Pricing Error from Orlando?
Jun 7, 2018, 10:05 am
#16
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Between SFO and STS
Programs: Alaska MVP Gold, United Serf, Delta Gold
Posts: 731
I'm not much for knowledge in the area of how VX was doing on revenue, but it didn't sound like they were doing an awesome job... Most airlines have jacked up prices around holidays and it's hard to find T or R fares on AS or similar options on other airlines (see also June 29th/July 8th, September 1st/3rd, Xmas, thxgiving, easter...). There's plenty of R and T out there in the future - just look at Bay Area-NYC: everything past mid October that's not around a holiday is cheap as hell. They might not release R and T on the MCO routes because those are probably as popular if not more so than Hawaii and they know they can get more money for those tickets. Seems like intelligent revenue management to me, but I'm only in personal revenue management...
Jun 7, 2018, 11:49 am
#17
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,610
Alaska Airlines is really bad about releasing lower fare buckets earlier, and that's one reason I end up not booking with them as much as I want.
E.g. I wanted to lock in an Austin-Seattle trip, where typical one-way pricing is alway $100-150. But if you look far in advance, alaska is only selling $500+ fares one-way on every single day. Fine, I'll book with delta instead who have released lower fare buckets already.
Same with Anchorage-Seattle route now, where alaska consistently prices itself almost $200+ one-way during the summer unless its closer in, while everyone from JetBlue/Delta and even SunCountry now are selling $100ish fares. I understand there are loyalist, but my loyalty has a price limit and its not that high.
If they don't release lower fare buckets they'll lose out on anyone who is booking more than 2 months in advance, which isn't many people but still not insignificant.
E.g. I wanted to lock in an Austin-Seattle trip, where typical one-way pricing is alway $100-150. But if you look far in advance, alaska is only selling $500+ fares one-way on every single day. Fine, I'll book with delta instead who have released lower fare buckets already.
Same with Anchorage-Seattle route now, where alaska consistently prices itself almost $200+ one-way during the summer unless its closer in, while everyone from JetBlue/Delta and even SunCountry now are selling $100ish fares. I understand there are loyalist, but my loyalty has a price limit and its not that high.
If they don't release lower fare buckets they'll lose out on anyone who is booking more than 2 months in advance, which isn't many people but still not insignificant.
Jun 7, 2018, 1:13 pm
#18
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: DFW/DAL
Programs: AS MVP Gold 75k, Marriott Platinum, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 132
I'm not much for knowledge in the area of how VX was doing on revenue, but it didn't sound like they were doing an awesome job... Most airlines have jacked up prices around holidays and it's hard to find T or R fares on AS or similar options on other airlines (see also June 29th/July 8th, September 1st/3rd, Xmas, thxgiving, easter...). There's plenty of R and T out there in the future - just look at Bay Area-NYC: everything past mid October that's not around a holiday is cheap as hell. They might not release R and T on the MCO routes because those are probably as popular if not more so than Hawaii and they know they can get more money for those tickets. Seems like intelligent revenue management to me, but I'm only in personal revenue management...
I can see releasing some T&R, especially midweek, far in advance can definitely help their RASM.
Jun 7, 2018, 2:30 pm
#19
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Between SFO and STS
Programs: Alaska MVP Gold, United Serf, Delta Gold
Posts: 731
Alaska Airlines is really bad about releasing lower fare buckets earlier, and that's one reason I end up not booking with them as much as I want.
If they don't release lower fare buckets they'll lose out on anyone who is booking more than 2 months in advance, which isn't many people but still not insignificant.
If they don't release lower fare buckets they'll lose out on anyone who is booking more than 2 months in advance, which isn't many people but still not insignificant.
I was saying releasing T&R fare in general, not during the holidays. Usually even with the lowest bucket, they could only sell only a few seats per flight that far in advance anyways so it won't hurt their bottom line while capturing the people who wanted to plan early. I can see releasing some T&R, especially midweek, far in advance can definitely help their RASM.
Jun 7, 2018, 2:37 pm
#20
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: SEA, but up and down the coast a lot
Programs: Oceanic Airlines Gold Elite
Posts: 20,387
E.g. I wanted to lock in an Austin-Seattle trip, where typical one-way pricing is alway $100-150. But if you look far in advance, alaska is only selling $500+ fares one-way on every single day. Fine, I'll book with delta instead who have released lower fare buckets already.
If you figure that someone who wants to buy the cheapest possible fare off of Kayak ALWAYS exists in the market, trading an MVPG's way far in advance purchase who they have to expend costs on (free luggage, free changes, drink in main cabin, upgrade, etc.) for Kayak Dude three months later actually is a WIN for them ("Oh, you need to check luggage? $$$ please. Want a drink? $").
I've bought VX MCS tickets that were cheaper than MC. Way to go, VX, awesome way to maximize RASM- give me more stuff for a cheaper fare when I would have been fine paying the exact same $ for MC, possibly more (and I'm not the only one who saw that happen in markets).
So I wouldn't say AS RM is 100% clueless and VX RM knew what it was doing 100% of the time.
Jun 7, 2018, 2:52 pm
#21
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: APAC
Programs: AA EXP, Hyatt Globalist, JL JGC
Posts: 143
This seems mostly true. Alaska actually has the most competitive prices for July, but is about 50% more expensive than the cheapest of JetBlue/Sun Country/Delta in August and later.
Jun 7, 2018, 3:14 pm
#22
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: SEA, but up and down the coast a lot
Programs: Oceanic Airlines Gold Elite
Posts: 20,387
But sure, the airline called "Alaska Airlines" probably doesn't understand how to price their fares to maximize RASM in the SEA-ANC market very well, when compared to this airline. OK. The FT Executive VPs of Revenue Management have got this one covered.
Jun 7, 2018, 3:15 pm
#23
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 147
No, it is not a mistake. It's typical AS price for holiday season on transcon or Hawaii routes. They price holiday flights at ridiculous high rate. I usually use companion fare when I need take holiday flights. It can save $$$ on some flights comparing with DL but won't save in some other cases. DL often prices < half of AS on MCO routes.
I was fine with that in the past given that we all believe AS has better services. But now I am more and more skeptical as As is rapidly going down to align with big 4. DL actually has better services in many aspects such as free lunch in transcon. HA also has free lunch on Hawaii routes. I am not sure how AS will be in the future.
I was fine with that in the past given that we all believe AS has better services. But now I am more and more skeptical as As is rapidly going down to align with big 4. DL actually has better services in many aspects such as free lunch in transcon. HA also has free lunch on Hawaii routes. I am not sure how AS will be in the future.
I want to fly with my cousins and my neices and nephews to DisneyWorld in Orlando. They are leaving November 11th and returning November 18th. Everyday differs in price as it should, and it generally fluctuates between $230-$319 per-way, which obviously is plenty reasonable.
Now the very odd part about this trip is the return. On November 18th to take AS19 non-stop MCO-SEA the price jumps an insane amount to $799 for coach on this one way segment. What? Now it puts you in Y class, even when you ask for the lowest fare available. I don’t understand what’s going on here because since the flight is so empty, obviously there must be cheaper fare buckets available. The seatmap is not any more crowded than the other flights. I get that it’s a Sunday, and it should be slightly more expensive, but 3-4x the regular price??? Is this a mistake? If it isn’t why is it so high? How do I get it out of putting me in Y class? I almost fell out of my chair when I saw booking a coach ticket this far out on Alaska for that much. That’s only $200 cheaper than first class. I cannot tell what is going on here or why on earth a coach ticket is so expensive and the system won’t put me out of Y on the return?
Now the very odd part about this trip is the return. On November 18th to take AS19 non-stop MCO-SEA the price jumps an insane amount to $799 for coach on this one way segment. What? Now it puts you in Y class, even when you ask for the lowest fare available. I don’t understand what’s going on here because since the flight is so empty, obviously there must be cheaper fare buckets available. The seatmap is not any more crowded than the other flights. I get that it’s a Sunday, and it should be slightly more expensive, but 3-4x the regular price??? Is this a mistake? If it isn’t why is it so high? How do I get it out of putting me in Y class? I almost fell out of my chair when I saw booking a coach ticket this far out on Alaska for that much. That’s only $200 cheaper than first class. I cannot tell what is going on here or why on earth a coach ticket is so expensive and the system won’t put me out of Y on the return?
Jun 7, 2018, 3:42 pm
#24
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,610
But sure, the airline called "Alaska Airlines" probably doesn't understand how to price their fares to maximize RASM in the SEA-ANC market very well, when compared to this airline. OK. The FT Executive VPs of Revenue Management have got this one covered.
Jun 7, 2018, 5:58 pm
#25
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Between SFO and STS
Programs: Alaska MVP Gold, United Serf, Delta Gold
Posts: 731
Confident enough in your estimation to use the available low fare guarantee? That's still there. Book now, wait for prices to drop, pad the ol' wallet?
Jun 8, 2018, 1:45 am
#28
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Seattle
Programs: AS MVP100K, Hilton Diamond, IHG Gold
Posts: 3,215
I get Alaska wants to maximize revenue on this flight. But punishing everyone who wants to book on this flight and sending them to Y fare buckets? I’m a loyalists, but I agree with what someone else said, every has their breaking points where I cannot justify a coach ticket that is $200 less than their F.
Jun 8, 2018, 7:17 am
#29
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: SEA
Programs: AS MVP , Delta Gold Medallion, "Credit Card" status for various hotels
Posts: 672
I get Alaska wants to maximize revenue on this flight. But punishing everyone who wants to book on this flight and sending them to Y fare buckets? I’m a loyalists, but I agree with what someone else said, every has their breaking points where I cannot justify a coach ticket that is $200 less than their F.
My partner and I are going to fly home from LIH to SEA on Dec 31. When we looked last March, AS was charging $899 and Delta was charging $345 for similarly timed flights. We went ahead and booked Delta.
I just checked - the Delta flight is going for $557 with approximately 30 seats left. AS is still $899 with only ~20 seats selected. My guess is that AS will end up selling all of those seats eventually, but at a higher average price than Delta.
They know what they are doing with pricing, but as a consumer there are choices. Its starting to look better and better to book as a “free agent” instead of chasing MVP.
Jun 8, 2018, 12:13 pm
#30
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: SFO/SEA
Programs: Gold 75K
Posts: 218
They are doing the same with SFO to PVR over Thanksgiving. A fare from 11/20-11/27 Tuesday-Tuesday) on Alaska is close to $1,000. It's less than $500 on United. If I was not nervous about having enough miles to maintain Gold status this would be a no-brainer.