RIP Flying Blue -: massive devaluation on July 1st now stratospheric # miles required
Jul 21, 2022, 2:30 am
#151
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 757
Right when they changed the numbers early July I booked a bunch (6) intra european awards (in J) for 25K each. That was the lowest amount available, on any day in winter, on that route.
Checking now that has gone down to 20K. So I've 'overpaid' 30K for those 6 tickets. Theoretically when I booked the free cancellation rules still applied (At least the FB website still had them up), so I could...maybe... ask them to cancel and re-book. May require a lot of convincing though, especially because others have reported those cancellation rules to have ended late June. Not sure if that fight is worth it for 30K. On the other hand, you could argue that this represents about 300 Euro in value. Hmm..
In any case.. not only do the miles dynamically change for specific routes based on popularity, they also still change and tweak the base number of miles required.
Checking now that has gone down to 20K. So I've 'overpaid' 30K for those 6 tickets. Theoretically when I booked the free cancellation rules still applied (At least the FB website still had them up), so I could...maybe... ask them to cancel and re-book. May require a lot of convincing though, especially because others have reported those cancellation rules to have ended late June. Not sure if that fight is worth it for 30K. On the other hand, you could argue that this represents about 300 Euro in value. Hmm..
In any case.. not only do the miles dynamically change for specific routes based on popularity, they also still change and tweak the base number of miles required.
taken your loss and life goes on. Enjoy your trip.
Jul 21, 2022, 2:43 am
#152
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,722
My impression is that these bookings were for a well-travelled route (AMS-ATH) for which he has quite a bit of flexibility of when, and how often, to travel....
Jul 21, 2022, 2:55 am
#153
Moderator: Aegean Miles+Bonus
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: AMS / ATH
Programs: AFKL Plat, A3 Gold
Posts: 7,339
That's exactly right irishguy28. These are for different one-ways on different dates, and on those exact flights there are still plenty (3+) seats available at that lowest 20K level right now.
As long as the inventory doesn't substantially worsen by canceling the award seats it should be fine. The main problem will probably be to have them cancel the tickets for free, as the free canceling of awards stopped end of june - but they updated the website only after July 5 or so. I booked right in between those two dates, meaning I may..possibly..still be able to cancel for free. By doing this switch I'd loose flexibility (Tickets currently booked are definitely not flexible any more), but getting flexibility on the current tickets down the line (in 2023) based on a covid policy that ended in June... may be tricky as well.
I'll give it a try and call the PSL a little later on today. Lets see what they say.
As long as the inventory doesn't substantially worsen by canceling the award seats it should be fine. The main problem will probably be to have them cancel the tickets for free, as the free canceling of awards stopped end of june - but they updated the website only after July 5 or so. I booked right in between those two dates, meaning I may..possibly..still be able to cancel for free. By doing this switch I'd loose flexibility (Tickets currently booked are definitely not flexible any more), but getting flexibility on the current tickets down the line (in 2023) based on a covid policy that ended in June... may be tricky as well.
I'll give it a try and call the PSL a little later on today. Lets see what they say.
Jul 22, 2022, 8:20 am
#154
Moderator: Aegean Miles+Bonus
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: AMS / ATH
Programs: AFKL Plat, A3 Gold
Posts: 7,339
Just an update on this. Had no issue cancelling the awards without paying any penalty, originally booked on July 4. The newly booked awards (at 20% lower miles) also went through fine. Actually decided to book some of them as roundtrips (rather than one-ways) to benefit from being able to cancel the whole roundtrip for a 50 euro fee (rather than 50 euro per leg) if need be. The PSL was very cool about it. Also, zero wait when calling the PSL... which surprised me considering the mess going on at AMS.
My personal position on this FB change still applies. I'm mainly flying intra Europe so for me it's great being able to book C class awards for 20K, I'm actually able to replace paid flights with these. And this gives me over a cent per mile in value which previously was only possible flying long-haul (Which I virtually never do for personal travel).
My personal position on this FB change still applies. I'm mainly flying intra Europe so for me it's great being able to book C class awards for 20K, I'm actually able to replace paid flights with these. And this gives me over a cent per mile in value which previously was only possible flying long-haul (Which I virtually never do for personal travel).
Jul 25, 2022, 2:48 am
#156
Join Date: May 2015
Location: RBA / TBS
Programs: AF Gold / Accor Gold / Hilton Diamond / TP Silver / A3 Gold
Posts: 2,746
Jul 25, 2022, 8:47 am
#157
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: VIE/PRG
Programs: FB Platinum, Marriott Platinum Elite
Posts: 1,592
Jul 26, 2022, 2:29 pm
#159
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Netherlands
Programs: FB Gold, Hilton Diamond, some others as well
Posts: 132
Jul 27, 2022, 3:44 am
#160
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Indonesia
Programs: Flying Blue PE, Garuda FF Gold, Shangr-La Gold, KrisFlyer SQ
Posts: 79
booked one way eco CGK-KUL with KL: 9000 miles + 7,60 euro and return one way with GA for 7900 miles +10 euro (first week of November). To me not a bad deal.
Jul 28, 2022, 12:26 pm
#161
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
825,000 AF-KL miles + €356 for a one-way US-Asia AF-AF business class trip 30+ days out. With rewards like that, who needs penalties.
Jul 28, 2022, 1:23 pm
#162
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,722
However, if you can be flexible (which is always a good prerequisite for getting the most bang for your miles), there are options available, even within that 30 day window, for good value.
Exhibit A: BOS-AMS-BKK, 9 August
Exhibit B: BOS-CDG-BKK, 9 August
Jul 28, 2022, 1:54 pm
#163
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
30+ days covers dates that are even 360 days out, so not sure how “waiting til only 30+ days out to book is imposing a severe constraint on one's self”.
“825,000 AF-KL miles + €356 for a one-way US-Asia AF-AF business class trip 30+ days out. With rewards like that, who needs penalties.”
Flying such routes in business for a lot fewer miles is possible even sub-30 days out, but it doesn’t make the AF-KL miles hugely rewarding even as there are alternatives.
AF-KL has this scale of rip-off “reward” flight prices for flights across the calendar spectrum.
Let’s see how soon it is until the AF credit card in the US comes with a 150k mile SUB. That’s the kind of thing mileage devaluations result in happening, as the airlines and their bank card partners try to keep the loyalty program hamster wheel in motion.
“825,000 AF-KL miles + €356 for a one-way US-Asia AF-AF business class trip 30+ days out. With rewards like that, who needs penalties.”
Flying such routes in business for a lot fewer miles is possible even sub-30 days out, but it doesn’t make the AF-KL miles hugely rewarding even as there are alternatives.
AF-KL has this scale of rip-off “reward” flight prices for flights across the calendar spectrum.
Let’s see how soon it is until the AF credit card in the US comes with a 150k mile SUB. That’s the kind of thing mileage devaluations result in happening, as the airlines and their bank card partners try to keep the loyalty program hamster wheel in motion.
Last edited by GUWonder; Jul 28, 2022 at 1:59 pm
Jul 29, 2022, 4:55 am
#164
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,722
Longhaul Premium load factor is up on 2019 levels - economy load factor is still running below 2019 levels - so don't expect (m)any biz bargains in the 30+ day booking window 
Transavia is the only part of the business whose ASKs will be above 2019 levels in Q3 and Q4 of 2022, and is expected to end FY2022 with a higher capacity than was achieved in FY2019; AFKL will approach 80-85% of 2019 ASKs in Q32022, and 85-90% of 2019 ASKs in Q42022, and with an overall capacity over the entire FY2022 of approx 80% of 2019's ASKs.
Transavia is the only part of the business whose ASKs will be above 2019 levels in Q3 and Q4 of 2022, and is expected to end FY2022 with a higher capacity than was achieved in FY2019; AFKL will approach 80-85% of 2019 ASKs in Q32022, and 85-90% of 2019 ASKs in Q42022, and with an overall capacity over the entire FY2022 of approx 80% of 2019's ASKs.
Last edited by irishguy28; Jul 29, 2022 at 5:02 am