The expectation/entitlement of an upgrade
Oct 16, 22, 11:24 am
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Sun Peaks, Taupo, London
Programs: NZ Elite, AC SE100K, Westjet Gold, Marriott Bonvoy Gold Elite, Nexus, Global Entry
Posts: 5,963
The expectation/entitlement of an upgrade
In the last week or so I have read a couple of comments about RU's being worthless:
Just got this info from a colleague who headed to the states:
Date 15 Oct
Route AKL-IAH
Class upgrade: PE- BP
Type of upgrade: 1x Recognition
Status: Gold
Result: Didn't clear, flight was very loaded
He's heading back from LAX next week and has another PE-BP pending...doesn't seem likely!
Seriously need some remit from Air NZ for these upgrades that seem virtually worthless at the moment, especially for those who only take one or two long hauls per year
and
The RU was lodged when I hit Silver in Jun. I have also recently provide some feedback to AirNZ using MyVoice where I specifically noted that the failure rate of RUs was making them essentially worthless, and my experience was in common with many fellow travellers I have chatted with.
I have had 6 RUs all fail since Jun, all attempts for 2xRU Y->BP. First 4 were gifted, and then tried my own 2x Gold RUs.
I have always maintained that upgrades are an opportunity to be upgraded but not an entitlement.
If BP is so important to someone, then buy it. If you can't afford it or prefer to not part with the money, then you can only hope to be upgraded and consider it a huge bonus if it comes through.
As a GE, I always get to use my RUs and often some APD's as well and for that I am grateful.
Whining about not getting a free widget due to the business actually selling their widget is a seriously bad look.
Just got this info from a colleague who headed to the states:
Date 15 Oct
Route AKL-IAH
Class upgrade: PE- BP
Type of upgrade: 1x Recognition
Status: Gold
Result: Didn't clear, flight was very loaded
He's heading back from LAX next week and has another PE-BP pending...doesn't seem likely!
Seriously need some remit from Air NZ for these upgrades that seem virtually worthless at the moment, especially for those who only take one or two long hauls per year
and
The RU was lodged when I hit Silver in Jun. I have also recently provide some feedback to AirNZ using MyVoice where I specifically noted that the failure rate of RUs was making them essentially worthless, and my experience was in common with many fellow travellers I have chatted with.
I have had 6 RUs all fail since Jun, all attempts for 2xRU Y->BP. First 4 were gifted, and then tried my own 2x Gold RUs.
I have always maintained that upgrades are an opportunity to be upgraded but not an entitlement.
If BP is so important to someone, then buy it. If you can't afford it or prefer to not part with the money, then you can only hope to be upgraded and consider it a huge bonus if it comes through.
As a GE, I always get to use my RUs and often some APD's as well and for that I am grateful.
Whining about not getting a free widget due to the business actually selling their widget is a seriously bad look.
Oct 16, 22, 12:38 pm
#2
Join Date: May 2008
Location: MSP
Programs: DL Plat, NZ Elite, QF Plat
Posts: 1,763
I definitely see where you are coming from, but also can see the other side of the story too.
If you were using say Elite APD as your upgrade source then absolutely if it doesnt clear then it doesnt clear. Youre not using an instrument that was given to you as a defined benefit of your status - youre just using earned APD. Just like if I was using QF points for an upgrade, sometimes I win and sometimes I lose, but QF dont give me upgrades as part of my status with them.
However I do think there is something to be said for when a major benefit of a status (RUs) becomes harder to use. Its not through any fault of Air NZ as literally demand for PE and BP has significantly increased, leading to far fewer upgrades clearing. But that benefit has actually been devalued in the eye of the customer and as a business thats something that needs to be resolved. They could say oh well too bad, flights are full. But if youre a savvy marketer then what customers perceive becomes your reality even if thats not the case. So they really should be doing something about it (I dont know what that is) to show customers there is still value in RUs
If you were using say Elite APD as your upgrade source then absolutely if it doesnt clear then it doesnt clear. Youre not using an instrument that was given to you as a defined benefit of your status - youre just using earned APD. Just like if I was using QF points for an upgrade, sometimes I win and sometimes I lose, but QF dont give me upgrades as part of my status with them.
However I do think there is something to be said for when a major benefit of a status (RUs) becomes harder to use. Its not through any fault of Air NZ as literally demand for PE and BP has significantly increased, leading to far fewer upgrades clearing. But that benefit has actually been devalued in the eye of the customer and as a business thats something that needs to be resolved. They could say oh well too bad, flights are full. But if youre a savvy marketer then what customers perceive becomes your reality even if thats not the case. So they really should be doing something about it (I dont know what that is) to show customers there is still value in RUs
Oct 16, 22, 2:10 pm
#3
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: WLG/BKK
Programs: TG*G, NZ*GE, QF G, Accor Gold
Posts: 9,592
In the last week or so I have read a couple of comments about RU's being worthless:
Just got this info from a colleague who headed to the states:
Date 15 Oct
Route AKL-IAH
Class upgrade: PE- BP
Type of upgrade: 1x Recognition
Status: Gold
Result: Didn't clear, flight was very loaded
He's heading back from LAX next week and has another PE-BP pending...doesn't seem likely!
Seriously need some remit from Air NZ for these upgrades that seem virtually worthless at the moment, especially for those who only take one or two long hauls per year
and
The RU was lodged when I hit Silver in Jun. I have also recently provide some feedback to AirNZ using MyVoice where I specifically noted that the failure rate of RUs was making them essentially worthless, and my experience was in common with many fellow travellers I have chatted with.
I have had 6 RUs all fail since Jun, all attempts for 2xRU Y->BP. First 4 were gifted, and then tried my own 2x Gold RUs.
I have always maintained that upgrades are an opportunity to be upgraded but not an entitlement.
If BP is so important to someone, then buy it. If you can't afford it or prefer to not part with the money, then you can only hope to be upgraded and consider it a huge bonus if it comes through.
As a GE, I always get to use my RUs and often some APD's as well and for that I am grateful.
Whining about not getting a free widget due to the business actually selling their widget is a seriously bad look.
Just got this info from a colleague who headed to the states:
Date 15 Oct
Route AKL-IAH
Class upgrade: PE- BP
Type of upgrade: 1x Recognition
Status: Gold
Result: Didn't clear, flight was very loaded
He's heading back from LAX next week and has another PE-BP pending...doesn't seem likely!
Seriously need some remit from Air NZ for these upgrades that seem virtually worthless at the moment, especially for those who only take one or two long hauls per year
and
The RU was lodged when I hit Silver in Jun. I have also recently provide some feedback to AirNZ using MyVoice where I specifically noted that the failure rate of RUs was making them essentially worthless, and my experience was in common with many fellow travellers I have chatted with.
I have had 6 RUs all fail since Jun, all attempts for 2xRU Y->BP. First 4 were gifted, and then tried my own 2x Gold RUs.
I have always maintained that upgrades are an opportunity to be upgraded but not an entitlement.
If BP is so important to someone, then buy it. If you can't afford it or prefer to not part with the money, then you can only hope to be upgraded and consider it a huge bonus if it comes through.
As a GE, I always get to use my RUs and often some APD's as well and for that I am grateful.
Whining about not getting a free widget due to the business actually selling their widget is a seriously bad look.
- You are welcome to your opinions on RUs. But so are other posters. Opinions can range from logical and well-informed by facts, thru to emotional rants
- AirNZ states: "Elite, Gold and Silver Airpoints™ members receive Recognition Upgrades each membership year, as a thank you from us for your ongoing loyalty."
- A review/scan of the RU clearance thread indicates that for Golds, the success rate of RU clearance has diminished
- My own experience of zero success from 6 sectors is in alignment with this review
- I consider that providing feedback using the channel that AirNZ provides is apposite for the circumstances.
- If there is no value received from a component of a loyalty program (eg a RU), then it is subjectively (and probably factually) 'worthless' to the customer
- If AirNZ is unable to clear RUs historic rates (for example), they could offer an alternative as a "thank you for customer loyalty" (eg a domestic return flight)
- As a consequence of customer complaint, Qantas released additional frequent flyer award/upgrade seats
- Ad hominen commentary is also "a seriously bad look"
.
Last edited by Thai-Kiwi; Oct 16, 22 at 4:14 pm
Oct 16, 22, 3:25 pm
#4
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 5,984
The issue appears to be that, save for these upgrades, there is little valuable benefit for Airpoints status members receive over just holding a membership of the Koru Club (as it was formerly known).
You have to wait in the same lines to check-in the same number of pieces of luggage, to enter the same lounge, to board the same space+ seating and to collect the same priority-level checked luggage. You also earn the same number of points in a rebate scheme that could not exactly be described as generous.
You have to wait in the same lines to check-in the same number of pieces of luggage, to enter the same lounge, to board the same space+ seating and to collect the same priority-level checked luggage. You also earn the same number of points in a rebate scheme that could not exactly be described as generous.
Oct 16, 22, 4:07 pm
#5
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: San Francisco, CA
Programs: NZ *E
Posts: 318
Yeah, as said above the recognition upgrades are ultimately the only benefit of maintaining status with AirNZ.
In the past you could argue a benefit was differentiated service on board but in the past few years this is no longer a thing as the number of members has swelled.
I also find myself not using the lounges in AKL as much as the past given the over crowding.
In the past you could argue a benefit was differentiated service on board but in the past few years this is no longer a thing as the number of members has swelled.
I also find myself not using the lounges in AKL as much as the past given the over crowding.
Oct 16, 22, 4:14 pm
#6
Join Date: Nov 2012
Programs: NZ GE, QF
Posts: 360
Yeah, as said above the recognition upgrades are ultimately the only benefit of maintaining status with AirNZ.
In the past you could argue a benefit was differentiated service on board but in the past few years this is no longer a thing as the number of members has swelled.
I also find myself not using the lounges in AKL as much as the past given the over crowding.
In the past you could argue a benefit was differentiated service on board but in the past few years this is no longer a thing as the number of members has swelled.
I also find myself not using the lounges in AKL as much as the past given the over crowding.
Oct 16, 22, 4:29 pm
#7
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 2,455
If you aren't getting RUs clearing and fly mostly AirNZ Koru Club membership gives you pretty much the same.
And internationally elite is still *A Gold. Think *A stopped their investigation of a tier abive gold.
In Aussie don't seem to get fast track anymore.
Wonder if there business only longue in Auckland has been shelved or not. As giving elite access to that would at least differentiate from Koru club.
Is Koru to good maybe? Maybe give Koru access to seats at t-48h?
And internationally elite is still *A Gold. Think *A stopped their investigation of a tier abive gold.
In Aussie don't seem to get fast track anymore.
Wonder if there business only longue in Auckland has been shelved or not. As giving elite access to that would at least differentiate from Koru club.
Is Koru to good maybe? Maybe give Koru access to seats at t-48h?
Oct 16, 22, 5:20 pm
#8
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NZ
Programs: NZ*E, QF-G, EK-P
Posts: 555
Lack of access to upgrades is a major devaluation. I accept it is subject to availability but why offer it as a benefit if it is essentially unavailable for the bulk of your eligible customers. I understand why, Im not angry, a bit frustrated maybe but it is what it is.
But I have changed my behaviour accordingly. I previously used to earn 3500-4500 SP per year. Most of my business trips are to the UK.
I can currently get there in F on QF, EK or SQ for the same or even cheaper. So have requalified with NZ and now enjoying the F experience.
A reward for loyalty isnt a reward if it is worthless.
But I have changed my behaviour accordingly. I previously used to earn 3500-4500 SP per year. Most of my business trips are to the UK.
I can currently get there in F on QF, EK or SQ for the same or even cheaper. So have requalified with NZ and now enjoying the F experience.
A reward for loyalty isnt a reward if it is worthless.
Oct 16, 22, 5:26 pm
#9
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: New Zealand (most of the time)
Programs: Air NZ Elite *G, Honors Gold, IHG Platinum Elite
Posts: 5,903
Why not offer everybody a free domestic or TT flight (probably need to still make pax pay tax to make this fair) or do something about the screwed up married fares that make flying short haul to Oz via AKL impossible? Let somebody book say WLG-SYD and then let them use an upgrade to BP which also covers the domestic add-on.
Oct 16, 22, 5:42 pm
#10
Join Date: Mar 2019
Programs: NZ Elite
Posts: 167
Perhaps I have been very lucky with upgrades, when my return flights to HNL, AKL- NAN and AKL-PER cleared immediately when booking for travel between April - September this year. All from PE - BP. Have no expectations of that happening for my flights during Xmas to see family in the US.
But like @bce1 mentions, I only earn the bare minimum required on NZ to retain elite and rest is on other *A flights. Sharp J/ F pricing and just something different to NZ product wise.
But like @bce1 mentions, I only earn the bare minimum required on NZ to retain elite and rest is on other *A flights. Sharp J/ F pricing and just something different to NZ product wise.
Oct 16, 22, 6:03 pm
#11
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Christchurch, New Zealand
Programs: NZ Elite; QF Platinum; CZ Gold; MU Platinum; Marriott Titanium; Accor Platinum
Posts: 1,431
If you can stomach JQ domestic (as long as you book the fare that gets status points on QF) aim for Plat with QF, get access to the amazing First lounges in Sydney and Melbourne! And i find seat 4F (first row of Y on trans tasman on their narrowbody from CHC) to be far superior to any seat NZ offers on their all Y transtasman from CHC, IMO opinion 4F on QF is better than the first row NZ works deluxe seats which are narrow and have restricted legroom (the QF seat is behind a J seat not a bulkhead so you can stretch out your legs). On and they dont have the naff system with some people getting food and others not that NZ has.
I have a bunch of banked years (think six or so) so may just suffer JQ for my domestic CHC-AKL flights next year!
I have a bunch of banked years (think six or so) so may just suffer JQ for my domestic CHC-AKL flights next year!
Oct 16, 22, 6:38 pm
#13
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Christchurch, New Zealand
Programs: NZ Elite; QF Platinum; CZ Gold; MU Platinum; Marriott Titanium; Accor Platinum
Posts: 1,431
agree entirely! Airpoints are so hard to earn and burn is high, and upgrades and R class were one of the best benefits. If that is now much more difficult to use look elsewhere. Problem is that in NZ they are effectively a monopoly player bar a few routes
Oct 16, 22, 7:53 pm
#14
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Sydney, Australia
Programs: NZ*G ELT, VA-G
Posts: 3,504
When the last major revamp took place, the only benefit that was left was the RU's in that you can score a relatively cheap Economy fare to upgrade to Business which gives the best value. Now that benefit has all but gone given how full the premium cabins are and Economy fares are also no longer cheap. I just bought a AU$5500 return fare from SYD to LHR in their The Room Business cabin for next European summer. Why on earth would I still gamble RU's to potentially not being able to upgrade to a very outdated Business product.
For a long time, the structure of the Airpoints programme means that it's no more than a Flybuys or a buy 10 and get 1 free coffee club. If they need loyalty, they need to bring back X, I classes and behave like a real FFP. Unfortunately any change would have to wait as the loyalty manager is on maternity leave. I have nothing against her but to hear that an airline holding a project back because 1 person is on long term leave when a part of the business needed her the most, is just astonishing.
For a long time, the structure of the Airpoints programme means that it's no more than a Flybuys or a buy 10 and get 1 free coffee club. If they need loyalty, they need to bring back X, I classes and behave like a real FFP. Unfortunately any change would have to wait as the loyalty manager is on maternity leave. I have nothing against her but to hear that an airline holding a project back because 1 person is on long term leave when a part of the business needed her the most, is just astonishing.
Oct 16, 22, 8:23 pm
#15
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Christchurch, New Zealand
Programs: NZ Elite; QF Platinum; CZ Gold; MU Platinum; Marriott Titanium; Accor Platinum
Posts: 1,431
