Jul 30, 2014, 2:10 am

FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides

To try to make sense of what's all happening between AS and DL, the idea arose during the recent Alaska do to create a compendium in the wiki of the various stages of the current spat. Please add your knowledge where you can!

Timeline of events:

**proposed format for new route announcements**
mm/dd/yy [date of announcement] Airline XXX-YYY [new vs changed] [frequency] dd/mm/yy [date of service/change] Airline Press Release link | FT thread/post link

2008: Delta and Northwest merge, Delta's staff takes over relationship with Alaska
06/05/09 Alaska ATL - SEA New 1x daily 23/10/09 AS Announcement | FT Thread
2011: Alaska allegedly (using data gleaned from codeshare sales) tries to lower the ratio of the fare it pays Delta on codeshare itineraries
08/10/12: The infamous "joint" Seattle press conference where Delta CEO Richard Anderson announces they will ramp up international service in Seattle (AS CEO Brad Tilden stays quiet in the background) -- DL Announcement | FT Thread
01/11/12 Alaska SLC - SEA New 2x daily 04/04/13 AS Announcement | FT Thread
25/02/13 Delta announces resumption of SEA-ANC, new SEA-LAS. Hard to find press release/news, but this site mentions it.
02/05/13 Alaska ATL - PDX New 1x daily 26/08/13 AS Announcement
01/10/13 Delta SEA - LAS Increase from 1x - 3x daily 06/01/14 -> 5x daily 01/04/14 DL Announcement | Post #1
01/10/13 Delta SEA - SFO New 6x daily 29/03/14 -> 7x daily 05/06/14 DL Announcement | Post #1
01/10/13 Delta SEA - LAX Increase from 5x - 7x daily 05/06/14 DL Announcement |Post #1
05/11/13 Delta SEA - SAN New 4x daily 02/06/14 DL Announcement | Post #77
05/11/13 Delta SEA - ANC Increase 1x to 2x daily summer seasonal 05/06/14 DL Announcement | Post #90
05/11/13 Delta SEA - PDX New 4x daily 02/09/14 DL Announcement | Post #77
06/12/13 Alaska SLC - PDX 09/06/14 AS Announcement | FT Thread
06/12/13 Alaska SLC - SAN 10/06/14 AS Announcement | FT Thread
06/12/13 Alaska SLC - LAX 11/06/14 AS Announcement | FT Thread
06/12/13 Alaska SLC - SJC 12/06/14 AS Announcement | FT Thread
17/12/13 Delta SEA - ANC 29/05/14 (increased from 2x-3x daily) Thread [link needed] DL Announcement
17/12/13 Delta SEA - JNU 29/05/14 Thread [link needed] DL Announcement | Post #268
17/12/13 Delta SEA - SJC 29/05/14 Thread [link needed] DL Announcement
20/12/13 Alaska SLC - BOI 16/06/14 New 1x Daily AS Announcement
20/12/13 Alaska SLC - LAS 16/06/14 New 2x Daily AS Announcement
20/12/13 Alaska SLC - SFO 18/06/14 New 1x Daily AS Announcement
10/02/14 Delta PHX - SEA 20/12/14 New 5x Daily CRJ-900 DL Announcement
10/02/14 Delta PSP - SEA 20/12/14 New 1x Daily CRJ-900 Winter Season DL Announcement
10/02/14 Delta TUS - SEA 20/12/14 New Saturday CRJ-900 Winter Season DL Announcement
10/02/14 Delta HNL - SEA 20/12/14 Increase 1x to 2x Daily 757-200/757-300 DL Announcement
11/02/14 Alaska DTW - SEA 04/09/14 New 1x Daily AS Announcement
11/02/14 Alaska MSY - SEA 12/06/14 New 1x Daily 737-800 AS Announcement
11/02/14 Alaska SEA - TPA 20/06/14 New 1x Daily 737-800 AS Announcement
26/02/14 Delta Delta changes SkyMiles to revenue based points/miles DL Announcement
28/03/14 Alaska BWI - SEA 02/09/14 New 1x Daily 737-800 AS Announcement
28/03/14 Alaska ABQ - SEA 18/09/14 New 1x Daily 737-800 AS Announcement
28/03/14 Alaska ATL - PDX 01/09/14 Discontinued 1x Daily 737-800 AS Announcement
17/03/14 Delta BOI - LAX 05/16/14 New 1x Daily E-175 DL Announcement
09/05/14 Alaska CUN - SEA 06/11/14 New 1x Daily 737-800 Seasonal AS Announcement
27/05/14 Delta GEG - SEA 03/11/14 New 4x Daily CRJ-700 DL Announcement
27/05/14 Delta SEA - YYC 03/11/14 New 2x Daily E-175 DL Announcement
27/05/14 Delta OGG - SEA 20/12/14 New 1x Daily 757-200 DL Announcement
27/05/14 Delta BZN - SEA 20/12/14 New Saturday E-175 Winter Season (Flight will op 1x Daily from 20/12/14-04/01/15) DL Announcement
27/05/14 Delta SEA - SJD 20/12/14 New Saturday A319 Winter Season DL Announcement
27/05/14 Delta PVR - SEA 20/12/14 New Saturday A319 Winter Season DL Announcement
27/05/14 Alaska Announces 11% increase in SEA flying for Spring 2015 AS Announcement
27/05/14 Alaska BOI - SEA 08/03/15 increase from 8x to 9x Daily Q400 AS Announcement
27/05/14 Alaska BOS - SEA 08/03/15 increase from 2x to 3x Daily 737-800/737-900 AS Announcement
27/05/14 Alaska ORD - SEA 08/03/15 increase from 3x to 4x Daily 737-800/737-900 AS Announcement
27/05/14 Alaska DEN - SEA 08/03/15 increase from 4x to 5x Daily 737 AS Announcement
27/05/14 Alaska FAI - SEA 08/03/15 increase from 3x to 4x Daily 737 AS Announcement
27/05/14 Alaska PSP - SEA 08/03/15 increase from 3x to 4x Daily 737 Seasonal AS Announcement
27/05/14 Alaska SEA - SMF 08/03/15 increase from 5x to 6x Daily 737 AS Announcement
27/05/14 Alaska LAX - SEA 08/03/15 increase from 12x to 13x Daily 737 AS Announcement
27/05/14 Alaska PDX - SEA 08/03/15 increase from 24x to 27x Daily Q400 AS Announcement
27/05/14 Alaska GEG - SEA 08/03/15 replace 2x Daily Q400 with 737 AS Announcement
27/05/14 Alaska SEA - SNA 08/03/15 increase from 7x to 8x Daily 737-700/737-800 AS Announcement
08/07/14 Alaska PDX - SJD 03/11/14 New 4x Weekly 737-800/737-900 Seasonal AS Announcement
08/07/14 Alaska PDX - PVR 04/11/14 New 3x Weekly 737-800/737-900 Seasonal AS Announcement
13/11/14 Alaska IAD - SEA 11/03/15 New 1x Daily 737-800/737-900 AS Announcement
14/11/14 Delta seeks 30 (!) gates at SEA Bloomberg story
19/11/14 Delta adds SEA-DEN/BOI/SMF/KTN/SIT Summer '15 DL Press Release | FT Thread
11/25/14 Alaska Adds SEA-MKE NEW daily E-175 starting July 1, 2015 AS Press Release
11/25/14 Alaska Adds SEA-OKC NEW daily E-175 starting July 1, 2015 AS Press Release
22/02/15 Delta Announces 717 service to operate on SEA-LAX/LAS/PHX flights DL Press Release and then pulls LAS/PHX service back to regional jets. LAX service remains on 737 equipment (Delta.com)
22/02/15 Delta Extends SEA-JNU to year round service using CRJ-900 outside of summer DL Press Release
22/02/15 Delta Extends SEA-FAI to year round service using E-175 outside of summer DL Press Release
22/02/15 Delta Extends SEA-PVR/SJD seasonal Saturday service to October 3, 2015 DL Press Release and then pulls it back to start December 19, 2015 (Delta.com)
22/02/15 Delta Adds 2nd SEA-PSP seasonal flight CRJ-700 starting December 19, 2015DL Press Release
22/02/15 Delta Increases seasonal SEA-TUS Saturday flight to Daily using CRJ-700 starting December 19, 2015DL Press Release
22/02/15 Delta Adds SEA-KOA NEW daily 757-200 starting December 19, 2015DL Press Release
10/03/15 Alaska Adds SEA-JFK NEW daily 737-800 starting September 16, 2015 AS Press Release
28/04/15 Alaska Adds SEA-BNA NEW daily 737-800 starting September 23, 2015 AS Press Release
28/04/15 Alaska Adds SEA-RDU NEW daily 737-800 starting October 1, 2015 AS Press Release
28/04/15 Alaska Adds SEA-CHS NEW 4x/weekly 737-800 starting November 16, 2015 AS Press Release
14/05/15 Alaska Announces Preferred Plus Seating options AS Press Release
26/05/15 Delta Adds SEA-BZN Daily year round CRJ-700 on Aug 1, 2015 DL Press Release
26/05/15 Delta Adds SEA-PSC NEW 3x/day CRJ-700 on Nov 1, 2015 DL Press Release
26/05/15 Delta Adds SEA-MCO NEW 1x/day 757-200 on Dec 19, 2015 DL Press Release
26/05/15 Delta Adds SEA-BOS NEW 1x/day 737-800 on April 4, 2016 DL Press Release
26/05/15 Delta Adds SEA-YYJ NEW 3x/day CRJ-700 on April 4, 2016 DL Press Release
26/05/15 Delta Announces end to SEA-HND (Tokyo Haneda) service effective September 30. Route authority to be transferred to American to operate Los Angeles - Haneda. Seattle Times
07/22/15 Alaska announces partnership with Hainan Airlines which will reduce dependence on Delta for traffic to/from Asia AS Announcement | FT Thread
08/05/15 Alaska announces Boardroom members can access American Admirals Club starting 15 Aug and on 17 Oct that Former US Airways flights will be eligible for earn and burn miles FT Thread
09/22/15 Alaska announces partnership with Icelandair Icelandair Announcement
10/22/15 Alaska Opens New North Satellite Boardroom. AS Press Release
10/22/15 Alaska Alaska announces codeshare agreement with Emirates. AS Press Release
12/18/15 Delta Adds SEA-MSO, SEA-BIL and SEA-YEG NEW with CRJ-900/700 equipment operated by Skywest Routesonline (MSO) Routesonline (BIL) Routesonline (YEG)
01/01/16 Alaska and Delta: no more reciprocal Board Room/Sky Club Benefits
04/04/16 Alaska Alaska Air Group announces acquisition of Virgin America (Pending Government Approval). AS Press Release
05/10/16 Alaska Announces Japan Airlines as new Mileage Plan Member and codeshare partner. AS Press Release
05/11/16 DL adds Shuttle Service to Seattle (SFO and LAX)
06/21/16 Delta Will switch SEA-LHR from Delta to Virgin Atlantic using 787-9 starting March 26, 2017. Delta's 767-300ER will be reallocated seasonally to a 4x/week service on PDX-LHR from May 26, 2107-Oct 29, 2017. DL Press Release
06/21/16 Delta Add SEA-SUN Daily Dec 21, 2016-Jan 2, 2017 and Saturday's only from Jan 7-Mar 25, 2017 with CRJ-700. Routesonline | Delta.com
06/29/16 Alaska Adds SEA-SBP (San Luis Obispo) Daily year round E175 operated by SkyWest on April 17, 2017. AS Press Release
07/13/16 Alaska Adding seasonal flights to SEA-SUN. Double Daily Q400 Dec 16-Jan 2 and an added Sat/Sun from Feb 18-Mar 26, 2017. AS Press Release
07/21/16 Alaska Increasing SEA-EWR to 3 Daily flights with 737 starting May 14, 2017. AS Press Release
07/21/16 Alaska Adds SEA-ICT (Wichita) NEW daily E175 operated by SkyWest starting April 13, 2017. AS Press Release
07/21/16 Alaska Adds SEA-IND (Indianapolis) NEW daily 737 starting May 14, 2017. AS Press Release
08/14/16 Delta Adds 2nd SEA-BOS Daily 737-800 starting June 8, 2017. DL Press Release | Routesonline
08/14/16 Delta Adds SEA-EUG NEW 3x daily CRJ-700 starting April 1, 2017. Routesonline
08/14/16 Delta Adds SEA-RDU NEW daily 737-800 starting June 8, 2017. Routesonline
08/31/16 Delta discontinues SEA-BIL nonstop flights. Delta.com
08/31/16 Delta discontinues SEA-JNU from year round to seasonal until May 19, 2017. Delta.com
09/05/16 Delta discontinues SEA-MSO and SEA-BZN nonstop flights. Delta.com
10/21/2016 Delta opens a beautiful, spacious, new lounge at SeaTac, further showing how uninspiring the Board Rooms are.
3/2/2020 Delta (re)adds SEA-LHR, adds SEA-CMH, SEA-DFW, more frequencies on existing routes. Delta.com
Further chronology? Please add! Loss of benefits, etc.

DL Encroaches Further on AS' Turf - Master Thread

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Mar 8, 2019, 7:17 am

#3016

sfozrhfco

Join Date: Apr 2003

Programs: B6 Mosaic, Bonvoy LT Titanium (x SPG LT), IHG Spire, UA Silver

Posts: 5,846

Quote:

Originally Posted by WesternCDN

Delta is cutting their 3x daily YYJ-SEA flights at the end of summer, and just flew their last YEG-SEA flight at the beginning of Mar. Both routes cancelled due to low yield/underperformance. Wonder if the DL plan to consolidate flying into only 3 regionals had any effect? Or if we'll see them pull out of any previously AS only routes?

Delta and WestJet have a joint venture now. Anything worth serving from those cities can be passed along to them. If neither see continuing service as being worth it the routes will be dropped.

Mar 8, 2019, 7:31 am

#3017

eponymous_coward

FlyerTalk Evangelist

Join Date: Aug 2007

Location: SEA, but up and down the coast a lot

Programs: Oceanic Airlines Gold Elite

Posts: 20,385

I guess WS could go all Q400 on those routes using Encore, but so much for the unstoppable DL behemoth.

WesternCDN likes this.

Mar 8, 2019, 10:39 am

#3018

ashill

Join Date: Apr 2009

Location: YYF/YLW

Programs: AA, DL, AS, VA, WS Silver

Posts: 5,950

Quote:

Originally Posted by sfozrhfco

Delta and WestJet have a joint venture now. Anything worth serving from those cities can be passed along to them. If neither see continuing service as being worth it the routes will be dropped.

You would think WS would make it easier, not harder, for one or the other to maintain service from YEG and YYJ into DL's SEA hub, with WS helping on the Canadian point of sale side.

WesternCDN likes this.

Dec 16, 2019, 12:07 pm

#3019

rustykettel

Join Date: Oct 2015

Location: Pacific Wonderland

Programs: ʙᴏɴᴠo̱ʏ Au, IHG Au, HH Dia, Nexus, Pilot FlyingJ Preferred

Posts: 5,336

Looking at A.net's weekly OAG update, DL is adding ATL service to GEG and BOI. Interesting that DL feels these markets can support transcon hub service, given how relatively close both are to existing hubs.

Dec 16, 2019, 12:38 pm

#3020

jrl767

FlyerTalk Evangelist

Join Date: Nov 2009

Location: SEA (the REAL Washington); occasionally in the other Washington (DCA area)

Programs: DL PM 1.57MM; AS MVPG 100K

Posts: 21,368

Quote:

Originally Posted by rustykettel

... DL is adding ATL service to GEG and BOI. Interesting that DL feels these markets can support transcon hub service, given how relatively close both are to existing hubs.

discussion in the DL forum

I'm thinking they're actually trying to free up ATL<-->SEA seats that would otherwise be unavailable for cruise ship traffic (at least for Apr thru Sep)

Dec 16, 2019, 2:16 pm

#3021

eponymous_coward

FlyerTalk Evangelist

Join Date: Aug 2007

Location: SEA, but up and down the coast a lot

Programs: Oceanic Airlines Gold Elite

Posts: 20,385

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrl767

discussion in the DL forum

I'm thinking they're actually trying to free up ATL<-->SEA seats that would otherwise be unavailable for cruise ship traffic (at least for Apr thru Sep)

It's also likely competitive with AA doing BOI/GEG-DFW.

Mar 2, 2020, 5:53 pm

#3022

eponymous_coward

FlyerTalk Evangelist

Join Date: Aug 2007

Location: SEA, but up and down the coast a lot

Programs: Oceanic Airlines Gold Elite

Posts: 20,385

MOAR SHOTS FIRED!

(DFW, CMH, restart LHR)

It's going to be a fun time in SEA with some pricing wars ahead...

Mar 2, 2020, 6:34 pm

#3023

dayone

Moderator: Alaska Mileage Plan

Join Date: Feb 2005

Posts: 12,313

With the recent AS-AA (re)link-up, the DFW and LHR flights seem to be more than a coincidence.

eponymous_coward likes this.

Mar 2, 2020, 8:26 pm

#3024

Tide_from_PAE

Join Date: Jun 2009

Location: SEA, PAE, BLI

Programs: WN A-List Preferred, AS, DL Kryptonium

Posts: 1,604

Quote:

Originally Posted by eponymous_coward

MOAR SHOTS FIRED!

(DFW, CMH, restart LHR)

It's going to be a fun time in SEA with some pricing wars ahead...

Technically, DL is resuming SEA-DFW after discontinuing service around the time it closed the DFW hub circa 2004.

We'll see how low prices go on these routes or if DL starts offering connections through these cities. Maybe DL will copy Sun Country and announce SEA-MSN as well.

Meanwhile, fares on SEA-ATL tend to be very high.

Mar 3, 2020, 9:02 am

#3025

Klrduks

Join Date: Sep 2014

Programs: Alaska MM, AA MM, BA Silver, Bonvoy Lifetime Gold

Posts: 321

I'm just wondering where all these new flights are going to park. I guess Delta will have to start their own bus gates. :-)

Mar 3, 2020, 10:17 am

#3026

jrl767

FlyerTalk Evangelist

Join Date: Nov 2009

Location: SEA (the REAL Washington); occasionally in the other Washington (DCA area)

Programs: DL PM 1.57MM; AS MVPG 100K

Posts: 21,368

actually there are already bus gate provisions at the south end of the A concourse (A20-A22?); I believe they're most often used for AC flights to YVR/YYJ, but I've seen a few DL E75s parked with the AS jets on the remote stands by the cargo area and the tower

Klrduks likes this.

Mar 4, 2020, 10:09 am

#3027

sullim4

Join Date: May 2005

Location: SEA

Programs: AS; Hyatt Globalist; Hilton Gold; NEXUS

Posts: 977

Quote:

Originally Posted by dayone

With the recent AS-AA (re)link-up, the DFW and LHR flights seem to be more than a coincidence.

I actually think DL has been pretty smart with their SEA expansion to this point... but these moves feel like losers.

This is going to be way too many seats to LHR from SEA way too fast imo. This makes four airlines with service to LHR (AA, BA with 2x, DL, VS) + Norwegian's seasonal service to LGW. Maybe BA cuts one of their flights to make room for AA, who knows, but still... this is likely a great way to get cheap seats. The premium cabins in particular might yield some interesting deals.

When going to Europe I actually prefer the DL flights to AMS since you can clear Schengen on the connection and it's just a much more pleasant experience compared to LHR. Unless DL intends to feed VS flights, this must be mostly traffic headed to London... is there really that much from SEA? Why not just increase service to AMS or CDG (or, try feeding Alitalia with FCO service)?

As far as DFW... I get the feeling this is going to get axed within months of starting. AA is going to kill them on frequency and AS has service to DAL... so all this does is possibly force AA to cut prices on O/D traffic for flights that leave near the time DL plans to schedule their service.

Mar 4, 2020, 10:36 am

#3028

ashill

Join Date: Apr 2009

Location: YYF/YLW

Programs: AA, DL, AS, VA, WS Silver

Posts: 5,950

Quote:

Originally Posted by sullim4

DFW and LHR to me seem like classic turf-defending moves. DL considers SEA their turf (at least for long haul flights), and LHR is also a DL (joint venture) hub, so SEA-LHR is a hub-to-hub route for DL. AA is going after their turf, so they're responding by going after AA's turf. Turf defending moves don't always make sense.

Mar 4, 2020, 11:49 am

#3029

Bretmd

Join Date: Mar 2015

Location: SEA

Programs: AS MVP , Delta Gold Medallion, "Credit Card" status for various hotels

Posts: 672

Quote:

Originally Posted by sullim4

I agree that DFW will be a money loser, but I think it’s here to stay, similar to DEN or ORD. Delta needs to serve this route to be relevant to local travelers in SEA. IMO it was probably an inevitable decision and the AA/AS announcement sealed the deal.

Mar 4, 2020, 12:41 pm

#3030

flatdawgs

Join Date: Nov 2014

Location: SEA and wherever else I can get to

Programs: AS MVPG -> MVP -> now nothing, DL SM, Global Entry

Posts: 62

The closest DL route (assuming a stop) from DFW to Asia is via SEA - yes, a hair closer than via SLC or MSP. If this flight feeds their Asia bank it might be quite useful in that regard.

Last edited by flatdawgs; Mar 4, 2020 at 12:43 pm Reason: add MSP