Refunds for suspended flights

Old Mar 25, 2020, 2:04 am
  #106  
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
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Originally Posted by rienhart87
Hi guys, I have a few questions about claiming for refund or getting flight credits. I hope this is the correct thread as this is my first Air New Zealand flight ever.

So I booked a return flight from Singapore to Auckland on March 13 and Auckland to Singapore on March 23. I booked this flight on Feb 2. Separately, my travel partner booked a return flight Auckland to Papeete on March 16 and Papeete Auckland on March 22 (to connect with my flight back to Singapore) with Qantas but the operating carrier is Air Tahiti Nui.

I flew with NZ on the Singapore to Auckland portion. It was a great fight in Premium Economy, much better than Cathay's or SQ's Premium economy experience. I heard good reviews about Air New Zealand before, but only when I flew with them I realized how good they are. I also flew from Auckland to Papeete with Air Tahiti Nui. Also a great flight. On March 18, my friends and I had a discussion and we decided to cut our travel plan short. Initially we would still be in Tahiti until March 22 but we decided it was time to go back home (for me to Dubai) seeing more and more governments closing their borders to foreigners. So we checked online and we found that Air New Zealand had a flight on March 20 from Papeete back to Auckland. On March 19, We decided to cancel our Air Tahiti Nui flight and book this Air New Zealand flight and I decided to bring forward my Auckland-Singapore leg from March 23 to March 21 so that I will only be transiting in Auckland as the govt had closed the border for non-NZ citizens. We called Air New Zealand French Polynesia office and the very kind agent who picked up our call confirmed that we can transit in Auckland on March 21, the agent also confirmed that she can connect this new booking with my existing AKL-SIN booking and she moved this flight for me to my desired date of March 21 without any fee.

Great! We all thought that we are good to go. My friend checked the news constantly, he sent DM to Auckland Airport's, he sent twitter message to Immigration new zealand, etc. all attempts to assure and confirm that as foreigners, we would still be allowed to transit in Auckland. All of us had no intention to clear immigration. March 19 evening, we came to Papeete airport to check in for NZ43 that departed at around 2AM March 20. When it was our turn to be called to the check in desk, the first thing that the agent asked us was "are you new zealanders?" to which we replied "no, I am Indonesian, he is French, he is German, etc". Then she swiftly produced a piece of white paper and asked us to read it and simultaneously said "sorry I can't check you in, you are not flying tonight, the govt said no more transiting". We were very shocked. I looked around and I realized that I was not the only one who got denied to fly that night. Almost every pax except the NZ citizens and a few Australians managed to check-in but I would say 1/2 or even 2/3 of the pax were denied.

We then produced different evidences that we had as proofs that we could transit in Auckland but definitely to no avail. This is where things get tricky.

Air New Zealand check-in agent that handled us refused to do anything. She said there is nothing that she can do. We asked what will happen to our connecting flights from Auckland, in this case the AKL-SIN that I had, my friend had AKL-SIN as well but with SQ, etc. She just kept on saying she did not know, go online, everything is posted online, there is nothing she can do. We asked her to help rebook us on Air Tahiti Nui flight (TN78 from Papeete to Tokyo) that was departing 40 mins before the air new zealand flight. She said she can't do that, there is no agreement between Air Tahiti Nui and Air New Zealand. We asked her for a refund, she said she can't do that. We proved to her that there was no attempt from air new zealand to warn us that we could not fly anymore, there was no phone call, there was no e-mail to warn us, even when we used the 'manage my booking' function, everythin was 'normal'. To which she replied, "i don't know about that or why we did not warn you but you can't fly, i can't check you in because the NZ govt says so". She also refused to process refund or getting flight credits.

While I understand that this is the impact of NZ govt decision, I believe that Air New Zealand through its ground handling agent at PPT, the reservation agent that we called the day earlier, and the whole reservation team must be held responsible as well. The fact that we were not the only one who got denied at check-in proved that other pax were also unaware of this decision by NZ govt. THere was no assistance whatsoever given by Air New Zealand. No communication at all. As pax, we have done our part of the responsibilities. They left 2//3 of the plane stranded and on their own at PPT. My traveling buddies are EU citizens so they can stay in Tahiti for a while, but I am on 15-day tourist visa. French Polynesia is also on lock down and that NZ43 and TN078 were the last two flights out of French Polynesia.

As a result, I had to reroute my plan and bought a one-way ticket to fly on that Air Tahiti Nui to Tokyo and then bought another one way ticket from Tokyo to Jakarta with Japan Airlines. My friends had to do the same, we all bought one way to Tokyo and then they bought another one way tickets to various points in Europe. I cannot shake the feeling that I feel cheated and let down by Air New Zealand. The way they just washed their hands and removed their responsibilities are unprofessional. The day we bought the PPT-AKL ticket was March 19 PPT time, it was March 20 already in NZ time. As the policy to not allow transit passenger was to be effective on March 20 23:59 NZ time, Air New Zealand should have known and had time to warn affected passengers.

Am I right to claim for a refund on the AKL-SIN part of my booking which I never get the chance to fly? Also for my friend who made the booking for the Papeete to Auckland flight, is he right to claim for refund as all 4 of us in the end did not fly this leg? Because NZ43 and NZ283 that I was booked on were not suspended or cancelled or anything. On march 21, upon my arrival in Jakarta, I immediately sent e-mail to Air New Zealand, I also contacted them on their Facebook messenger account but to no avail. I tried to call their customer service line, no one picked up my calls. What else can I pursue to get the assistance?

THanks guys! Looking forward for your feedback!
The pax is always responsible for ensuring they are eligible for entry/transit. The pax is responsible for monitoring border rule changes.

At check-in your passport is checked against SITA which goes to the relevant immigration bodies and says yes or no. This can't be bypassed and is $10k fine if an airline brings a pax to NZ which the computer says no to.

If you don't have eligibility to fly you are a no show and I don't think you can claim refunds or credits.
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Old Mar 25, 2020, 3:07 am
  #107  
 
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Originally Posted by nzkarit
The pax is always responsible for ensuring they are eligible for entry/transit. The pax is responsible for monitoring border rule changes.

At check-in your passport is checked against SITA which goes to the relevant immigration bodies and says yes or no. This can't be bypassed and is $10k fine if an airline brings a pax to NZ which the computer says no to.

If you don't have eligibility to fly you are a no show and I don't think you can claim refunds or credits.
Thank you for your feedback. I appreciate your comment.

I would like to clarify that I was eligible to transit as I posses multiple entry visitor visa. I did not even need a visa to transit in Auckland as I was eligible to transit by using NZ ETA (which I also have). I and my friends were checking the news regularly. Like I have written earlier, we bought the ticket with NZ reservation office in French Polynesia (the lady asked for our nationalities, our passport numbers, etc. So she could have, at the very least, warn us against transiting in Auckland but instead she said "yeah you guys are good to go"), we checked with Auckland Airport, we checked with Immigration NZ. all pointing to the fact that we were still allowed to transit in Auckland.

With all due respect, I was a "no-show" not because I wanted to, but because I was forced to be a no-show. If my friends and I missed the sudden update from NZ govt, I can understand that. Then we would have not even tried to transit in Auckland and we would have bought ticket with other airlines to get us out of French Polynesia. But if the majority of other passengers were also unaware of the no transit policy? I don't think you can call that as our fault.

I believe it has to be both ways. Like you said, pax need to be aware (I believe I was) but airlines must also help. They can't just drop the bomb like that. My point is Air New Zealand can't just get away with my money and other passengers' money like that. I paid for a safe passage, Air New Zealand only delivered half of it, then the other half should be refunded to me or at least be returned in flight credit.
rienhart87 is offline  
Old Mar 25, 2020, 3:56 am
  #108  
 
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Originally Posted by rienhart87
Thank you for your feedback. I appreciate your comment.

I would like to clarify that I was eligible to transit as I posses multiple entry visitor visa. I did not even need a visa to transit in Auckland as I was eligible to transit by using NZ ETA (which I also have). I and my friends were checking the news regularly. Like I have written earlier, we bought the ticket with NZ reservation office in French Polynesia (the lady asked for our nationalities, our passport numbers, etc. So she could have, at the very least, warn us against transiting in Auckland but instead she said "yeah you guys are good to go"), we checked with Auckland Airport, we checked with Immigration NZ. all pointing to the fact that we were still allowed to transit in Auckland.
Yes but NZ change the border rules so at check in you were not eligible to land or transit. NZ Citizens and Permanent residents could land and Aussies could transit. (and some vice versa where the person resided in the other country).

All the dates are a bit of a blur, March 19 (when you booked) (NZ) pretty the rules were just 14 days isolation and transit ok. Over the weekend the rules tighten.

Originally Posted by rienhart87
With all due respect, I was a "no-show" not because I wanted to, but because I was forced to be a no-show. If my friends and I missed the sudden update from NZ govt, I can understand that. Then we would have not even tried to transit in Auckland and we would have bought ticket with other airlines to get us out of French Polynesia. But if the majority of other passengers were also unaware of the no transit policy? I don't think you can call that as our fault.
Given how dynamic the situation was with border at that point, think pax should have been paying attention. The NZ govt at that point had been saying get home as soon as possible as routes were closing, for over a week, may be two weeks?

Originally Posted by rienhart87
I believe it has to be both ways. Like you said, pax need to be aware (I believe I was) but airlines must also help. They can't just drop the bomb like that. My point is Air New Zealand can't just get away with my money and other passengers' money like that. I paid for a safe passage, Air New Zealand only delivered half of it, then the other half should be refunded to me or at least be returned in flight credit.
AirNZ isn't privy to NZ Govt decisions about the border. The border changes were dropped on AirNZ as well and they have to comply with them immediately, there wasn't much grace period in the changes. If AirNZ ignores the border rules and they fly people they get $10k fine per pax.

You at the time of check in were not eligible to use NZ as a transit point, so AirNZ could not fly you. The NZ Govt makes the border rules not AirNZ. The T&Cs say it is up to the pax to ensure they are eligible to transit and land.
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Old Mar 25, 2020, 4:02 am
  #109  
 
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Originally Posted by lionred2012
My two adult children flew from AKL to LHR on the 14th March for a family funeral. They were due to return on the 4th April but Air NZ have cancelled their flights. They have been given a credit and refused a refund. They do not expect to spend $6,000+ in the next 12 moths so the credits are useless. They were then offered a flight via Tokyo for $5,000 extra each on top of their already paid fares .This was to upgrade from one PE fare and one economy fare to business class - the only seats available. Problem - this required a transfer between Haneda to Narita. Japan does not allow this as it requires them to enter Japan. Why was this fare offered? There are no routes available from LHR to AKL with Air NZ.

The High Commission said they couldn't help but there were commercial fares available via LAX, Vancouver, Hong Kong and Tokyo. These airports with the exception of Tokyo do not allow transit. The High Commission have no plans for repatriation flights. Therefore they are stuck in the UK.

All we are asking is joined up thinking from the people in charge.

I understand the difficulties everyone is operating under but they have lost their money with Air NZ, even though the government say come home there are flights available, there aren't.

Latest - Qatar have offered a flight this weekend $3,000 each for economy but this is a non refundable fare and things could change in the next few days.After losing money with Air NZ they can't afford to have more money at risk.
All we ask is for some clarity and honesty in the situation.
EU261 requirements for care and rebooking after cancellations from London continue to apply. They should remind Air NZ of this.
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Old Mar 25, 2020, 7:35 am
  #110  
 
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Alex_B, thanks for your comment. EU 261 certainly does apply. Because of the extraordinary nature of the situation no compensation will be due, the EU have confirmed that. However the reimbursement conditions still apply. Air NZ should have offered them full reimbursement and/or tried to put them on another flight. They did offer one which was via Tokyo but wanted them to pay astronomical amounts to pay the upgrade to business. They are on an economy ticket and a PE ticket with upgrade vouchers. They would have been happy with economy tickets to get back.
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Old Mar 25, 2020, 1:51 pm
  #111  
 
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FYI latest email comms from NZ have stated they will now be automatically putting all cancelled flights into credit rather than contacting customers for options/advising them of what's happening
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Old Mar 25, 2020, 3:43 pm
  #112  
 
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Originally Posted by NZ_Flyer
FYI latest email comms from NZ have stated they will now be automatically putting all cancelled flights into credit rather than contacting customers for options/advising them of what's happening
Do passengers at least have the right to request the cancelled flight credit be put into a refund?

My experience:
I called Air NZ on Monday night to cancel two tickets & request refund (not credit) for NZ 7 SFO-AKL this Friday, returning NZ 8 on April 19 which had been cancelled by AirNZ. The app didn't show NZ 8 as cancelled but it wasn't coming up on itasoftware.matrix.com as bookable, either. Hold wait time was close to an hour. Someone helped fill a form over the phone and a booking agent called me back in 1 business day (was advised it could be 1-5 days to receive a reply) to clarify if I was cancelling one segment or the entire itinerary. Received a few emails afterwards showing receipt of refund request for fare + tax + seat assignment fees. The booking agent advised it could take 15-20 days to see the refund be applied to my credit card. Everyone was polite and I apologized for having jumped the 48 hour queue as I wanted to make sure Friday's seats are available to those who need them. If it matters to others, I'm subject to shelter in place mandate in my US county and am not NZ citizen nor related to one. Perhaps I fell into a slim window before it was credit and flight suspension vs cancellation?

I still have a few independently booked flexitime domestic sectors booked which are still showing up in itasoftware.matrix.com. I'll need to take it up with my credit card insurance provider soon if the flight schedule isn't updated, as I cancelled the trip due to cruise company cancelling my cruise and state has a stay-at-home order.
freecia is online now  
Old Mar 25, 2020, 4:00 pm
  #113  
 
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Ok, having internal bookings for April/May that are non-refundable have been able to go to manage booking and rebook for latter in the year July/August/September with no change or rebooking fees to do so. Plenty of availability so also able to get by without fare difference as well. If things free up in May then will just book then if need to travel internally.
ClanJ is offline  
Old Mar 25, 2020, 4:09 pm
  #114  
 
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Originally Posted by alex_b
EU261 requirements for care and rebooking after cancellations from London continue to apply. They should remind Air NZ of this.
I have flights CPH to AKL for April (outbound is NZ to LHR) which are booked with NZ and NZ flight number but service operated by SQ. Does anyone know if the EU directive would also likely apply here? I am guessing it most likely would.Thanks.
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Old Mar 25, 2020, 4:17 pm
  #115  
 
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I requested the refund through Air NZ's Whats app and had my refund issued back to my card a couple days ago.

Itinerary was AUS-NZ-AUS all in 1 ticket, Easter for outbound and NZ Queen's Birthday weekend inbound.

QF on the other hand, Called and said the refund will be processed (without any fees) but have not even received any confirmation email or refund what-so-ever.
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Old Mar 25, 2020, 4:20 pm
  #116  
 
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Originally Posted by freecia
Perhaps I fell into a slim window before it was credit and flight suspension vs cancellation?
That's the issue it still seems to be hit and miss, I tried 3 days ago and got refused a refund, and I was not the one cancelling the flights.
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Old Mar 25, 2020, 4:52 pm
  #117  
 
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Originally Posted by zqsn5678
I requested the refund through Air NZ's Whats app and had my refund issued back to my card a couple days ago.

Itinerary was AUS-NZ-AUS all in 1 ticket, Easter for outbound and NZ Queen's Birthday weekend inbound.

QF on the other hand, Called and said the refund will be processed (without any fees) but have not even received any confirmation email or refund what-so-ever.
Thanks have tried again via WhatsApp channel.
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Old Mar 25, 2020, 6:48 pm
  #118  
 
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I had a ticket booked out of the UK for LHR-LAX flown earlier in the year and the return flight LAX-LHR in June. I requested they push the ticket until such a time as they could fly but was told they have cancelled the route all together and can offer partial refund for the unused leg or booking onto another airline in the same class if available.

Does anyone know if EU621 requires a full refund of a return ticket in the event of cancellation by the airline?
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Old Mar 25, 2020, 8:43 pm
  #119  
 
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Didn't see any other option but to file a credit card dispute. Booked flight through Expedia AU, but charge is billed as Air New Zealand. Can not get any support from Expedia.

MEL-AKL will not be cancelled, but due to restrictions, I can not legally board the plane nor enter either country.
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Old Mar 26, 2020, 2:55 am
  #120  
 
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but due to restrictions, I can not legally board the plane nor enter either country”

And that’s why they should be offering refunds to pax who find themselves in this situation.

To say the flight is not cancelled (and really be only available to Kiwis trying to get home) so they can keep your money, even if in credit, borders on unconscionable conduct.
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