Alaska Air MAJOR ISSUE? No saver award space!
#121
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: MIA
Programs: AA EXP, Marriott Lifetime Plat
Posts: 493
So, if AS is charging $300 for a 90 minute flight a few weeks out that DL is selling for $123, either 1) their RM are idiots and they will have a lot of unsold inventory they will have to cut prices on or just fly empty (and lose the chance for paying customers), and DL has the correct market price on it, or 2) they actually can get people to pay $300 (and DL can't, for whatever reason).
So you're expecting guaranteed saver inventory any time you want when AS thinks flights are going to be full and they can make a lot of money? How much of it do you expect? 10 seats? 50?
So you're expecting guaranteed saver inventory any time you want when AS thinks flights are going to be full and they can make a lot of money? How much of it do you expect? 10 seats? 50?
However RM aside, this thing where AS regularly charges 2-3x vs directly competitive flights, zeros out saver availability thru EOS, and charges 40% more than UA everyday for F awards is simply not compatible with their value proposition that they offer a great mileage program for business flyers.
#122
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Seattle
Programs: AS MVP100K, Hilton Diamond, IHG Gold
Posts: 3,215
But I think now we’re going in circles and were just rehashing what we just talked about above. Just to sum up, obviously there shouldn’t always be saver space whenever the customer wants it. That’s not realistic thinking. But they’re also shouldn’t NEVER be saver space just because it’s last minute, or because they’re software is flawed or whatever the silly reason may be. There needs to be a fair formula put out by RM which we are not seeing, and you even admitted it for F. So if there’s a problem with the revenue management figures for first class awards, which you’ve admitted, I really doubt that this problem is just benign and confined to that.
#123
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: SFO/OAK
Programs: WN A-List, Alaska MVP
Posts: 47
I agree with NWplatinum and SFOPeter. Something is very wrong with RM out of SFO on the ex-VX flights, especially related to paid/award F and award Y. Back when you could redeem AS miles on VX like they were a partner last year, there was much, much more availability. In addition, based on reading this thread it looks like more space is available on SEA flights than SFO. I hope it stabilizes as the integration continues.
#124
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Seattle
Programs: AS MVP100K, Hilton Diamond, IHG Gold
Posts: 3,215
I agree with NWplatinum and SFOPeter. Something is very wrong with RM out of SFO on the ex-VX flights, especially related to paid/award F and award Y. Back when you could redeem AS miles on VX like they were a partner last year, there was much, much more availability. In addition, based on reading this thread it looks like more space is available on SEA flights than SFO. I hope it stabilizes as the integration continues.
#125
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: USA
Programs: AS MVPG75k
Posts: 330
It's absolutely insane right now. Up until this month, I could always get weekday direct flights between SFO and WAS (IAD and BWI always, sometimes DCA) for 12,500 miles. Now, since the miles devaluation, the minimum is $30k for Y. And that's on flights that are 40-50% empty, 48 hours out.
Long story short, AS miles are now worth 1/2 to 1/3 of what they were last month. HUGE devaluation.
to be clear, this cannot be attributed to full summer flights. The flights are no more full than in the winter or spring. It's just a massive upcharge.
Long story short, AS miles are now worth 1/2 to 1/3 of what they were last month. HUGE devaluation.
to be clear, this cannot be attributed to full summer flights. The flights are no more full than in the winter or spring. It's just a massive upcharge.
#126
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 116
It's absolutely insane right now. Up until this month, I could always get weekday direct flights between SFO and WAS (IAD and BWI always, sometimes DCA) for 12,500 miles. Now, since the miles devaluation, the minimum is $30k for Y. And that's on flights that are 40-50% empty, 48 hours out.
Long story short, AS miles are now worth 1/2 to 1/3 of what they were last month. HUGE devaluation.
to be clear, this cannot be attributed to full summer flights. The flights are no more full than in the winter or spring. It's just a massive upcharge.
Long story short, AS miles are now worth 1/2 to 1/3 of what they were last month. HUGE devaluation.
to be clear, this cannot be attributed to full summer flights. The flights are no more full than in the winter or spring. It's just a massive upcharge.
#127
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: USA
Programs: AS MVPG75k
Posts: 330
Up until the end of last month, 12,500k inventory almost always opened up at 48-72 hours out. Now no longer.
#128
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend, Moderator, Information Desk, Ambassador, Alaska Airlines
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: FAI
Programs: AS MVP Gold100K, AS 1MM, Maika`i Card, AGR, HH Gold, Hertz PC, Marriott Titanium LTG, CO, 7H, BA, 8E
Posts: 42,953
It used to be if someone cancelled a saver award close in, this space would go back to w (or so it seemed). Perhaps this is no longer the case, or others aren't cancelling saver awards as much?
Or something else...
Either way, saver awards did not go up on this route.
#129
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: MIA
Programs: AA EXP, Marriott Lifetime Plat
Posts: 493
This is a function of RM.
It used to be if someone cancelled a saver award close in, this space would go back to w (or so it seemed). Perhaps this is no longer the case, or others aren't cancelling saver awards as much?
Or something else...
Either way, saver awards did not go up on this route.
It used to be if someone cancelled a saver award close in, this space would go back to w (or so it seemed). Perhaps this is no longer the case, or others aren't cancelling saver awards as much?
Or something else...
Either way, saver awards did not go up on this route.
#130
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Seattle
Programs: AS MVP100K, Hilton Diamond, IHG Gold
Posts: 3,215
If you do get lucky and happen to find saver award space, it’s usually only an AA segment or a combined AS, AA segment. If this is permanent, or just a hiccup because of the merger, it’s a big deal. It does devalue the miles greatlyW for some, depending on how you use your miles. But the fact that AA is releasing a much larger number of saver award space than AS is disturbing considering this has never been the case and AS was notorious for always being generous (at the very least reasonable) with releasing saver space on at least one day during the week.
My guess is if enough people bring this to AS’s attention things will change. There’s never an excuse to have less saver space than AA.
#132
Join Date: Feb 2014
Programs: AA, United, Alaska, Virgin America
Posts: 15
Airbus awards/upgrades
My theory all this time has been that RM’s revenue per seat mile formulas break down for the airbus fleet and have some sort of cliff that ends up zeroing out most flights. They have been systematically rerouting the airbus fleet on most of the slots for the west coast and now conformed upgrade space and saver awards are almost non existent. They originally said upgrades on the airbus fleet wouldn’t be official until later 2018/early 2019. I think they won’t correct this until the aircraft have the new configuration of seats and they can standardize their formulas across the fleet. I’m betting this is a rocky year and sticking with them, just sucks it’s the year I have 75K and a lounge membership and based in SFO. All this with the AA split and no SFO domestic lounge has basically made it impossible to give all my loyalty to Alaska unfortunately.
#133
Join Date: Apr 2003
Programs: B6 Mosaic, Bonvoy LT Titanium (x SPG LT), IHG Spire, UA Silver
Posts: 5,848
There was quite a discussion about this in the earnings call today. Way too many redemptions at lower levels happened which dinged their profitability. As a result, it is totally by design that they cut off access to lower level awards.
So, it was/is not a glitch. They are expecting fewer redemptions in this quarter and even fewer in the 4th quarter by restricting access to lower level awards.
So, it was/is not a glitch. They are expecting fewer redemptions in this quarter and even fewer in the 4th quarter by restricting access to lower level awards.
Last edited by sfozrhfco; Jul 26, 2018 at 10:37 am
#134
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: SFO
Programs: BART Platinum, AA Plat Pro
Posts: 1,158
But seriously, this does sound like a merger-related issue that hopefully will get rectified at some point (or maybe not, given sfozrhfco's comment).
Last edited by milypan; Jul 26, 2018 at 12:00 pm Reason: Clarified intent
#135
Join Date: Apr 2003
Programs: B6 Mosaic, Bonvoy LT Titanium (x SPG LT), IHG Spire, UA Silver
Posts: 5,848
Unless there is serious customer blow back, expect restricted access to continue. They are basically planning for zero growth next year and below inflation level cost increases which means cost cutting and nickel and diming people to try to make up for management's short comings. They seemed very happy with themselves in that they figured out that offering too much saver award space was costing them money and that closing this loophole helps them achieve their revenue/cost cutting goals. Given that they have a very steep hill to climb not growing (which would help them absorb additional labor and other costs which are already forecast to go up) and maintaining profitability, look for less award space and basic economy coming in December or sooner if they can get the IT issues worked out sooner.