Wondering why SQ Flights ex WLG are not included as NZ Codeshare?
Oct 30, 2018, 1:22 am
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: South Island, New Zealand
Programs: Krisflyer, Qantas Frequent Flyer, Air NZ Airpoints, Koru, NZ*S and former *G
Posts: 317
Wondering why SQ Flights ex WLG are not included as NZ Codeshare?
Flying SQ occasionally I have been wondering for a while why the WLG-MEL-WLG service does not show as an option on the NZ booking engine - not even if using multi stop option.
I find this a bit puzzling given SQ does appear as a code share option when booking many other destinations via Air NZ (almost anywhere in Europe for example).
Also, given the NZ domestic flight connections (regional) that SQ offer when booking their Wellington to Melbourne service direct with them, often at very good prices, it seems there must clearly be some cooperation between the airlines.
I am guessing the reason there isn't a full SQ/NZ code share offered on the Tasman route will be something to do with it being 'Trans Tasman' and no doubt some of the conditions around the respective airline licenses associated with that?
I find this a bit puzzling given SQ does appear as a code share option when booking many other destinations via Air NZ (almost anywhere in Europe for example).
Also, given the NZ domestic flight connections (regional) that SQ offer when booking their Wellington to Melbourne service direct with them, often at very good prices, it seems there must clearly be some cooperation between the airlines.
I am guessing the reason there isn't a full SQ/NZ code share offered on the Tasman route will be something to do with it being 'Trans Tasman' and no doubt some of the conditions around the respective airline licenses associated with that?
Last edited by ottiehund; Oct 30, 2018 at 1:26 am Reason: question
Oct 30, 2018, 2:42 am
#2
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: New Zealand (most of the time)
Programs: Air NZ Elite *G, Honors Gold, IHG Platinum Elite
Posts: 6,100
NZ only codeshare on the WLG-SIN service.
Reasons are long and complex (and political and do involve their alliance). With the move from CBR to MEL there was even less of a reason to need it.
Reasons are long and complex (and political and do involve their alliance). With the move from CBR to MEL there was even less of a reason to need it.
Oct 30, 2018, 12:17 pm
#4
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: New Zealand (most of the time)
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Posts: 6,100
The agreement was for a decade.
I guess when every passenger on the flight ex WLG has a subsidy then you can afford to sell cheaper airfares. The subsidy really is the biggest scam of all time.
It's impossible for anybody to know the details of the subsidy since there is no paperwork. One can only conclude however that the cost of the subsidy has increased significantly since it was (apparently once again since no documents exist) a per passenger fee so the flights to MEL mean a greater subsidy since they have more pax on them. No airline is going to ignore upwards of a $1 million per year handout..
Oct 31, 2018, 12:41 am
#6
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 908
The subsidy is apparently a fixed $800,000 per year payment to SIA for 10 years (others say it's $9 per passenger but I think that's estimated). This started in September 2016 so one would assume it would last until September 2026.
If NZ did sign a codeshare deal (from WLG-MEL) then it would need approval from the NZ government (if only selling tickets from NZ) or both the AU and NZ govs (if selling tickets in both countries).
Something tells me that Virgin and potentially even Qantas would object to such deal proceeding and this could create headaches for NZ for the small number of benefits it creates (points, status etc are already covered by *A).
Virgin has a codeshare deal with SQ for all SQ/MI flights originating from Australia and this covers the SQ flight between MEL-WLG allowing them to sell tickets originting in Australia but not the other way around.
If NZ did sign a codeshare deal (from WLG-MEL) then it would need approval from the NZ government (if only selling tickets from NZ) or both the AU and NZ govs (if selling tickets in both countries).
Something tells me that Virgin and potentially even Qantas would object to such deal proceeding and this could create headaches for NZ for the small number of benefits it creates (points, status etc are already covered by *A).
Virgin has a codeshare deal with SQ for all SQ/MI flights originating from Australia and this covers the SQ flight between MEL-WLG allowing them to sell tickets originting in Australia but not the other way around.
Oct 31, 2018, 1:31 am
#8
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: AKL
Programs: NZ Silver
Posts: 1,816
The subsidy is apparently a fixed $800,000 per year payment to SIA for 10 years (others say it's $9 per passenger but I think that's estimated). This started in September 2016 so one would assume it would last until September 2026.
If NZ did sign a codeshare deal (from WLG-MEL) then it would need approval from the NZ government (if only selling tickets from NZ) or both the AU and NZ govs (if selling tickets in both countries).
Something tells me that Virgin and potentially even Qantas would object to such deal proceeding and this could create headaches for NZ for the small number of benefits it creates (points, status etc are already covered by *A).
Virgin has a codeshare deal with SQ for all SQ/MI flights originating from Australia and this covers the SQ flight between MEL-WLG allowing them to sell tickets originting in Australia but not the other way around.
If NZ did sign a codeshare deal (from WLG-MEL) then it would need approval from the NZ government (if only selling tickets from NZ) or both the AU and NZ govs (if selling tickets in both countries).
Something tells me that Virgin and potentially even Qantas would object to such deal proceeding and this could create headaches for NZ for the small number of benefits it creates (points, status etc are already covered by *A).
Virgin has a codeshare deal with SQ for all SQ/MI flights originating from Australia and this covers the SQ flight between MEL-WLG allowing them to sell tickets originting in Australia but not the other way around.
Oct 31, 2018, 2:17 am
#9
Join Date: Apr 2013
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Posts: 6,100
Oct 31, 2018, 2:32 am
#10
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: AKL
Programs: NZ Silver
Posts: 1,816
Oct 31, 2018, 12:30 pm
#12
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: New Zealand (most of the time)
Programs: Air NZ Elite *G, Honors Gold, IHG Platinum Elite
Posts: 6,100
Wellington City Council agreed to pay SQ a year fee for 10 years with no public consultation, no paper trail and no public disclosure. Nobody can say exactly what the details are because these simply are not known.
Oct 31, 2018, 1:24 pm
#13
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 2,638
Aussie Govt also pays NZ to fly to Norfolk and VA to Xmas islands etc. Plus a lot of contracted routes to the middle of no where in Queensland and NT. Though there is proper bidding process that is open each number of years.
The Wellington SQ thing was not a public bidding process, where there was a problem that was trying to be addressed and it wasn't open on GETS for all the airlines to bid on and doesn't have any oversight.
The Wellington SQ thing was not a public bidding process, where there was a problem that was trying to be addressed and it wasn't open on GETS for all the airlines to bid on and doesn't have any oversight.
Oct 31, 2018, 3:05 pm
#14
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: AKL
Programs: NZ Silver
Posts: 1,816
I can see the rationale for this example (although that figure is high if true) and the Norfolk Island one as there are no other airlines serving those routes (as far as I am aware). With WLG-MEL you have both NZ and QF.
Oct 31, 2018, 3:10 pm
#15
Join Date: Dec 2007
Programs: Air New Zealand Elite
Posts: 445
The subsidy is apparently a fixed $800,000 per year payment to SIA for 10 years (others say it's $9 per passenger but I think that's estimated). This started in September 2016 so one would assume it would last until September 2026.
If NZ did sign a codeshare deal (from WLG-MEL) then it would need approval from the NZ government (if only selling tickets from NZ) or both the AU and NZ govs (if selling tickets in both countries).
Something tells me that Virgin and potentially even Qantas would object to such deal proceeding and this could create headaches for NZ for the small number of benefits it creates (points, status etc are already covered by *A).
Virgin has a codeshare deal with SQ for all SQ/MI flights originating from Australia and this covers the SQ flight between MEL-WLG allowing them to sell tickets originting in Australia but not the other way around.
If NZ did sign a codeshare deal (from WLG-MEL) then it would need approval from the NZ government (if only selling tickets from NZ) or both the AU and NZ govs (if selling tickets in both countries).
Something tells me that Virgin and potentially even Qantas would object to such deal proceeding and this could create headaches for NZ for the small number of benefits it creates (points, status etc are already covered by *A).
Virgin has a codeshare deal with SQ for all SQ/MI flights originating from Australia and this covers the SQ flight between MEL-WLG allowing them to sell tickets originting in Australia but not the other way around.