Southwest to go head to head with AS - OAK/SJC/SAN/SMF-Hawaii!
May 3, 2018, 7:04 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: SJC
Programs: AS MVP
Posts: 2,117
Southwest to go head to head with AS - OAK/SJC/SAN/SMF-Hawaii!
https://www.southwest.com/html/air/n...icehawaii.html
Tough times ahead as AS faces more competitions in CA.
Interesting how they won't fly from SFO/LAX to compete with the big 3 and HA.
Tough times ahead as AS faces more competitions in CA.
Interesting how they won't fly from SFO/LAX to compete with the big 3 and HA.
May 3, 2018, 7:38 pm
#2
Join Date: Apr 2003
Programs: B6 Mosaic, Bonvoy LT Titanium (x SPG LT), IHG Spire, UA Silver
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Seems like a reasonable strategy. Less overall competition, a stronger position for WN, and more possibilities to undercut fares. Those cities are also unlikely to operate wide bodies to HI so the product differentiation and costs per passenger are not going to be radically different. AS at those airports is also more vulnerable and fare reductions would make their flights a lot less profitable and some may just be dropped. Better to start out against a smaller/weaker competitor rather than going up against multiple large carriers at LAX/SFO.
May 3, 2018, 7:46 pm
#3
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: BOS/ORH
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https://www.southwest.com/html/air/n...icehawaii.html
Interesting how they won't fly from SFO/LAX to compete with the big 3 and HA.
Interesting how they won't fly from SFO/LAX to compete with the big 3 and HA.
May 3, 2018, 7:54 pm
#4
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: US West Coast
Programs: Alaska 100K, Hyatt Gl, Marriott Ti/LTP
Posts: 353
But yeah, things are about to get rough. I'm hoping that it's good for customers/fares, but not so good that it drives AS fully out of any of these markets. But that's standard FlyerTalk thinking: "Everything should happen the way that benefits me most. I want Alaska to make lots of money flying lots of frequencies to Hawaii! ...and I want there to be ample upgrade opportunities on my $99 fares, and empty middle seats on any that don't clear the upgrade!"
All I can think to say is I hope that extra-leg-room/Premium seats, BOB food, and at least a tiny bit of upgrade space is enough to differentiate AS from WN at these airports. It is for me, but I know I'm not representative of the average Hawaii vacationer.
Last edited by CalanMan; May 3, 2018 at 8:12 pm
May 3, 2018, 7:59 pm
#5
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: SFO
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Seems like a reasonable strategy. Less overall competition, a stronger position for WN, and more possibilities to undercut fares. Those cities are also unlikely to operate wide bodies to HI so the product differentiation and costs per passenger are not going to be radically different. AS at those airports is also more vulnerable and fare reductions would make their flights a lot less profitable and some may just be dropped. Better to start out against a smaller/weaker competitor rather than going up against multiple large carriers at LAX/SFO.
May 3, 2018, 9:13 pm
#6
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: SFO
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But presumably these are the types of routes where HA might sub out an A332 for an A321neo as they start receiving more?
May 3, 2018, 9:42 pm
#8
Join Date: Sep 2011
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And that aside, the HA 321s still have a higher seat count than either WN or AS do.
May 3, 2018, 9:59 pm
#10
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Portland, Oregon
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Posts: 2,363
We'll see how this goes. I don't look forward to the seat game on Southwest on flights like this. Initially the fares will rock the marketplace. In time we'll see how sustainable it will be.
The LAX situation is probably because Southwest does not have the gate space. It will need to drop something else to add Hawai routes. For now they decided against that. Also, every major airline in America serves Hawaii from Los Angeles already.
The LAX situation is probably because Southwest does not have the gate space. It will need to drop something else to add Hawai routes. For now they decided against that. Also, every major airline in America serves Hawaii from Los Angeles already.
May 3, 2018, 10:06 pm
#11
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: SFO
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Why does LAX even matter when comparing this against AS? Doesn't AS have many more flights to Hawaii in total from the 4 WN announced cities than from LAX?
I'm honestly curious, as it seems very smart for WN to be using cities they already have a large presence and gate space in than either LAX or SFO.
I'm honestly curious, as it seems very smart for WN to be using cities they already have a large presence and gate space in than either LAX or SFO.
May 3, 2018, 10:15 pm
#12
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: SFO/OAK
Programs: WN A-List, Alaska MVP
Posts: 47
We'll see how quickly the AS OAK flights disappear. They were basically ATA/Aloha backfill and have done pretty well for being at a very small AS station with the lack of competition. I'll say that the East Bay crowd is much more WN-centric given the choice, though.
May 3, 2018, 10:15 pm
#13
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 1,637
You bet they are, and deliveries are allegedly going to start happening soon, but they won't have enough to drop the 332s and 763s across the board. That's why I also said this isn't about widebodies, but about market share.
And that aside, the HA 321s still have a higher seat count than either WN or AS do.
And that aside, the HA 321s still have a higher seat count than either WN or AS do.
May 3, 2018, 10:25 pm
#14
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 1,637
May 3, 2018, 10:26 pm
#15
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