PVDtoDEL

I'm really annoyed that Alaska seems to have gotten rid of the redeye from SEA to BOS in this year's winter schedule. Instead, they've kept the (normally summer seasonal) 3PM flight which gets in at midnight.

Now, the only ways to get to BOS are:
a) 7AM flight which wastes a full day in flight and then lands at rush hour in BOS, so I waste the full evening getting home (near PVD, but Alaska doesn't have any partners flying there anymore )
b) 3PM flight which wastes a full afternoon/evening in flight and then lands at midnight when it's too late to catch the last train home
c) Redeye via PDX which always seems to be double the price of the nonstop (and all the competition)

I find it hard to believe that Alaska is making more money flying this 3PM flight vs flying a couple hops up and down the coast from 3PM to 9PM and then getting the revenue from the redeye on top.

I know that not everybody loves redeyes, but I know I certainly prefer them sometimes.. When I have a tight schedule, it's a good way to make sure I'm making the most of my limited time at both the origin and destination.

The competition offers redeyes on the nonstop routing and over 10 different hubs, and all at a reasonable price (Alaska via PDX is usually so expensive that my corporate booking tool won't even let me select it).

Alaska's a great company, and I really want to stay loyal, but they make it so hard sometimes..

Chugach

3Cforme

Redeyes have the reputation of being lower-yielding. But yes, SEA-BOS is a long way and burns a lot of daylight.

That might be why they're cutting a redeye SEA-BOS but keeping PDX-BOS -- less competition often means higher fares.

AKLifetimeFlyer

It's not just AS, to stay competitive, all airlines have slashed flights that aren't cost effective. You realize the airline industry is a business, right?

sfozrhfco

The short answer is that BOS is a blip on the radar of AS. It just is not a very important station for them. Even LAX can only support one flight a day in the winter at very, very low fares. BOS is far more important to B6 and flying a redeye back to a hub also has a much lower cost to them as the plane would otherwise be idle overnight if it stayed on the East Coast. AS will be short of planes as they speed up the retrofit of the former VX planes so they won't have much slack in their schedule until that is done. The only growth they will have for the whole of next year is simply flying higher capacity planes on longer routes. Anything else they add will mean a cut to another route to "fund" it.

B6 offers very low prices and the best product for the red eye in all classes on this route in the winter so it is no brainer to take them if the AS schedule doesn't work for you.

AS Flyer

BOS supports 7 flights to 5 destinations in the slow season and that goes up by 3 or 4 flights a day in the peak season. That's hardly a station that is a "blip on the radar" or "not a very important station". Measured by mere seats alone, BOS is more important to AS than SEA is to B6. This is not the first time that AS has eliminated a majority of it's transcon red-eyes, they did it about 6 or 7 years ago as well. As for Alaska not having slack in the fleet - there's less than usual but 2019 will see more 739's and Max 9's coming into the fleet. Expected growth has been scaled back to 2% for 2019 which leaves room for marginal growth.

sfozrhfco

PVDtoDEL

I actually work in a closely related industry, so I understand how the financials work just fine. My point is that AS is overlooking an important part of "staying competitive," which is offering its loyal customers connectivity. AS needs to be able to fly it's HVCs where they need to go when they need to get there - that's why we saw the wave of defections after the AA partnership loss.

This is a similar idea - given AS' schedule structure, redeyes are the only way to make sure that people can connect onwards (whether on another flight on by ground transportation) at both the origin and destination. People up in the State of Alaska might be used to overnighting enroute on their way to nearly anywhere, but we have too many options here in the lower 48 for non-connective schedules to "keep AS competitive." Faced with the choice of wasting an evening and staying in an airport hotel in BOS on my way to PVD vs taking a convenient B6 or UA redeye, the first option isn't remotely competitive, and that's why decisions like removing the redeye may drive some or all of the 200k miles/year I fly away from AS and its partners.

For what it's worth, AS has the same exact cost benefit analysis as B6 here - the 3PM SEA-BOS flight stays in BOS overnight instead of flying. Lacking slack in its fleet is exactly why AS would want to schedule redeyes in the first place - for example, the SEA-PHL redeye last summer was probably driven by the fact that they couldn't find time on an airplane during the day to operate the route.

AS is using more valuable airplane time to fly this 3PM route, which is why I'm so annoyed by it - as Chugach mentioned, on the earnings call, AS execs seemed to indicate that they think that these non-redeye flights are an improvement for passengers, but from a raw connectivity perspective, they're absolutely not.

TA

Boston is not a huge connection hub, and even less so for AS. Maybe it is time to reevaluate whether AS is the one to get you to PVD on your needed schedule. Your loyalty and your needs are conflicting with the routes/network that AS can offer.

PVDtoDEL

Yeah, I'm realising that.. The tough part is that until this winter, their network worked fine, and it's tough to let go of that. Just expressing my sadness on the internet, like any good FTer

As far as my overall point on connectivity, AS doesn't know what its passengers do before and after the flight. But if they want to appeal to as many groups of passengers as possible, given their limited fleet size, they need to strive to have as connective of a schedule as possible, ideally with partners to cover the gaps which they can't. Unfortunately, it seems like they either don't realise that or don't agree with its importance from my perspective.

milypan

PABE

formeraa

OP, I would write a quick note to AS Customer Service, stating that your issues. It seems like the quick connection to the PDX redeye would be fine, if the fares were attractive. Just let AS know that you have been a loyal AS customers and would like to remain so and point out that you would be willing to connect in PDX if the fares were reasonable. Ask them to send this suggestion (always call it a suggestion, not a complaint) over to the Pricing department for consideration.

Then, wait a couple of weeks to see what happens. That will let you know whether you need to change airlines...

beckoa

Sounds like someone wants SEA-PVD.

sfozrhfco

PDX has far less competition and thus AS has some pricing power. Why would they lower the fare on the only flight they offer to BOS that is not overrun with competition? Plus starting in November, there is only a morning flight from PDX anyway. Nothing operates after 930AM on that route that is non stop.