Dec 1, 2017, 12:57 am
Last edit by: eponymous_coward
Present state(as of 4/30/18)
- AS/VX flights consolidated from T8/T4 to T7 in late 2017
- Terminal 7 under construction
- No TSA Precheck
- Limited restaurant choices
- Lounges:
- Purchased day pass option revoked for Virgin Atlantic Clubhouse in T4
- Alaska Lounge in T7 opened on April 30 2018. Accepts Priority Pass (usual caveats apply, see Priority Pass Denied Entry thread). Will be open 5 AM-10 PM, except 5 AM-5 PM on Saturdays.
- No day pass access to BA lounge
AS (and VX) Moved to T7 at JFK; New Alaska Lounge (April, 2018)
Feb 6, 2019, 2:15 pm
#377
Join Date: Mar 2018
Programs: AS MVP Gold 75k, Hyatt Globalist, National Executive Elite
Posts: 272
They will stay there forever since they are one of the co-manager of T1 and the new Terminal South. No reason to move and with the flight reduction from AA they can’t and don’t depend on connecting traffic
Feb 6, 2019, 2:53 pm
#378
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There's a few ways I see this panning out:
1- Alaska moves in with JetBlue at T5/6/7
+ JetBlue is going to have the most gate space available with the new terminal, and it's clear other airlines are going to relocate there (Emirates, Icelandair, possibly Qatar.) Alaska will have access to its non-alliance partners.
- Alaska and JetBlue hate each other, and I'm pretty sure JetBlue would like to prioritize its partners rather than have a competitor who flies only the same routes squatting in its terminal, let alone opening a lounge there.
2- Alaska moves in to the new T1
+ No direct animosity with any of the airlines currently operating, and this terminal is going to be massively expanded.
- Alaska has almost no partners at this terminal aside from JAL and Korean Air. Additionally this terminal will be built primarily for international traffic with a lot of widebody gates.
3- Alaska moves in to T4
+ They'll have some space once Emirates, etc. leave for T5/6/7
- Delta already kicked them out of T4, and I'm sure with their flights relocating from T2 they'd rather use the gates for themselves.
4- Alaska squeezes in to T8
+ They'll have access to most of their partners as well as AA. No need to build a new Alaska lounge.
- If AA didn't have room for them in 2017 they sure won't have room for them now.
1- Alaska moves in with JetBlue at T5/6/7
+ JetBlue is going to have the most gate space available with the new terminal, and it's clear other airlines are going to relocate there (Emirates, Icelandair, possibly Qatar.) Alaska will have access to its non-alliance partners.
- Alaska and JetBlue hate each other, and I'm pretty sure JetBlue would like to prioritize its partners rather than have a competitor who flies only the same routes squatting in its terminal, let alone opening a lounge there.
2- Alaska moves in to the new T1
+ No direct animosity with any of the airlines currently operating, and this terminal is going to be massively expanded.
- Alaska has almost no partners at this terminal aside from JAL and Korean Air. Additionally this terminal will be built primarily for international traffic with a lot of widebody gates.
3- Alaska moves in to T4
+ They'll have some space once Emirates, etc. leave for T5/6/7
- Delta already kicked them out of T4, and I'm sure with their flights relocating from T2 they'd rather use the gates for themselves.
4- Alaska squeezes in to T8
+ They'll have access to most of their partners as well as AA. No need to build a new Alaska lounge.
- If AA didn't have room for them in 2017 they sure won't have room for them now.
Since T1 is going to get some random international carriers (I guess) I don't see why they wouldn't get AS too.
Last edited by eponymous_coward; Feb 6, 2019 at 3:00 pm
Feb 6, 2019, 3:51 pm
#379
Join Date: Apr 2003
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I would say there is no chance for Terminal 1. If there is any space left in that terminal, the most logical one to move would be Swiss which is owned by LH. Terminasl 2/3 forget it as that will be Delta/partners. Terminals 5/6/7/8 forget it. B6 is not going to add 12 widebody capable gates to accommodate AS. Terminal 8 will be full with AA, BA and other partners. The only chance will be T4 with whatever leftover space there is if any.
Feb 6, 2019, 4:00 pm
#380
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If T1 is going to be "massively expanded" as a new T1/"Terminal South" (as posited above) there should be room, shouldn't there? It would make sense to dump a lot of the random airlines over in the "here's our non-hub airlines terminal" and give DL the space for T4 to do their thing.
Are you seriously suggesting JFK's PA is going to evict an airline currently serving them with multiple daily services to multiple US destinations as part of a project to improve the airport instead of actually figuring out where to put them in? Airports generally WANT airlines to serve them. If AS wants to keep serving JFK (spoiler: they will) the PA will figure out a way to make it work.
Are you seriously suggesting JFK's PA is going to evict an airline currently serving them with multiple daily services to multiple US destinations as part of a project to improve the airport instead of actually figuring out where to put them in? Airports generally WANT airlines to serve them. If AS wants to keep serving JFK (spoiler: they will) the PA will figure out a way to make it work.
Feb 6, 2019, 8:42 pm
#381
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3,361
I would say there is no chance for Terminal 1. If there is any space left in that terminal, the most logical one to move would be Swiss which is owned by LH. Terminasl 2/3 forget it as that will be Delta/partners. Terminals 5/6/7/8 forget it. B6 is not going to add 12 widebody capable gates to accommodate AS. Terminal 8 will be full with AA, BA and other partners. The only chance will be T4 with whatever leftover space there is if any.
The wet dreams about B6 domination need to stop.
Feb 6, 2019, 11:30 pm
#382
Join Date: Apr 2003
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It has nothing to do with domination. B6 is pumping billions of dollars into new terminals. They are not going to pay all that money to hand it over to AS. They have plenty of expansion to do—especially as B6 moves into long haul flights to Europe. Neither will BA/AA; DL, or the Terminal 1 consortium spend money to accommodate a competitor. AS will end up with whatever happens to be left over after the main carriers that are forking out the money have their needs met. Thus T4 is the only possible option given all the other terminals will be owned by competitors.
Feb 7, 2019, 3:02 am
#383
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3,361
It has nothing to do with domination. B6 is pumping billions of dollars into new terminals. They are not going to pay all that money to hand it over to AS. They have plenty of expansion to do—especially as B6 moves into long haul flights to Europe. Neither will BA/AA; DL, or the Terminal 1 consortium spend money to accommodate a competitor. AS will end up with whatever happens to be left over after the main carriers that are forking out the money have their needs met. Thus T4 is the only possible option given all the other terminals will be owned by competitors.
Feb 7, 2019, 7:16 am
#384
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It has nothing to do with domination. B6 is pumping billions of dollars into new terminals. They are not going to pay all that money to hand it over to AS. They have plenty of expansion to do—especially as B6 moves into long haul flights to Europe. Neither will BA/AA; DL, or the Terminal 1 consortium spend money to accommodate a competitor. AS will end up with whatever happens to be left over after the main carriers that are forking out the money have their needs met. Thus T4 is the only possible option given all the other terminals will be owned by competitors.
Your logic is a bit curious: AS is apparently competing with a bunch of non US airlines who currently use and operate T1 but don’t fly out of JFK to US domestic destinations. But instead, they will be accommodated by Delta, who would probably be most interested in a T4 competitor flying JFK-SEA.
Last edited by eponymous_coward; Feb 7, 2019 at 7:24 am
Feb 7, 2019, 7:38 am
#385
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: NYC
Posts: 280
It has nothing to do with domination. B6 is pumping billions of dollars into new terminals. They are not going to pay all that money to hand it over to AS. They have plenty of expansion to do—especially as B6 moves into long haul flights to Europe. Neither will BA/AA; DL, or the Terminal 1 consortium spend money to accommodate a competitor. AS will end up with whatever happens to be left over after the main carriers that are forking out the money have their needs met. Thus T4 is the only possible option given all the other terminals will be owned by competitors.
Feb 7, 2019, 7:41 am
#386
Join Date: Apr 2003
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I agree with your logic but the only terminal not owned by a direct competitor would be T1. T4 is heavily owned by Delta who will likely tighten their grip as Emirates and a few other small players move out and T2 is demolished. (And Delta already gave Alaska the boot from T4.)
Feb 7, 2019, 7:44 am
#387
Join Date: Apr 2003
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Posts: 5,848
JFK is not slot controlled for much of the day. The only time with slots is the evening bank when all the flights to Europe leave which is why AS is constrained as any flight from the West Coast in daylight hours would do a turn around right at peak time. B6 is also upgaging and has other partners. They will be expanding their capacity well into the future with larger planes and more flights on their own and partner planes as they move towards longer haul service.
Feb 7, 2019, 7:46 am
#388
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I agree with your logic but the only terminal not owned by a direct competitor would be T1. T4 is heavily owned by Delta who will likely tighten their grip as Emirates and a few other small players move out and T2 is demolished. (And Delta already gave Alaska the boot from T4.)
Feb 7, 2019, 11:00 am
#389
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3,361
I agree with your logic but the only terminal not owned by a direct competitor would be T1. T4 is heavily owned by Delta who will likely tighten their grip as Emirates and a few other small players move out and T2 is demolished. (And Delta already gave Alaska the boot from T4.)
JFK is not slot controlled for much of the day. The only time with slots is the evening bank when all the flights to Europe leave which is why AS is constrained as any flight from the West Coast in daylight hours would do a turn around right at peak time. B6 is also upgaging and has other partners. They will be expanding their capacity well into the future with larger planes and more flights on their own and partner planes as they move towards longer haul service.
May 7, 2019, 7:31 am
#390
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: USA
Programs: AS MVP; UA Gold; DL Gold; Marriott Titanium
Posts: 156
Today: at T7, TSA had no dedicated pre-check screening. They were running "expedited screening" - this means - IF YOU HAVE PRE-CHECK - you can keep your shoes on and go through metal detector instead of body scanner. Computers out of bag for xray. This is the same process as done at "minor" airports, e.g., JNU, FAI, even BOS for AS gates. But at JFK - oh, my!
What's different is that at JFK T7, the TSA agent that verifies docs did NOT give out a card/flag to any pax w/ pre-check. Thus all seemed destined to have full screening. However, when I asked at the screening machines about pre-check, was told: show us your BP and you can leave shoes on, go through metal detector, etc. BUT unless I'd asked, no info offered. Really needs improvement.
Tough on my wife who had left her phone in her bag to be screened and when I found out the above, could not get it to show her BP for expedited screening. I was through and got it for her, TSA took it to her, and when she showed BP on phone, she got expedited.
So - anyone w/ pre-check at T7, take note!
There is a reason, apparently, for the weak TSA system at T7: all other airlines are int'l and TSA geared to that, not domestic business from AS.
What's different is that at JFK T7, the TSA agent that verifies docs did NOT give out a card/flag to any pax w/ pre-check. Thus all seemed destined to have full screening. However, when I asked at the screening machines about pre-check, was told: show us your BP and you can leave shoes on, go through metal detector, etc. BUT unless I'd asked, no info offered. Really needs improvement.
Tough on my wife who had left her phone in her bag to be screened and when I found out the above, could not get it to show her BP for expedited screening. I was through and got it for her, TSA took it to her, and when she showed BP on phone, she got expedited.
So - anyone w/ pre-check at T7, take note!
There is a reason, apparently, for the weak TSA system at T7: all other airlines are int'l and TSA geared to that, not domestic business from AS.