kiwifrequentflyer

So this was a confusing, yet interesting phone call. TIL that Elite RUs upgrades are potentially BELOW OneUp bids on the bidding scale.... thoughts? Is this actually right?

My family was flying to LAX. My sister on one ticket, my mum/dad on another ticket. All in economy. I lodged APD upgrades for them all. Everyone was jade.

My sister's app showed her she was now flying PE 7 days out. My mother got angsty and wanted to know if theirs would be upgraded. She rang Air NZ 3 days out and asked. They said that due to enormous availability (the PE cabin was still half empty when they flew - something I've never encountered on that route) they could manually put through their upgrade then. They did and everyone flew PE happily.

My sister and my parents all had their PE upgrades confirmed 7 days out coming home as well via the app changing their seat. No one called. It happened automatically 7 days out.

I have 5 RU upgrades (long story...) so I wanted to use 4 to upgrade my parents if possible. I rang up Air NZ just now to confirm if there was enough availability to confirm an upgrade if I switched from an APD and gifted them my RU's instead.

Well, I was told (I made them confirm with their supervisor) the following things:

• Jade members CAN'T be confirmed for upgrades in-advance unless it's a OneUp bid. All other types of bids (APD bids and RU gifts) can only be confirmed on the day for jade members. BUT if they were silver/gold they could be confirmed in-advance.
• That means that they weren't supposed to have had their APD Y-PE upgrades confirmed and it was a mistake (but Air NZ were going to honour it).
• That also meant that even though award availability was available for their return flight home for BP, they can't confirm their upgrade for me and I'd have to risk them getting nothing.
• ALSO - the guy on the phone said that gifted RUs are assessed at the RECIPIENTS level. I always assumed that if I gifted a RU to my mother than it would be assessed as an Elite RU - so be at the top of the tier. But no - apparently it gets assessed as a "jade RU" - and is actually at the BOTTOM of the upgrade tier (Elite RU/APD, he said they are assessed at the same level - Gold RU - Silver RU - OneUp - Jade RU).

As a result I decided not to risk it and keep their PE upgrade as it was confirmed.

What do you guys think? I'm skeptical because my sister was upgraded 7 days out going to LAX and never called up about it, it just happened, no one stepped in to change it. But my (very nice) rep confirmed it with their supervisor so it must be true?

nzkarit

I think with gifting changes if the Elite is on the same ticket or not.
If Elite and Giftee on one ticket happens at elite else at giftee's status.

As for clearing at different times singles vs couples, singles more likely to clear. As only needs one seat not two.

edmm

I was basically told the same thing over the weekend. Mrs edmm (also Elite) and myself going to Sydney, paid J. We gifted flights using APD's to daughter-in-law and toddler in Y on the same flights as us (different PNR) and have gifted them 4 of our Elite RU's to go Y to PE (BP is not suitable for toddler because of seat configuration). Aircraft change occurring so I rang to get seats together again (6A & 7A became 6A & 1A in an otherwise empty cabin) and asked about the gifted RU's, and was told they are last in line.

kiwifrequentflyer

Interesting thing though is my rep told me that they shouldn't have cleared at all until the final day. I knew that my sisters was more likely to clear than my parents, but didn't realize that jade couldn't be confirmed until the final day unless it's a OneUp.

sbiddle

You've never been able to gift an upgrade and have it clear immediately if there is A/R availability unless a) the giftee is an Elite or b) the giftee is traveling on the same PNR as you or traveling on the same flights and can have the PNRs linked.

Gifted RUs have always been processed based on the recipients status. The information you've posted about OneUps being processed ahead of a RU is however not correct.

I've lodged upgrades for non status pax in the past and had them clear in advance on very empty flights

Thai-Kiwi

I can confirm gifted Elite RU are assessed differently depending whether or not the gifter is travelling or not.

In my case, a very generous FTer friend gifted me two Elite RUs for me to use AKL-HKG (or HKG-AKL). It was established early on that the RUs would be prioritised based on my Jade status. I did/do have *G with THAI's ROP, but this is not relevant. The very generous party offer the RUs to me as they were expiring and they were unable to use them.

The RU outbound AKL-HKG cleared whilst I was in the KC at WLG, so was pleased to be able to get lounge staff re-issue the BPs (I was heading through to PEK on CX code-share).

I also managed to access the CX lounge in HKG, I think by confusing the staff so much on the NZ-CX relationship, that it was easier to let me in.

edmm

In our case we are on the same flights as them, and the PNR's are linked, but she still said they are at the bottom of the heap. I think I'll ring a few days before and check on that. We've had our (adult) kids cleared early in this situation before, with them moving into J to be with us.

kiwifrequentflyer

I got that information from the rep. I asked him which clears first, One Ups or gifted jade RUs He said the OneUps since they get assessed three days out and the gifted RUs only get assessed on the day, so the OneUps are more likely to clear. No clue if he's right, that is just what he said.

Also interesting, he said that linking PNRs is not enough. He said you need to be on the same ticket to be eligible for confirmation. Our PNRs were not even close to being linked, I just wanted more information.

sbiddle

That is incorrect and it's something I've done in the past so unless things have changed in the last 6 months or so it's how it should work. It's a manual process as they're still "separate PNRs" but are linked together. Once this is done the Elite can lodge an upgrade for the other pax that will be cleared immediately if there is still A/R class availability.

I'll have to ask my source there when I next catch up with them. The simple reality is there are even people in the premium team who don't understand all the technicalities and finer details of Airpoints. That's what happens when you create the worlds most complex FPP program.

Despite many people claiming OneUp's can clear before a RU I've never had a source confirm this nor a single post from anybody on here that's presented anything close to proof that this occurs. The fact OneUps are processed 3 days out is irreverent - the vast majority of RU/APD upgrades only clear on the day of travel regardless of status.

kiwifrequentflyer

Well that's the thing. It's a bit of a .... show when you call the premium team. I had a major error on the phone where I was denied my elite status when I had actually legitimately acquired it. It was only when someone told me months later on this forum to push further that I discovered that the person I had been talking to on the phone was wrong (that error lead to my 5 RUs situation).

So you may be right - that may be their policy, which is why you were able to do that.

On the other hand, my mother got her APD upgrades manually confirmed 3 days out by a rep and that was NOT allowed (my rep even told me he had a nice chat to her while I was on hold and told her she shouldn't have done that). And as my rep himself said, there are so many rules and policies it's hard for them to know them all.

He literally told me that gifted RUs on separate PNRs to jade members come after OneUps. I double checked with him if that is what he said and he said yes. But again is he correct? I don't know. It could make sense though given the unique situation the jade status.

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NZ_Flyer

In my experience, Elite APD's and gifted RU's are a weird beast. They are designed to be processed at the same level as RU's based on the status of the person using it. So if an Elite applies it to their booking, people on the same booking or people on the same flight with the PNR's linked then it will be given Elite priority otherwise (as others have said) it will be cleared at the status level of the giftee. This means that if the giftee is Gold it will be processed with the Gold RU's, if they're Silver then with Silver RU's and if Jade then they'll be processed after all other RU's but before OneUp's. Remember that at T-7 days the upgrade system will clear RU's and APD upgrades in advance if there are seats available and then if there are still seats available AND no pending RU's/APD upgrades then the system will confirm OneUp's. As a Silver I've had quite a few upgrades clear at T-7 on low load flights. So RU's and Elite APD's are always prioritised above OneUp's (even those gifted to a Jade) PROVIDED they are lodged more than 7 days before departure. If the RU or Elite APD upgrade cannot be confirmed at T-7 then those are not looked at again until the day of departure - usually when check-in closes and they know exactly how many upgrades can be processed.

However, Elite APD upgrades do not actually work like this. For example, a couple of years ago I was Silver and travelling AKL-LAX-AKL with a Gold. The Gold used their RU's to upgrade from Y to PE and I used gifted Elite APD upgrades. My AKL-LAX cleared well before his Gold RU and my LAX-AKL cleared 7 days out while his cleared after check-in. All upgrades lodged at well in advance of flights. Furthermore, I recently gifted an Elite APD to a Silver friend for a MEL-AKL fom Y to J. He was travelling with another Silver who had lodged a Y to J Silver RU. My friends upgrade cleared while the Silver RU didn't. I've got lots of similar anecdotal evidence and it all points to Elite APD's being prioritised above all RU's except Elite RU's where the Elite is travelling or using it on themselves. Hope that makes sense.

sbiddle

Correct. It's my understanding an Elite APD upgrade when applied by an Elite for themselves is processed after Elite RU's

The big unanswered question is where Elite APD upgrades are processed in the queue when gifted to another pax. My sources have always been a little vague about stating exactly where they sit and whether an Elite APD upgrade lodged for a silver member (as an example) will be processed before or after a silver RU.

kiwifrequentflyer

APDs are cleared the same (at elite status) no matter if you are on the same PNR or not. They get processed before Gold RUs. I confirmed this with my phone rep. So if clearing is important, its much better to lodge friends/family a APD upgrade than use your RUs.

Tbh we don't have any written evidence that jade RUs get cleared above OneUps. We know that silver ones do, but I can't find anything stating that Jade RUs are. So I don't know why we are assuming that, given that we've had a rep literally say that for Jade members (and only Jade members) it goes OneUp and then gifted RUs.

sbiddle

I'm not entirely convinced this is the case.

I do know the clamp down on purchasing APD (removal from OneSmart and only being available on the Air NZ Airpoints Platinum card and the surcharge which is currently waived) was party a result of some abuse of the system. The surcharge can now be easily implemented if required since it's in the T&C.

WoodieNZ