, and perhaps he thought there was some sort of discrimination at play... who knows.

In any case, his reaction was ridiculous. Are people like this actually employed? Are they not worried their employer or even just friends/family/coworkers may see such videos?

On the other hand, if AS FAs were actually consistent in this regard, it may have saved a diversion and arrest here.
Uh, he was arrested for threatening a flight officer. Anything that happened before that is immaterial.
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Old Sep 27, 19, 3:25 pm
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I blame the NY Jets for this outburst. It takes a lot to dress up in Jets gear nowadays, and when you mix needing to use the restroom in the midst of it, it really is an awfully stressful combination.
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Old Sep 27, 19, 3:48 pm
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Originally Posted by Seattle68 View Post
Alaska flight crews are very consistent in announcing that the First Class lav is reserved for First Class passengers unless the aisle is blocked by carts.
Consistent in announcement perhaps, but enforcing it is another matter.
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Old Sep 27, 19, 3:58 pm
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I'm just shocked that the media didn't say, "Alaskan Airways" or some other form of anything EXCEPT "Alaska Airlines" in their report!
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Old Sep 27, 19, 4:21 pm
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I posted this in the DYKWIA thread on BA. I sort of wish they would have threatened to call the police on this woman. Would have been fun to watch although I have no doubt it would have ended in a similar manner to the AS flight.
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/31551983-post559.html

Iíll chip in one from my flight today from VIE to LHR. I was in the last row of CE. In fact they may have moved the curtain back just for little olí me as I was the only person in row 6 after an inbound delay caused me to miss my connecting OS flight and OS rebooked me onto BA at the last minute. So they KWIA.

But the real DYKWIA was a lady from behind the curtain. Once the seatbelt sign went off, a fellow in row 3 got up to use the lav. Just as I got up to use it after him, the lady barges through the curtain almost pushing me back into my seat. She follows me to the front and the (incredibly awesome) FA told the lady she needed to use the lav in the back. She said there was a queue and she was not going to wait in any line. He asked her if her need was urgent and she said no but she wasnít going to stand in line. The CSD said she needed to go to the back as it is a different cabin and there were business class passengers waiting to use the lav up front. She loudly declared that she had been flying with BA for 20 years and millions of miles, she was not going to wait in any line and she will use whatever toilet she wanted to. She refused to move so there wasnít really much they could do and in she went when the guy came out. Heavy Eastern European accent so neither Austrian nor British. And considering there were 3 empty CE seats, despite her Ďmillions of milesí, it seems BA did not KWSW either.
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Old Sep 27, 19, 4:36 pm
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I did not read the article and imagine some drunk sports nut but there are entire group of people who when they have to go THEY HAVE TO GO and I am not talking about drunk people
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Old Sep 27, 19, 4:48 pm
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Originally Posted by Seattle68 View Post
Alaska flight crews are very consistent in announcing that the First Class lav is reserved for First Class passengers unless the aisle is blocked by carts.
They are? Cause in the last 10 flights I've heard that anouncement once. Last few flights that forward lav has been a revolving door of folks from Y. Honestly they need to make that lav for FC and the 4 rows of Premium and call it done and enforced.
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Old Sep 27, 19, 5:40 pm
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Originally Posted by rune87 View Post
They are? Cause in the last 10 flights I've heard that anouncement once. Last few flights that forward lav has been a revolving door of folks from Y. Honestly they need to make that lav for FC and the 4 rows of Premium and call it done and enforced.
If there is a FA announcement at all, it rarely has teeth; that is, the FAs rarely stipulate that Y must use Y lav only, and I have never heard it said that it is OK to use F if the cart is in the aisle. When I am in F, the last thing I want is more lav odor and mess that can accompany this. If the seats in the rear are less desirable for their proximity to the lavs, why should F pax tolerate similar conditions? I would not want to see PE allowed full access to F.

In my decades of flying in Y, I've only used the F lav once when the cart was mid-cabin for an inordinately long time and I was in PE. I understand that some folks may have more urgent bathroom needs, but I do too. A little self-management of food and beverage intake and personal needs pre-flight can make all the difference.
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