Old Mar 17, 2020, 1:00 pm
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Last edit by: oliver2002
Air France's rebooking policy: https://www.airfrance.nl/NL/en/common/page_flottante/hp/news-air-traffic-air-france.htm?_ga=2.60869669.82286185.1584471569-101309917.1487618201 KLM's rebooking policy: https://www.klm.com/travel/nl_nl/prepare_for_travel/up_to_date/flight_update/index.htm

Worksheet/flowchart for Travel Agents: http://image.email.bluebiz.info/lib/fe9013727c62017f75/m/4/575524f1-d29b-4548-b393-eb5ab0eee26b.pdf

European Commission EC261/2004 guidelines in context of COVD-19 dated 18 MAR 2020 US DoT Enforcement Notice regarding refunds dated 3 APR 2020.

Some additional information:
1) North American ticket holders can typically request chargebacks from their banks.
2) Furthermore, for flights that touch US soil, they may also file complains with the US DOT.
3) American Express in France and in the Netherlands reportedly refuse to open chargeback disputes for cardholders. Unclear whether other banks are following this policy.
4) At this stage, 14 EU member states out of 27 support amending EC261 regulation (which mandates airlines give the consumer the choice of a refund) for the duration of the crisis. Some of these member states have already suspended the enforcement of the regulation with respect to the obligation for a refund. Air France/KLM supports the proposed amendment.

Statement by 12 of these 14 EU member states: https://www.aviation24.be/miscellaneous/passenger-rights/coronavirus-twelve-eu-member-states-ask-commission-to-amend-regulation-ec-261-2004-to-allow-issuance-of-vouchers-in-lieu-of-refund/


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COVID-19: AF/KL rebooking/refund policy

Old Mar 22, 2020, 12:43 pm
  #226  
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 293
I changed my flight to manilla today....
the new flight was cheaper but as soon as you want to change the price wil go up to meet the price you paid...
even if i thought would have issued a voucher for the less difference..... smart klm .....
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Old Mar 22, 2020, 12:46 pm
  #227  
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: YVR
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I have already send in the request to cancel our flights through their online channel and get a voucher for future travel over a week ago. So far still nothing in the email and today I received a notification for online check-in for our flight departing tomorrow, March 23rd.
Has anyone else had an issue where they have send in the cancellation but ticket still shows active on the day of departure?
My concern is that we will be a no-show and end up not receiving anything.
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Old Mar 22, 2020, 12:47 pm
  #228  
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 186
Originally Posted by warakorn
Yes!
But you may elect for a full cash refund (if the airline cancelled the flight).
Ha! Define "cancelled"... No more KLM flights from my city until at least May 1st... yet my April booking is sitting nice and pretty as if nothing was happening. Check-in clock is counting hours, I can even purchase extra options if I wish!

I do of course have an option to provide AFKLM with an intrest free loan, or change dates, but neither of these otpions work for me... so I guess I will just wait and see what happens when the clock runs out
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Old Mar 22, 2020, 1:43 pm
  #229  
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Programs: Flying Blue Platinum, Le ClubAccor Gold
Posts: 779
Originally Posted by KLflyerRalph
The official rebooking policy does not distinguish when the booking was made.
you are actually right for KLM.
i had read condition on AF, which are written differently.
KLM : « travel class »
AF: « fare Class»

therefore...it is definitely interesting...
When buying an AF-coded flight on KLM website (ticketed 074), which rebooking conditions apply ? AF or KLM ?

Last edited by canadavid; Mar 23, 2020 at 1:17 am Reason: question ?
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Old Mar 22, 2020, 3:40 pm
  #230  
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: MSP
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Originally Posted by warakorn
According to EC261/2004 article 8c you have to right to get moved to a later date for free - irrespective of fare class.
Edited to add, I did finally get a hold of KLM. It's what I thought: No need for me to cancel the (cancelled) itinerary; I have until 30SEP to rebook, for travel through 30NOV. "You have two choices: rebook any date before 30NOV, or you can get a voucher that expires in a year." He added that, if I don't use it in a year, I "might" be able to change that into cash.
Uhhh... huh?
So, I'll leave the Amex Chargeback and let's see what they say. They might allow the airlines to get away with this, they might not.
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Old Mar 22, 2020, 6:05 pm
  #231  
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No more KLM flights from my city until at least May 1st... yet my April booking is sitting nice and pretty as if nothing was happening. Check-in clock is counting hours, I can even purchase extra options if I wish!
All airlines are trying to trick their pax to cancel by themselves - with that KLM and co evade any EC261/2004 obligations.
Wait until KLM cancels your flight. It may happen ony 1-2 days before the flight.

I did finally get a hold of KLM. It's what I thought: No need for me to cancel the (cancelled) itinerary;
Actually, the itinerary was already cancelled by KLM.

have until 30SEP to rebook, for travel through 30NOV. "You have two choices: rebook any date before 30NOV, or you can get a voucher that expires in a year." He added that, if I don't use it in a year, I "might" be able to change that into cash.
Do not accept this! Press for a cash refund!
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Old Mar 23, 2020, 1:59 am
  #232  
 
Join Date: May 2010
Programs: Delta Silver, HH Gold, Accor Gold, IHG Platinum
Posts: 5,344
Originally Posted by kyushuman
"You have two choices: rebook any date before 30NOV, or you can get a voucher that expires in a year." He added that, if I don't use it in a year, I "might" be able to change that into cash.
This is indeed KL's current strategy, similar to United.
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Old Mar 23, 2020, 8:08 am
  #233  
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Programs: FB Gold
Posts: 39
Another data point, my outbound KLM booked and operated flight on Friday was cancelled. I asked for a cash refund but was denied stating extreme circumstances. So either rebook to later date or get a voucher.

Regarding the voucher, I got in written (WhatsApp) the promise that the voucher could be paid in cash if the voucher is not used within the nominal 12 month validity period.
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Last edited by TLSpace; Mar 23, 2020 at 8:23 am Reason: specified it concerns KLM booked and operated flight
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Old Mar 23, 2020, 8:12 am
  #234  
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
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I would not bank on that. If a refund has been refused, you have every reason to get cash back via a chargeback on your credit card.
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Old Mar 23, 2020, 8:19 am
  #235  
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Los Angeles
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I don't know whether this is new but the AF website now says "it is no longer possible to obtain a refund", regardless of whether the passenger no longer wants to fly or whether the airline canceled the flight.
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Old Mar 23, 2020, 8:50 am
  #236  
 
Join Date: Mar 2020
Posts: 43
Originally Posted by mfkne
I would not bank on that. If a refund has been refused, you have every reason to get cash back via a chargeback on your credit card.
And also it will take months to get a refund via bank
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Old Mar 23, 2020, 9:05 am
  #237  
 
Join Date: Mar 2020
Posts: 5
Originally Posted by JournoFlyer
I don't know whether this is new but the AF website now says "it is no longer possible to obtain a refund", regardless of whether the passenger no longer wants to fly or whether the airline canceled the flight.
Where on the website does it say that? Have been trying to get through on the phone. Can't decide whether to do the refund form plus an email stating I want a cash refund or just an email or credit card section75.
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Old Mar 23, 2020, 9:07 am
  #238  
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Los Angeles
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Originally Posted by Fairyelf
Where on the website does it say that? Have been trying to get through on the phone. Can't decide whether to do the refund form plus an email stating I want a cash refund or just an email or credit card section75.
One of my flights was canceled and that's what it said on the "manage my booking" page. I decided to go ahead and fill in the online form, and I'll be sure to press for a refund once they process the claim.
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Old Mar 23, 2020, 11:11 am
  #239  
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 544
Is anyone with greater knowledge of this than me able to confirm: does the free date change apply to a return leg if the outbound has already been flown? Am I correct in assuming that the initial date for the return leg should be before 31st May if so? Thanks.
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Old Mar 23, 2020, 12:27 pm
  #240  
siw
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: SE England
Programs: AF-KL Platinum, ALL Platinum
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The KLM website confirms that my LHR-AMS flight is cancelled. Spoke to an agent at the PSL and (as expected) was told that I can only have a voucher and not a refund - my ticket was a non refundable econmy class ticket. Therefore, it is a dead end trying to speak to KLM anymore. Is my only option for a refund to speak to AMEX, since I used my credit card for the purchase. I do not know the best contact now that KLM will not give a cash refund.

Thanks

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