eponymous_coward

You don't get upgrades or C+ on DL unless you pay "get me out the hellhole of Basic Economy" tax, nor can you change or cancel a ticket. All of these combined be a major dealbreaker for me. On my routes, AS and WN give me full benefits on lowest fares (and generally speaking on my typical routes there's fare matching between all three airlines, or AS/DL). DL does not. DL thus wouldn't be an option I often consider (I might do it occasionally if as the low cost leader it makes sense... just like I have flown NK occasionally). But I tend to avoid airlines that punish me for low fares, except on a transactional basis where I can discern a clear benefit (which I guess is what they want).

I also don't mind WN boarding.

Oh, yeah. If the fare goes down on WN (or AS), I get the fare difference back in future travel. (I fully realize this would not be a feature to someone who hates WN- more WN flights.) It's not uncommon for this to happen to me; I probably get about $100-200 in fare rebates a year.

Note that I said I haven't defected from AS (though I fly a decent amount of WN), but if I did... how about "I don't have to write DL checks for $3000 to qualify for Silver on MQDs, or funnel $25,000 in purchases through a particular AMEX card, or pay get me out of Basic Economy tax"?

It's obvious DL works for you as a Platinum. There's a lot of folks it does work for. It might even work for people in this thread. I don't think DL works for me as a cost-conscious marginal/lowish elite who would struggle to meet the MQD threshold, is not interested in the DL AMEX and flowing through $25k in spend to meet MQD waivers, and often would be stuck in Basic Economy on low fares anyways, and thus not getting those C+/F upgrades.

If I fell out of elite status with AS (or AS joins the "spend more money or it will suck for you" crowd), I am unlikely to gravitate to an airline with Basic Economy punitive experiences in coach, or try for status on an airline that has spending qualifications for status. This eliminates DL/AA/UA. That leaves me with... drumroll...WN. (I'd probably go with WN for most flights, AS/DL/what have you on a case by case basis).

Does this make my reasoning clear?

PDXPremier

Well said...this is why I left UA when they went revenue-based and I never looked back.

C W

Seems as though only the absolute ticket prices should be relevant. If a DL regular econ fare happens to be lower than other fares in the market, who cares if you have to pay $10 to avoid BE, it's still cheaper. Obviously it isn't the case all the time, but I think it's clear that only the absolute cost matters in the end. AS doesn't have basic economy.

AS also doesn't have a revenue requirement.

If someone is sensitive to the revenue requirement and the basic economy fares, then AS is likely a better option. I still don't see how that makes WN a good choice.

s0ssos

But AS pretty much guarantees you seat power and DL does not

eponymous_coward

It is the case most of the time. On a common route for me, AS, DL and WN will often have the same price. The difference will be that the DL fare is E (basic economy). So it's an upfare to get C+/F access if I was an elite. Or a seat assignment in all cases.

It makes WN a good choice for me if somehow AS fell out of the equation. I refer you back to my original post.

I find WN offers a less punitive coach experience than DL Basic Economy, with the ability to change/cancel my flights or capture fare differences that end up in my favor (and it's not like DL Basic Economy is a stellar boarding/seating experience). All told, it would be where I went if I had to defect.

C W

Fair enough. We seem to have hashed this out pretty well

My last point I suppose is that while I can see WN being better than DL BE, I think DL non-BE is better than WN since you get an assigned seat, and a good seat if you're an FO or higher. Personally, that's worth the $10-20 or so they charge for getting out of BE, but everybody values that differently and it's a personal preference.

3Cforme

Delta is all 2-class out of SEA, with First/Business, Comfort+, and coach cabins, with wifi, while QX is still (trying) to fly a bunch of Q400s with amenity levels that make a Greyhound Bus look good.

jimmygottfredson

Laptop out, but liquids were allowed to stay in the bag - only laptop was mentioned by officials. I'm flying EWR-LAX on VX in a couple weeks and curious to see the difference between EWR and T7 JFK.

beckoa

TSA mentioned other items for those in my line - but as usual I left everything in aside from my laptop and didn't hear a peep. [ex-JFK]

jrl767

wrong

DL generally operates at least one SEA<—>JFK flight all year (and usually three or four between Apr and Oct) with a 16J 757 with lie-flats; similarly, one of their SEA<—>ATL trips is reliably a 36J 767-300

granted, in many of the markets where they’re making a big push against AS, they are trying to compete on frequency, but 1xCR7 vs 3xQ400 in others doesn’t seem to be doing any more than attempting to establish a presence and a bit of name recognition

smilee

I love AS, and have been an elite since 2001 ish, but I might be moving over to Delta next year.

From my airport in Canada (YYJ), Delta usually offers a F fare for less then Alaska offering a coach fare.

I can look at any dates, but for argument example return flights from my airport for two Dec 1 - Dec 3
YYJ- New York Delta First - $930USD Alaska Coach $1047
YYJ - Orlando Delta First - $851, Alaska Coach $991
YYJ - Honolulu Delta in First Class $1150, Alaska in Coach $812
YYJ - LAX Delta in First $585 Alaska in Coach $580

The list goes on. It is hard to resist earning virtually no miles with Delta but flying in First, versus earning Alaska miles but flying in coach if the upgrade doesn't clear.

As well I am really enjoying the t-mobile 1 hour free wifi on all my flights and the nice Delta lounge in Seattle and jet service to YYJ instead of a Q400.

eponymous_coward

From what I can see AS isn’t all that interested in connecting you through SEA. DL is because they want to bulk up the new hub. I would defect in a flash if DL was really the price and service leader like that (but they aren’t for me with how I buy flights and what works for me). And those four trips by themselves get you close to the MQD for DL Silver.

jinglish

As I've recently mentioned in another thread, I'm likely going to shift over to DL for 2019. I've reached MVP the last three years with more partner miles from international trips than AS butt-in-seat miles, and the loss of the DL partnership (and even 100% earnings on all paid coach fares on AA before that) is putting a real damper on my ability to maintain status. Spend requirements suck, I agree, but I think the AmEx MQD waiver should be attainable for me and, combined with the fact that many partner economy fares earn 100% MQMs, I'll actually have a good shot at hitting and maintaining GM and not just FO.

So 2018's going to be a pretty disloyal year for me--I already have an AA trip booked to LAX and a SEA-BOS redeye in B6 Mint.

sfozrhfco

Many people seem to be headed in that direction. With no real attraction for many people to stick with one carrier it is better to pick the most convenient flights offering the best value. In the end, the money you don't waste by overpaying and inconveniencing yourself for the sake of loyalty is probably a good trade off.

That is what I have ended up doing. Mint for all transcons when the price is right and whichever other carrier works best for shorter flights and international ones. Was kind of nice to not have to hit any spend targets on VX this year and getting Mosaic on B6 was quite easy with paid Mint flights.

jinglish

I haven't even been stubbornly loyal to AS as much as that they and their partners have been very convenient from PDX; I take the odd B6 Y transcon when the price and/or schedule is better, and my international travel patterns sometimes mean I don't have any partner options, at least at reasonable fares. AS has been very good to me--my trips are all for leisure at leisure travel times, so my upgrade success as a low-level elite who almost always buys the cheapest coach ticket has been amazing--but I'm about to move to SEA, and they don't have such a clear advantage there now that DL's moved in and built up their international routes. DL offers better international status-earning options in coach and enough domestic service to meet most of my needs route-wise, but while I have a shot at GM in 2019 as things stand, their FF program is a little... mercurial.