highpeak1

I think the NZ leisure routes operate with a fixed programme because there is largely a fixed market size. Operating to Bali would have to be instead of somewhere else. NZ has a fixed fleet available and the Kiwi population is not huge and expanding.
Bali is over 8 hour so it needs the thirsty 767 as its workhorse.
Of course, that may not stop Garuda doing it

Shazzadude

I wonder how well Pacific Blue do with the New Zealand market for flights to Bali.

I highly doubt a leisure route like Bali would see a non-stop flight as a significant advatage.

ajnz

Oh hey look at that:
I guess this is the first sector before it goes to the rest of the long haul network.

Hello Mr. NZ-LCC!

Xiaotung

I tried a few dates but only 1 stop flights with connections on DJ have Seat Only option. All non-stop flights are still only available in Works. Am I missing anything?

Even so PER usually falls under NZ's short haul profolio (even when it's not short haul) so I wouldn't panic just yet.

ajnz

Same here. I wonder if the email went out before it was pushed in to the GDS? Amusingly Seat-only is only $1 cheaper than Works on the day I picked.

That's not my understanding. PER has always been treated long-haul in terms of service style, and to a lesser extent fare structure.

I'm pretty sure we can expect to see more S2S on other long haul markets - maybe not London or North America, but I wouldn't be surprised to see it to HNL/PPT/HKG/TYO/PVG/etc.

birder

I do think the Seats to Suit concept being applied to Perth indicates some interest in using it for proper long-haul. However, I don't have any idea how they would implement it. Even the very poor US legacy carriers realize that you have to feed people on long-haul flights. And people don't fly long haul without luggage (not the mass market reach they are trying for at least). So if they do start charging for food and baggage, then simply it's not about offering choice but charging more money for the same product. No choice is involved when it comes to food and baggage on long haul; 95% of people will need both.

mmonster

no offense, but I think that AirNZ will not do that to Asia destinations, so much competition there and I doubt there will be anyone travelling there without any checked bags....? on the contrary, Air NZ is losing out big time with Chinese carriers guarantee 35k for students... where as AirNZ is sticking firmly to its 1 bag @ 23kg policy

of coz one would argue you need to broaden your customer base and to keep load on J... but it would be disaster to offer that to asia routes IMHO

also it is also interesting to see how AirNZ stop selling the extra seat next to you on Y? anyone know? they used to have big signs at the airport and I have always doubt how they can execute it (on Asia routes, particular to PEK and PVG) that they have paid for the empty seat.....

Xiaotung

Why would they want to apply the S2S concept to their long haul flights when there was not any direct LCC competition on any of their long haul routes? NZ really should make up their mind whether they want to be a full service carrier or a LCC. And they should leave *A if they choose the latter.

ajnz

I think NZ will do it where they perceive they're facing a Jetstar and other LCC (AirAsiaX, etc) threat - which is Asia for now.

If Jetstar opens AKL-SFO or other NA routes then I wouldn't be surprised to see it there, either.

mmonster

In theory yes, it will be a threat.. but does Jetstar has the right to operate AKL - SFO or to other NA destinations? (I really do not know that they can operate that route or not?)

If they are flying to China, PEK and PVG are almost impossible, given AirNZ need to fight so hard for it and they are a bit like LHR where they do not have available slots...

also similar problem with NRT with no slots....

if they were to operate to other NA ports, I really doubt where that could be without a robust connection network. The most logical is Phuket, a resort paradise for NZers

ajnz

I'm pretty sure JQ would be able to do this - there has already been speculation about JQ taking over AKL-LAX from QF, or replacing it with AKL-SFO after QF dropped SYD-SFO. Unsure whether 3K could operate it, but we've already seen JQi use 3K/JQ operations interchangeably where it suits to optimize their flying rights.

The QF/JQ/3K group is flying to China, Japan, Malaysia, Vietnam, etc. All they will do is hub it through Singapore with their AKL-SIN flights, and possibly add other destinations when demand is there and rights are required.

This is why I suspect we'll see S2S on more of the long haul network - perhaps in only half of the Y cabin.

mmonster

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/n...ectid=10753057

Long-haul passengers fell 10 per cent to 116,000, with Asia/Japan/UK volumes falling 8.5 per cent to 49,000 and North America/UK declining 11 per cent to 67,000.

so it is North America and UK that is dropping........ at least in Aug