Difficulty in partner redemptions

Old Sep 23, 2019, 2:56 pm
  #16  
 
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I just change my expectations. I don't generally have any issue redeeming multiple J seats on partners but F is much more difficult. When I travel with my wife, I'm not going to split us up so it is either 2 F or 2 J, not 1 and 1. Once I have a J reservation, I am constantly looking for F space on that route. I'm flying CX F in April in both directions. Also, expand your departure city - find the over water leg and then get a leg from your home to that airport. I live in SEA and look for space to Asia from YVR, SEA, SFO, LAX, and SAN, for example.
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Old Sep 23, 2019, 4:22 pm
  #17  
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Originally Posted by Flying for Fun
Awesome, exactly why I am not too bothered about mixed cabin awards. I would hate to have that redemption unavailable (filtered out) because of the short domestic flight with as few as 8 F seats.


Yeah, I actually had a variation that happen on a JL F award: either take the E75 in F and cool my heels in SFO for six-seven hours, or take a 739/A320 in Y. The JL lounge in SFO is simply not worth a seven hour stay, and while the CX SFO lounge and BA new SFO lounge look nice, they still don't look "kill time in a lounge for seven hours" nice enough ala CX Pier F or LH FCT/FCL.

My compromise was take the E75 and wait for the inevitable schedule change months from now, and then politely ask for A space to be forced open on a tighter connection since I already have A booked.
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Old Sep 23, 2019, 4:53 pm
  #18  
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Originally Posted by Flying for Fun
Are you including a stopover? The one time I want to fly the least number of segments is when I am not earning EQM.

AA does provide some good redemption options domestically and to Mexico & perhaps the Caribbean. 27.5K YLW-SEA-PHX-GDL in F was a good redemption especially with a stopover in PHX that AAdvantage wouldn't allow. 27.5K offset a $1100 fare.

For the OP, Europe is definitely a weak spot, although BA has reduced their surcharges on a lot of routes. QF is pretty scarce but CX/JL offers excellent opportunities.

I still find great value in MP and earning meaningful RDM on a cpm basis is pretty easy.

James
Hi James,

I was not including a stopover.

I did some multi-city searches with stopovers in DUB, LHR and it opened up more options for mixed first and biz cabin awards. Thanks for the suggestion.
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Old Sep 23, 2019, 5:59 pm
  #19  
 
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Originally Posted by eponymous_coward

Yeah, I actually had a variation that happen on a JL F award: either take the E75 in F and cool my heels in SFO for six-seven hours, or take a 739/A320 in Y. The JL lounge in SFO is simply not worth a seven hour stay, and while the CX SFO lounge and BA new SFO lounge look nice, they still don't look "kill time in a lounge for seven hours" nice enough ala CX Pier F or LH FCT/FCL.

My compromise was take the E75 and wait for the inevitable schedule change months from now, and then politely ask for A space to be forced open on a tighter connection since I already have A booked.
Not a compromise at all, in my opinion. The E175 is a comfortable aircraft for a two hour flight and if you can select 6D even better. Your strategy is great too. I don't get too excited about lounges myself. Definitely nice but they get a bit boring after a few hours. The only lounge I have purposely built extra time into my itinerary for is DXB and that was the business lounge. The F lounge is incredible too but I have only flown 2 EK F flights on one itinerary booked before the devaluation. A lounge that is a 12 minute walk from end to end, has an occupancy of 3000 people, (1000 in the F lounge) a cigar lounge with it's own full bar, oversized tufted leather chairs & humidor full of fine cigars, two seperate food service areas with many seating options, so much more and boarding the aircraft to the upper deck of an A380 with showers and it's onboard bar with 55" live TV, directly from the lounge is definitely something to experience. I have flown 14 segments on EK, 4 of which were revenue J on a handfull of Dollars. For the OP, I think an EK J award at 105K to BCN is a much better redemption than a BA J 60K plus significant surcharges & taxes. If points permit, go for F for 180K.

My JL F was HKG-HND-JFK-LAX originally (small backtrack in AS F ) but before departure, I added a 2 month stopover to another AS F (Saver A) flight and added PVR in Main which was upgraded to F within the Elite window. AS a 75K, you are upgraded on an award before any MVPG or MVP on revenue. That is a nice little perk. Ultimately I needed to get to PHX and was lucky in finding JFK-PDX-SEA-PHX with U availability and upgraded all three segments with one GGU; on the same day I arrived in JFK from HND.

I was also able to make all the changes, add the stopover, extend the award to PVR & pay the additional $30+ in Mexican taxes, all online.

James
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Old Sep 23, 2019, 7:14 pm
  #20  
 
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Originally Posted by eponymous_coward
Iíve seen JL NRT-KIX Y, KIX-BKK J
And for JL, which doesn't make domestic Class J or First available on awards, filtering mixed cabins entirely wouldn't show anything beyond international gateways within Japan.
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Old Sep 24, 2019, 1:17 am
  #21  
 
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Originally Posted by Flying for Fun
The only lounge I have purposely built extra time into my itinerary for is DXB and that was the business lounge. The F lounge is incredible too but I have only flown 2 EK F flights on one itinerary booked before the devaluation. A lounge that is a 12 minute walk from end to end, has an occupancy of 3000 people, (1000 in the F lounge) a cigar lounge with it's own full bar, oversized tufted leather chairs & humidor full of fine cigars, two seperate food service areas with many seating options, so much more and boarding the aircraft to the upper deck of an A380 with showers and it's onboard bar with 55" live TV, directly from the lounge is definitely something to experience.

James
I should have mentioned the cigar lounge is at least twice the size of the SEA C AL.

My first ever international F experience was on EK LAX-DXB/4 days/DXB-FCO. The LAX-DXB flight only had 5 F passengers & 6 FAs to look after us. I had two showers, one while they made up the bed and one before arrival, ate fine caviar and drank well over a bottle of Dom Perignon. Even the freshly made barista style cappuccino had the Emirates logo in cinnamon on top and the "cocktail" menu was more extensive than many bars. Everything was impeccible. That spoiled me! Everything since has always been a comparison. Even the EY Apartment AUH-SYD was anti-climatic especially in food & service.




Directory for DXB J lounge.

The lounge is the entire length of concourse A at Terminal 3, purpose built for the A380 which can accommodate 24 A380's , 3,031 ft long. The numbers are staggering. Terminal 3 covers 18,440,000 sq/ft.

James

Last edited by Flying for Fun; Sep 24, 2019 at 3:42 am
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Old Sep 25, 2019, 4:48 am
  #22  
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Originally Posted by eponymous_coward
Enjoy. You can now commence complaints about "AS is so cheap they won't open up award F space on a 90/120 minute flight" and this is
Originally Posted by eponymous_coward
verytrue on SEA-SFO/LAX redemptions where you can snag premium class flights on JL/CX- the positioning flight will almost always be in Y, with some rare exceptions (mostly involving E75s where the F/Y ratio is somewhere where AS is willing to allow A inventory to exist). A inventory is super tight on those routes, even 8-9 months in advance.


I salute you, unicorn hunter. You found a smattering of mixed-cabin awards with the long / primary leg up front. Maybe TATL is different. Looking for AA/BA TATL seats ex-ORD I invariably find offerings where the positioning leg is on AA or AS in F, then the over-water leg is in Y, at 2X the Y award rate. AA in particular is big on presenting "first class transatlantic" awards that are -- for example -- ORD-RDU in F, RDU-LHR in Y... at a rate of 57.5k, when AA's ORD-LHR nonstops are 30k in Y. So, kind of silly.

For the record I do not care about flying down the back in Y on a short leg to connect to a J or better longhaul. I don't do the opposite.
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Old Sep 25, 2019, 9:33 am
  #23  
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Originally Posted by BearX220

I salute you, unicorn hunter. You found a smattering of mixed-cabin awards with the long / primary leg up front. Maybe TATL is different. Looking for AA/BA TATL seats ex-ORD I invariably find offerings where the positioning leg is on AA or AS in F, then the over-water leg is in Y, at 2X the Y award rate. AA in particular is big on presenting "first class transatlantic" awards that are -- for example -- ORD-RDU in F, RDU-LHR in Y... at a rate of 57.5k, when AA's ORD-LHR nonstops are 30k in Y. So, kind of silly.

For the record I do not care about flying down the back in Y on a short leg to connect to a J or better longhaul. I don't do the opposite.
It’s not that hard to find. TATL is different because AA saver premium cabin inventory to Europe’s a joke- basically nonexistent, so AS F always gets AA Y. AY isn’t much better (they have more inventory Europe-Asia/India). What you basically have is BA and a motley assortment of LCCs (EI, FI, DE). AS partner premium cabin award inventory to Europe is a weak spot now that DL/KL/AF are toast.

Last edited by eponymous_coward; Sep 25, 2019 at 12:38 pm
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Old Sep 25, 2019, 12:28 pm
  #24  
 
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The trick I use when searching for TATL is to separate the two legs. Once I've found the overwater flight, I then do a multi-city search to find the positioning flight (e.g., SEA-DFW then DFW-xxx). The search engine logic seems to always do the domestic F + international Y combination for 57.5K miles, which is silly to pay. If that were the only option with AA, buy two award tickets for a total of 47.5K miles (25K positioning flight + 22.5K overwater flight). But I've had good luck finding realistic options at the 22.5K miles level using the multi-city search. Well, I suppose this works while the AA flights are off-peak, so there's that caveat to this approach.

Last edited by WillTravel4Food; Sep 25, 2019 at 1:59 pm
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Old Sep 25, 2019, 1:09 pm
  #25  
 
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To answer your question, I've switched to getting a Chase Sapphire card to collect miles and stopped being loyal to Alaska.

Alaska's options for Europe are bad since KLM/AF dropped and they aren't making an effort to increase partnership there.

I do still fly Alaska domestically when I can, but it's just not a priority because mileage redemption has become pretty bad outside of a few Asia routes.
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Old Sep 25, 2019, 3:23 pm
  #26  
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Originally Posted by gdam22
Alaska's options for Europe are bad since KLM/AF dropped and they aren't making an effort to increase partnership there.

There aren't actually a lot of options, all told.

- You're already thick as thieves with UA out of SFO or DL out of LAX/SEA (like in the *A/ST TATL JV), so why bother, especially when this is just going to make your USA partner who is actually giving $$$ to your bottom line angry? This is the LH/LX/AF/KL/VS group of airlines, so we're already eliminating most of the big ones.
- You're owned by LH or tight with *A (founding member) so you're also not going to make UA angry, plus you get West Coast codeshares anyways from UA, so you don't exactly NEED AS to have West Coast connectivity. (LO, SN, SK)
- You don't even fly to the US West Coast, so why would you even care about a partnership with AS? (JU, SN, UX)

This leaves you with maybe IB (who has some seasonal LAX service so they're marginal on needing AS flow, but sure, why not) and (assuming TK doesn't mind angering UA and/or flipping *A a bird) TK. Oh look, we have two more airlines that are on the fringes of Europe, just like EI, AY, BA and FI. I mean, sure, more award options are great and all, but do I really want to do 4 hour backtracks to Central Europe?
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Old Sep 25, 2019, 3:41 pm
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Originally Posted by gdam22
Alaska's options for Europe are bad since KLM/AF dropped and they aren't making an effort to increase partnership there.
EI has been added since and DE & AY were added in the year prior to the drop. They've also added LY, though no chart yet.
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Old Sep 29, 2019, 5:52 am
  #28  
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Originally Posted by rustykettel
EI has been added since and DE & AY were added in the year prior to the drop. They've also added LY, though no chart yet.
Trading away all of SkyTeam for EI and FI is not a win.
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Old Sep 29, 2019, 10:16 am
  #29  
 
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Originally Posted by BearX220
Trading away all of SkyTeam for EI and FI is not a win.
No it's not. But they didn't trade away ST for those. DL/KL/AF were gone regardless. The statement was made

they aren't making an effort to increase partnership there
which is not correct. They have made efforts and have added partners. They're just not great partners but as eponymous_coward outlines, there aren't many options.
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Old Sep 30, 2019, 7:19 pm
  #30  
 
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Originally Posted by chillymac
It seems to me that getting partner redemptions for miles is getting harder to come by. I tend to look for F class only which makes it even more scarce.

I've been a member (paid subscription) of an airfare alert web service for about 2 years now. I seem to find better deals for trans con travel on the web service than I find searching for partner redemptions. I'm getting to the point that I only use AK miles on AK airplanes.

What are FT members doing?
AS and its FFers will increasingly find themselves disadvantaged in international partner redemptions so long as AS is not part of a global airline alliance.
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