spin88

Yes, and my "option" is not to book Alaska. Tomorrow's return is booked on the DL 5:15 pm return. AS's time is better, but for my $389 OW, I would like to go to SFO, and not find my self bumped back TWO flights to get there. I doubt that I am the only SFO based FF who thinks this. While I understand AS's desire to try to avoid issues like timed out crews, as someone who is coming back to SFO, and is NOT flexible, I will just avoid AS. Sad to say this, but I am not going to mess around with this type of crud.

sfozrhfco

WebTraveler

If weather prevents a flight from operating then it prevents it from operating and you are not going anywhere timely. If a delay is more than 1.5 hrs or more you'd be better off flying to Oakland and board a bus to SFO. You'd get there within 1.5 hrs. Plus if you are really going to the city as your final destination you can board BART or even take a shuttle from Oakland, and it may be less since you'd be getting off BART much sooner.

But if you'd rather sit in the Seattle airport and not get any closer to SFO then you can do that if you want. Life is full of choices.

seacarl

Based on my experience AS has been doing this for years, both to OAK and SJC, and it has serious negative consequences for passengers.

Generally SFO fares are higher than OAK/SJC. So when I book to/from SFO that is the airport that I want, even with delays. Usually it means that I will be carless. If I'm renting a car, often OAK and SJC are fine and I might have booked there. But when I'm carless OAK and SJC are not a satisfactory destination. Especially when returning from the Bay Area.

My daughter lives in SF and she and her boyfriend, who don't have cars, were booked out of SFO. While on BART to SFO they found out their flight would be departing from SJC instead. They had no way to get there in time. The info at SFO was severely lacking. Apparently a bus had been sent but it left before anyone was able to tell them where to go.

I don't see how the present situation is satisfactory for anyone. Especially on the return the flights either must run half empty as people don't know in time to get alternate transportation. Or AS has to delay them to hold them for buses.

Other airlines at SFO don't routinely divert. Yes delays add up. Yes it affects aircraft utilization. Deal with it when you run an airline. On UA you may be delayed but you won't be diverted or worse your originating airport changed on you...

chrisl137

For some passengers, but for others it's probably an improvement over extended delays. I avoid SFO, but I've occasionally taken alternate flights to BUR or ONT when flights to LAX are delayed - for me it's an improvement to get approximately where I want to go in a timely way rather than have extended delays sitting in an airport.

SJC isn't good if you're carless, unless you're going somewhere around that area and can just user Uber/Lyft, but OAK is quite fine carless. I don't think I've ever gotten a car flying into OAK, and the dedicated tram to BART is very quick. If you're going into the city it's less convenient than landing in SFO, but given a long delay vs. a sure thing and a moderate BART ride, I'll take the latter.

ucdtim17

SEA may be different as they fly the same planes to OAK and SFO (just eyeballing random dates for summer, the fares appear broadly similar), but from PDX, OAK is often $30-50 more expensive. I don't prefer SFO but I do fly out of there periodically if the fare is $50+ less than the comparable OAK-PDX flight.

There's so much capacity on SEA/PDX-SFO now and so much competition, there are almost always deals to be had. With so many flights, it's pretty easy to book a $50 ticket and plan to SDC to the preferred flight (something I've done many times).

And as mentioned above, if your destination is SF (your situation) and you're carless (your situation), if you're going anywhere near a BART station OAK will not be significantly less convenient.

Eastbay1K

Something to consider here is that at least there's an option. For example, when the NYC area is having a "weather day," it isn't like you're going to get to an alternate airport on your airline. You're either going to be very delayed, or you aren't going at all.

PV_Premier

clearly one of the more divisive issues on AS FT forum, perhaps even more so than polenta breaded cod or kale hummus.

i guess the message is "buyer beware", and if you aren't willing to accept the risk of not ending up at SFO, AS probably is not your airline for these trips.

sltlyamusd

Looking at the BART schedule, it's 36 minutes from OAK terminal to Downtown SF (Montgomery), versus 30 minutes from SFO terminal to Montgomery. Hardly any different. Obviously, for southern parts of San Francisco, SFO is going to be significantly faster BART trip compared to OAK, but just wanted to concur that OAK is not all that bad in terms of getting to SF.

seacarl

For that statement to be true AS has to do a far superior job of pushing notifications far in advance. In my experience, they don't do nearly enough nor early enough.

Also, for those people using Uber or Lyft to the airport, SFO is still far cheaper than OAK. And SJC is very expensive. And depending on traffic, very lengthy. And Caltrain generally doesn't save time.

It's just not a great experience for many people when you are oriented toward using SFO. And yes, I fly out of SEA where we seem to have a ton of capacity right now with AS UA AA and DL all offering flights to SFO. And not much capacity to OAK, which is weird.

Yes it is divisive. And for those who mention follow on flights, well all airlines have to manage that, and it's not the responsibility of the passengers who paid to fly to/from SFO. Does AS really reimburse the extra costs of the alternative airport? I would imagine it's not easy (maybe impossible) to get an Uber or taxi to/from OAK or SJC reimbursed.

sltlyamusd

Agree. I think WN is so dominant in OAK that other airlines are afraid to ramp up operations, but I think a better solution would be for AS to simply adjust their SEA/PDX-Bay Area schedule in winter months and re-allocate some capacity from SFO to OAK/SJC.

At SFO, AS is completely maxed out in Terminal 2 right now, and doing the two terminal shuffle between T2 and International gates creates an awful customer experience. I've done OLCI several times for AS flights out of SFO and no gate or terminal is listed and an inexperienced traveller won't know whether to go to T2 or International for check-in. If AA does end up moving out of T2 once the T1 renovations are done, then AS could at least pick up about five gates, but until then I'm afraid gate areas will be a total mess on bad weather days.

akdancer

If the flight diverts to SJC, AS will bus you to SFO. You are NOT left stranded at OAK or SJC - so having a rental car at SFO (as final dest) would still work, though you'd be late (as can happen for any reason). Yes, you can take other transport as you wish.

akdancer

I fly SEA-SFO-SEA 6-10 x each year. I've had diversions only SFO-SEA. Once it was to OAK, and the bus went well. Kept my upgraded F seat, but there was no catering! Another time, I found out my original flight was going to depart from SJC (via a bus from SFO), so I just got the next AS flight out of SFO - good thing there was space. In many years of flying this route, these are the only two hits I've taken on diversions. At SFO I sometimes rent a car, sometimes take BART, sometimes get picked up by family/friends.

SFO is always the best airport for me, but for a while - when fares to OAK were much cheaper - I did fly SEA-OAK-SEA.

Overall, I take these situations as typical glitches that can hit any traveler. There are never guarantees as to where you will (or won't) land. Just keep flying for over 45 yrs, as I have - you'll know.

spin88

The T1 project is going to be done in three stages. First nine (9) gates will be opened next summer, then another nine (9) in early 2020. I don't know if SWA/F6 gets the first nine gates, or they stay in the "temporary" terminal and AA gets to move over. (my guess is that AA gets them in Summer 2019).

Either way, if AS's plan - either due to gate issues, or a desire to avoid down time on A/C is to just send random planes to SJC (worst of all) or OAK, it will PO a lot of SFO based fliers.

While people are arguing about BART to downtown, most SFO based business travelers don't do that. They Uber or Drive to the Airport, and the LAST thing that anyone in SFO or Marin wants to do try to Uber or shuttle from OAK in rush hour, particularly to SFO.

The pattern of "jump on an earlier plane, or wait for my delayed plane" is something that every FF flying ex-SFO is VERY used to. It is a way of life LAX-SFO, and now SEA-SFO.

dayone

My memory, unsupported by any sources, is that WN/F6 are stage 1, and AA is stage 3, perhaps due to the construction of a new Admirals Club.