[Speculation] Fall 2018 New AS Route Announcement
Oct 18, 2018, 7:24 pm
#166
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Portland, Oregon
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No, it's not. You can have your opinion, and that's fine.
The Virgin purchase and subsequent integration is a colossal disaster. SFO routes have been seriously pulled back. LAX, an existing hub, has seen flights pulled back. Flights have been cut in Portland as well. It's save Seattle at all costs now at the expense of the rest of the system/network.
This has nothing to do with Memphis or Cincinnati. Those places were de-hubbed because Detla lacked the traffic to send through a Detroit and CIncinnati hub. It's that simple. Memphis always was an odd duck, and when Atlanta is in the mix, they didn't need Memphis to cover the south.
All Alaska has ended with is planes and pilots. It paid for an existing network. It's dismantling that.
The Virgin purchase and subsequent integration is a colossal disaster. SFO routes have been seriously pulled back. LAX, an existing hub, has seen flights pulled back. Flights have been cut in Portland as well. It's save Seattle at all costs now at the expense of the rest of the system/network.
This has nothing to do with Memphis or Cincinnati. Those places were de-hubbed because Detla lacked the traffic to send through a Detroit and CIncinnati hub. It's that simple. Memphis always was an odd duck, and when Atlanta is in the mix, they didn't need Memphis to cover the south.
All Alaska has ended with is planes and pilots. It paid for an existing network. It's dismantling that.
This is a ridiculous statement. By what metric is this "colossal disaster"? There are still Virgin planes flying around with seatback TV's and ordering and their small First Class cabin. The dust is still settling and the two airlines are still in the process of becoming one airline. When all workgroups are merged together, Airbus and Boeing planes are flying throughout the merged system, there is no distinction between a L-VX plane and a L-AS plane, then you can start to consider whether or not the merge is actually a failure or a success. Delta closed Memphis as a hub and significantly downsized Cincinnati. United and American crews have only begun flying together recently. UA is still figuring out what's working in terms of network, and so it seems is AA. It doesn't seem that those mergers were failures - they seem to be growing and making tons of money. All of these things will take time, but in terms of time, Alaska has forged ahead much faster than the other airlines. There have been some successes and some failures. As a company, there will probably always be successes and failures. That's the way business goes. Sometimes if you don't try something you won't know if it's going to work or not. The SFO and LAX networks are larger than they were before. PDX is as well. SAN and SJC have slowly grown into much more important focus cities. The network will mature and some things will work and some won't. It doesn't mean anything is a "colossal disaster".
Oct 18, 2018, 7:29 pm
#167
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 5,956
No, it's not. You can have your opinion, and that's fine.
The Virgin purchase and subsequent integration is a colossal disaster. SFO routes have been seriously pulled back. LAX, an existing hub, has seen flights pulled back. Flights have been cut in Portland as well. It's save Seattle at all costs now at the expense of the rest of the system/network.
This has nothing to do with Memphis or Cincinnati. Those places were de-hubbed because Detla lacked the traffic to send through a Detroit and CIncinnati hub. It's that simple. Memphis always was an odd duck, and when Atlanta is in the mix, they didn't need Memphis to cover the south.
All Alaska has ended with is planes and pilots. It paid for an existing network. It's dismantling that.
The Virgin purchase and subsequent integration is a colossal disaster. SFO routes have been seriously pulled back. LAX, an existing hub, has seen flights pulled back. Flights have been cut in Portland as well. It's save Seattle at all costs now at the expense of the rest of the system/network.
This has nothing to do with Memphis or Cincinnati. Those places were de-hubbed because Detla lacked the traffic to send through a Detroit and CIncinnati hub. It's that simple. Memphis always was an odd duck, and when Atlanta is in the mix, they didn't need Memphis to cover the south.
All Alaska has ended with is planes and pilots. It paid for an existing network. It's dismantling that.
You talk about this being a colossal disaster, and my point in bring up the other mergers, is that there were losses and gains. So far, the only possible hub/focus city that has seen a reduction in flights is LAX. That's it. Full stop. End of story.
You've been belly aching about PDX being the red headed step child years before this merger ever happened so I have no expectation you'll ever stop. If you want to live in a city with an airport that supports a major hub then you should find a city that can support one. PDX is WAY bigger with a MUCH larger network now than it was 10 years ago. PDX has grown - when other airlines really aren't growing much there at all.
Oct 18, 2018, 7:40 pm
#168
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Oct 18, 2018, 7:40 pm
#169
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[Redacted quote of now-deleted post]
C'mon now, it was just a little bit of high purb o'leigh.
I'm not as optimistic about AS being my 'one airline fits most of my domestic needs' as I was when the purchase occurred, but I can't quite figure out what sort of colossal failure has occurred, nor can Wall Street.
C'mon now, it was just a little bit of high purb o'leigh.
I'm not as optimistic about AS being my 'one airline fits most of my domestic needs' as I was when the purchase occurred, but I can't quite figure out what sort of colossal failure has occurred, nor can Wall Street.
Last edited by jackal; Oct 18, 2018 at 11:47 pm
Oct 18, 2018, 9:25 pm
#170
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Portland, Oregon
Programs: Hilton Platinum, Alaska MVP Gold
Posts: 2,363
Oct 18, 2018, 9:35 pm
#171
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 5,956
C'mon now, it was just a little bit of high purb o'leigh.
I'm not as optimistic about AS being my 'one airline fits most of my domestic needs' as I was when the purchase occurred, but I can't quite figure out what sort of colossal failure has occurred, nor can Wall Street.
I'm not as optimistic about AS being my 'one airline fits most of my domestic needs' as I was when the purchase occurred, but I can't quite figure out what sort of colossal failure has occurred, nor can Wall Street.
Oct 18, 2018, 10:31 pm
#172
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[Redacted quote of now-deleted post]
Petty or not, I appreciate the contributions of ASFlyer to this forum since this perspective is unique in the sense that it's coming from someone who actually works for AS and probably spends more time on AS flights than the most frequent 75K flyer....that right there automatically garners a greater level of "leeway" and respect....although newcomer AS737 has joined the party but we all know that competition can be a good thing, right??
Petty or not, I appreciate the contributions of ASFlyer to this forum since this perspective is unique in the sense that it's coming from someone who actually works for AS and probably spends more time on AS flights than the most frequent 75K flyer....that right there automatically garners a greater level of "leeway" and respect....although newcomer AS737 has joined the party but we all know that competition can be a good thing, right??
Last edited by jackal; Oct 18, 2018 at 11:46 pm
Oct 18, 2018, 11:45 pm
#173
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Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: SGF
Programs: AS, AA, UA, AGR S (former 75K, GLD, 1K, and S+, now an elite peon)
Posts: 23,194
**TOPIC CHECK**
Please note this thread is about [friendly, baseless, armchair-CEO] speculation of possible new routes.
Rehashing discussion of AS's overall corporate strategy, product quality, brand future, and longevity are best handled in other existing threads dedicated to those topics.
Let's please keep this thread aligned with its original intent.
Regards,
jackal
Moderator, Alaska Airlines forum
Please note this thread is about [friendly, baseless, armchair-CEO] speculation of possible new routes.
Rehashing discussion of AS's overall corporate strategy, product quality, brand future, and longevity are best handled in other existing threads dedicated to those topics.
Let's please keep this thread aligned with its original intent.
Regards,
jackal
Moderator, Alaska Airlines forum
Oct 25, 2018, 2:58 pm
#175
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: SFO
Programs: BART Platinum, AA Plat Pro
Posts: 1,158
FWIW, there was at least one question about network on the earnings call:
A year ago I would have interpreted this as saying they're not planning to make the network better. 
But now I'd interpret it as saying they're not planning to make the network worse.
...Are we at a point now where going forward – and I guess maybe this is even the question for Andrew as well – that we're not going to see anything more material with respect to the network, like the big changes have occurred and this is the network of 2019 and beyond?
AAG
Yeah. Michael, this is Andrew. That's right. I think if you look at the culling, we cleaned up Dallas Love Field to the East Coast. We took care of our Mexico City slots which weren't going to be long-term winners for us. And as we've shared previously, the network we inherited from Virgin America, we've made significant changes there. So, we feel really good about the network. Our big opportunity – Ben may comment on this – on the schedule, but also just the marketing times of our network and getting our flights leaving at the times we want them to leave is our next big opportunity.
AAG
Yeah. Michael, this is Andrew. That's right. I think if you look at the culling, we cleaned up Dallas Love Field to the East Coast. We took care of our Mexico City slots which weren't going to be long-term winners for us. And as we've shared previously, the network we inherited from Virgin America, we've made significant changes there. So, we feel really good about the network. Our big opportunity – Ben may comment on this – on the schedule, but also just the marketing times of our network and getting our flights leaving at the times we want them to leave is our next big opportunity.
But now I'd interpret it as saying they're not planning to make the network worse.
Oct 25, 2018, 3:54 pm
#176
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Nov 13, 2018, 9:59 am
#177
Join Date: Sep 2017
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My Spidey Sense Armchair CEO Crystal Ball Prediction™ is a significant increase in SEA-WAS and SEA-NYC routes in the near future: Amazon's new HQs
Nov 13, 2018, 10:32 am
#178
Join Date: Apr 2003
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My Spidey Sense Armchair CEO Crystal Ball Prediction™ is a significant increase in SEA-WAS and SEA-NYC routes in the near future: Amazon's new HQs
People based in the East Coast are also not going to be just traveling to SEA. It is more likely those people will be travelling within the East Coast while those in SEA deal with the West Coast. Seems like AS's competitors would be helped more as those that need to travel within the East Coast can't choose AS as they have no flights. This means that DL/B6/AA/UA all have a much broader network which better serves the East Coast based employees and gives them greater leverage with Amazon corporate contracts.
Now if you need somebody in Boston, they fly up from NY or DC and can even do a day trip rather than flying somebody in from SEA. Need a lobbyist in DC, surprise you already have them in DC and don't need to fly them anywhere.
Last edited by sfozrhfco; Nov 13, 2018 at 10:57 am
Nov 13, 2018, 12:00 pm
#179
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Between SFO and STS
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Posts: 731
Probably not. The HQ in DC will be near DCA and AS just gave up their in perimeter slots and have no other slots to add to SEA. JFK also has no slots for them unless they move flights from SFO/LAX which would put them at an even worse position in California transcons. EWR is not a great options for people in LIC. JFK/LGA are much more convenient and LGA slots were also just given up by AS so even connecting options from LGA are not options for them.
People based in the East Coast are also not going to be just traveling to SEA. It is more likely those people will be travelling within the East Coast while those in SEA deal with the West Coast. Seems like AS's competitors would be helped more as those that need to travel within the East Coast can't choose AS as they have no flights. This means that DL/B6/AA/UA all have a much broader network which better serves the East Coast based employees and gives them greater leverage with Amazon corporate contracts.
Now if you need somebody in Boston, they fly up from NY or DC and can even do a day trip rather than flying somebody in from SEA. Need a lobbyist in DC, surprise you already have them in DC and don't need to fly them anywhere.
People based in the East Coast are also not going to be just traveling to SEA. It is more likely those people will be travelling within the East Coast while those in SEA deal with the West Coast. Seems like AS's competitors would be helped more as those that need to travel within the East Coast can't choose AS as they have no flights. This means that DL/B6/AA/UA all have a much broader network which better serves the East Coast based employees and gives them greater leverage with Amazon corporate contracts.
Now if you need somebody in Boston, they fly up from NY or DC and can even do a day trip rather than flying somebody in from SEA. Need a lobbyist in DC, surprise you already have them in DC and don't need to fly them anywhere.
Nov 13, 2018, 12:26 pm
#180
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Probably not. The HQ in DC will be near DCA and AS just gave up their in perimeter slots and have no other slots to add to SEA. JFK also has no slots for them unless they move flights from SFO/LAX which would put them at an even worse position in California transcons. EWR is not a great options for people in LIC. JFK/LGA are much more convenient and LGA slots were also just given up by AS so even connecting options from LGA are not options for them.
For the record, AS is leasing slots to WN. Presumably if LGA ever did get rid of their perimeter or for some reason you could turn DCA in perimeter slots to beyond perimeter ones AS would be getting their slots back once the lease expired and would be starting SEA/PDX/LAX/SFO/SJC/SAN-LGA service (or doing more DCA service- SAN-DCA, SJC-DCA) a nanosecond later.
I know your official position seems to be AS is the worst airline ever™ but I tend to think coughing up the pmVX in-perimeter slots just talks about how scattershot VX was for planning their route network (YYZ, maybe we serve PDX, maybe we don't, oh, let's try DAL-AUS and pretend WN won't kill us, and so on). DAL-LGA/DCA might have made more sense if slots weren't expensive and DAL wasn't permanently kneecapped at two gates.
You're right about JFK and I would add that IAD/BWI aren't great alternates for DCA for business trips to HQ2, though they're not terrible going home for the greater DC area if you work at HQ2 and need to go to HQ1, depending on where you live I guess. So I'd say OP is right about this being helpful at supporting SEA-WAS/NYC traffic, but maybe not a ton of new service.
Last edited by eponymous_coward; Nov 13, 2018 at 12:40 pm