Old Apr 14, 2020, 2:13 pm
FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides
Last edit by: Gajan
URL to information: https://www.flyingblue.nl/en/news/coronavirus-updates

Update 16/4/20

At this stage measurements which have been taken are for status maintain only. We are well aware that customers can also be impacted by less chance for an upgrade and/or reduced opportunities to carry over XP to the next year. We are constantly monitoring the evolution of the situation and are adjusting our policies accordingly. Should there be additional measures to compensate those impacts too, we will let our Flying Blue members know as soon as possible.
Update 15/4/20

In challenging times like today, travelling has become more difficult due to reasons beyond your control. In these trying times, we want to remove any uncertainty you may have about your Flying Blue Elite level.

We have put the following actions in place:

- We will maintain all Flying Blue Elite members with a qualification period ending between March 2020 and February 2021 for another 12 months.
- We will prevent all Miles from expiring between now and the end of 2020 for all our Explorer members.
From the Q&A that will be shared later today:


2. Will I keep my current level in my next qualification period?
In case your qualification period ends between March 2020 and February 2021, you will keep your current level even if you don’t reach the XP objective. Some examples:

A Silver member with a qualification period ending in April 2020:
· If you have gained 120 XP, your counter will be offset by 100 XP to maintain Silver and you keep a surplus of 20 XP.
· If you have gained 65 XP, we will credit the missing 35 XP and then offset your counter with 100 XP to reset your XP counter to 0 and maintain your Silver level.

A Gold member with a qualification period ending in April 2020:
· If you have gained 220 XP, your counter will be offset by 180 XP to maintain Gold and you keep a surplus of 40 XP.
· If you have gained 120 XP, we will credit the missing 60 XP and then offset your counter with 180 XP to reset your XP counter to 0 and maintain your Gold level.

A Platinum member with a qualification period ending in April 2020:
· If you have gained 450 XP, your counter will be offset by 300 XP to maintain Platinum and you keep a surplus of 150 XP.
· If you have gained 250 XP, we will credit the missing 50 XP and then offset your counter with 300 XP to reset your XP counter to 0 and maintain your Platinum level.

3. When will I see this XP measure in my online account?
Not until the first day in your new qualification period will you see in your online account that your current level is maintained. In your activity overview, you’ll find either ‘XP offered by Flying Blue’ with the number of XP that are credited to reach the XP objective, or ‘Counter offset’ with the XP objective deducted from your counter. A new card will be sent to you before your current card expires. The validity date of your digital card will be updated at the end of your current qualification period.

4. I want to upgrade to a higher level. Will I also be compensated?
Our measures enable Elite members to maintain their current level. It is not applicable for members who wish to upgrade to a higher level.

5. Will I keep my current XP balance in my next qualification period?
We will automatically offset the number of XP needed to maintain or upgrade a level. Any surplus XP will remain on your account. Some examples:

A Silver member with a qualification period ending in April 2020:
· If you have gained 120 XP, your counter will be offset by 100 XP to maintain Silver and you keep a surplus of 20 XP.
· If you have gained 65 XP, we will credit the missing 35 XP and then offset your counter with 100 XP to reset your XP counter to 0 and maintain your Silver level.

A Gold member with a qualification period ending in April 2020:
· If you have gained 220 XP, your counter will be offset by 180 XP to maintain Gold and you keep a surplus of 40 XP.
· If you have gained 120 XP, we will credit the missing 60 XP and then offset your counter with 180 XP to reset your XP counter to 0 and maintain your Gold level.

A Platinum member with a qualification period ending in April 2020:
· If you have gained 450 XP, your counter will be offset by 300 XP to maintain Platinum and you keep a surplus of 150 XP.
· If you have gained 250 XP, we will credit the missing 50 XP and then offset your counter with 300 XP to reset your XP counter to 0 and maintain your Platinum level.

6. What will happen to my years counting towards Platinum for life?
If you keep your current level during your next qualification period based on our special measures that membership year will count towards the 10 consecutive years needed to qualify for Platinum for life. For example:

· You have been a Platinum member for 9 consecutive years, and your current qualification period will end on 31 December 2020. Because of our measures, you will be maintained and reach 10 consecutive years of Platinum. On 1 January 2021, your new qualificaiton period starts and on 1 April 2021, we will change your level to Platinum for life.
· You have been a Platinum member for 7 consecutive years, and your current qualification period will end on 31 December 2020. Because of our measures, you will be maintained. On 1 January 2021, your 8th consecutive year of Platinum will start.
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COVID-19: status extensions confirmed

Old Apr 15, 2020, 1:33 am
  #121  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Programs: Flying Blue Platinum / Marriott Gold / Hilton Gold / IHG Platinum ... A former AA Platinum
Posts: 106
Originally Posted by vinnyc
Hmmm, let me share my opinion with an analogy that I hope you agree would apply here: students exams, and why not the French baccalauréat.

In order to pass the exam, you need to score with an average grade of 10/20. Also, statistically, you want to have around 80% of the student population to pass the exam, even if it means "post-adjusting" the results by the Jury.

Assume now that the exam that year was very very very difficult, and as a result, you have a gaussian (bell curve) of the grade distribution very much dragged to lower end, with only 40% of the sample scoring 10 or higher in order to pass. What are you going to do?

You will likely apply a parallel shift of the grades in order to bring the bell curve upward until you have those 80% passing. This means, in effect, applying the same bonus, or increment, to everyone equally.

The analogy here is therefore straightforward: you want those whom you deemed as "must pass" (in order to get your final 80%) to pass no matter what: the equivalent here are the FB members with Elite status that are deemed to absolutely need to get their status extended.

What about the students who, either because they were smarter/worked harder (not judging here) that initially ended up with good scores? They got the bonus too so that not only they passed, but with their improved grade, they will get the mention ("summa cum laude" – "Mention Très Bien" in French).

In this analogy applied to FB, applying a bonus XP or reducing (or, removing) the thresholds for the year (resulting in more rollover XPs for next year) are strictly equivalent, but the idea is that everyone should benefit from the adjustment.

In your example, don't get me wrong, I am more than happy to see all my fellow FB Elites get their status extended: it does not take away anything from me.

But if you give some benefits to others, I should also benefit from it as well. If you are giving away the benefits to some and not others, everyone will indeed have status, but regardless of the individual achievements. You are basically a proponent of "Equal Results" while I am a proponent of "Equal Opportunities". I want to give everyone the same opportunities to achieve a certain result, while you want to have the same results for everybody.



Cheers,
vinnyc
Yes i absolutely thought of the baccalaureat analogy as well (everybody passes, but still keep the distinction of the 'mentions')
Not to mention, that distinction IS useful for Flying Blue to an imperfect extend. In the same way that mentions can be environmental (you had a killler of a day on the exam day even if you're ordinarily a mediocre student), the fact is - Student A did do better than B and so Student A should be acknowledged

the fact is I did fly with AF this year -- and maybe another flyer who didn't really would have flown more in the dates where flying was still a thing, but just couldn't for totally legit reasons. For this reason, we all keep our status -- that's fair. But for distinction, we all keep our XPs the same, rather than seeing everyone lose 300 XP at the end of the year. Because somebody who flew 30XPs and somebody who flew 300XPs really didn't do the same thing.
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Old Apr 15, 2020, 1:37 am
  #122  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Programs: Eurostar Carte Blanche, SBB-CFF-FFS GA-AG, SNCF Grand Voyageur LeClub
Posts: 7,851
Let's see when people's online accounts are updated with a new validity date, i.e. current requl date + 1 year. Maybe that happens in the next few days, maybe only just before requal date.

By the way, any information about extension of "Abonnements"? Some aren't very costly (I got a Carte weekend for EUR 29 last year) so it's OK if they are not extended, but some are really pricey. What does AF do about them? Other public transport providers reimburse, at least partially, those "subscriptions".

Last edited by San Gottardo; Apr 15, 2020 at 1:44 am
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Old Apr 15, 2020, 1:44 am
  #123  
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: SJC / SFO
Programs: Flying Blue Platinum; Marriott Bonvoy Platinum; Hilton Gold
Posts: 795
Hmm, it's actually a bit disappointing that people will lose their rollover XPs from previous years.
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Old Apr 15, 2020, 1:46 am
  #124  
 
Join Date: May 2011
Programs: FB plf; IB oro; LA black; ET silver
Posts: 459
"Généreux par nature..." unless true frequent flyers !
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Old Apr 15, 2020, 1:49 am
  #125  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Programs: Flying Blue Platinum / Marriott Gold / Hilton Gold / IHG Platinum ... A former AA Platinum
Posts: 106
What's really silly here is that the solution ("the solution") is simply to credit everybody with a number of XPs equivalent to what they need to maintain status, and then take out the usual number of XPs for that status at their anniversary dates
Plat flyers see 300 XPs credited, say, in June -- and then, as your anniversary dates rolls around, you lose 300XPs. Whatever is left over -- what you actually did fly this year, in other words, rolls over.

It absolutely wouldn't have been messy to implement. In fact, it's probably the easiest of all the things to implement.

And that's fair to both people who couldn't fly, and the people who did
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Old Apr 15, 2020, 2:26 am
  #126  
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: BNA/LAX/BWI/SZX/SIN
Posts: 649
Totally stupid. I agree with gaukuser, it would be so much easier to either credit all Plats 300 XPS or have no deduction at all for an additional year! I already have 320XPs accrued this year and should this not be rectified, I will not be using Flying Blue program anymore. Is there anyone we can write to to get this fixed?
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Old Apr 15, 2020, 2:38 am
  #127  
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 64
Xp deduction

So, i currently have 450xp with qualification in December, if I read this correctly they will still deduct 300xp and leave the 150xp as per normal ?

So no help there then.
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Old Apr 15, 2020, 2:47 am
  #128  
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Programs: FB Plat
Posts: 47
There are lots of corner cases that the proposed solution will not help with: take my case. I'm silver with an end date in September. I reached 100XP renewal threshold in the beginning of March, just before the situation kicked off. I have been flying more in the last two years than before (roughly once/twice per month - nothing like the road warriors here, but still more than ever before for me). Looking at my travel plans, I was expecting to get to 180XP by July or August, just in time to move up to Gold. With the situation as suggested above, I will now get no benefit - I am already keeping my status, I will be deducted 100XP in September, and it will take me another year to get to Gold.

I know that this is both a first world problem and not really a priority for AFKLM but the "fairest" solution in my opinion is just to extend the renewal deadlines by however months the shutdown lasts - lets say everything reopens in June (not likely but...) then there was a four month period, then for me the renewal date is in January, this gives me four additional months to get to Gold. For everyone else, it gives them the same time to get their renewal. Delta etc. response of two years being considered as one is much more generous, but I doubt that FB will go that way.
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Old Apr 15, 2020, 3:02 am
  #129  
Hilton 25+ BadgeMarriott 10+ Badge
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 4,320
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/undefined
Originally Posted by Tonic27
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/undefinedSo, i currently have 450xp with qualification in December, if I read this correctly they will still deduct 300xp and leave the 150xp as per normal ?

https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/undefinedSo no help there then.https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/undefined

From reading the Q&A in the wiki, this seems to be the case which in my opinion is totally useless, why does Flying Blue even bother. This is only beneficial for those that did not have any rollover XP's for those with rollover XP's it seems that we are being "punished".

Cheers!
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Old Apr 15, 2020, 3:16 am
  #130  
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: GOT
Programs: KL Plat
Posts: 487
In mine and Mrs Solevita's case, since the introduction of XPs and rollovers we've been aiming to start the new year with a reasonable balance to cover circumstances where we might be flying less for a period e.g. starting a family. As it happens this year was the first where we started with >300; I started with 360 and the wife 400 XP. If we don't end up flying much this year then we'll be starting next year with quite a low balance.

Ah well, to look at it another way, we haven't actually lost anything (yet) other than the fun of flying
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Old Apr 15, 2020, 3:45 am
  #131  
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Posts: 4
“A Platinum member with a qualification period ending in April 2020:
If you have gained 450 XP, your counter will be offset by 300 XP to maintain Platinum and you keep a surplus of 150 XP.
If you have gained 250 XP, we will credit the missing 50 XP and then offset your counter with 300 XP to reset your XP counter to 0 and maintain your Platinum level”

So basically the good customer who flew a lot and had 450 XP already gets no free XP while the platinum client who did not fly any segments during its qualification period gets 300 free XP! Incredibly unfair for the best clients!

Any recommendation for a good status match option for a less stingy airline such as Delta:
“Rollover for all 2020 Medallion Qualification Miles (MQMs) earned on flight spend or your eligible Delta SkyMiles American Express Card. All 2020 MQMs will be rolled over to 2021 for qualification towards 2022”
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Last edited by Antoon33; Apr 15, 2020 at 3:55 am
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Old Apr 15, 2020, 3:50 am
  #132  
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: UK/FR
Programs: FlyingBlue Platinum, Hertz PC
Posts: 886
Originally Posted by Antoon33

Any recommendation for a good status match option for a less stingy airline such as Delta:

“Rollover for all 2020 Medallion Qualification Miles (MQMs) earned on flight spend or your eligible Delta SkyMiles American Express Card. All 2020 MQMs will be rolled over to 2021 for qualification towards 2022”
Air Canada goes even further since if you qualify anyway in 2020 you're able to gift the elite status to someone else as yours was extended.
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Old Apr 15, 2020, 5:04 am
  #133  
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,811
Originally Posted by Mirk


Thank you. Very disappointed to see FB doing the extension this way as we've explained above. I'm going to lose a big part of my rollover XP and not getting any help from FB because of it.
You won't lose any rollover XPs - they're not changing the rollover system. Any rollover you have will carry over to the following year.

I guess your gripe is that you won't be receiving any "XP offered by Flying Blue", but as in your case you didn't need them, then they won't be adding to your total to give you extra rollover!

(Note: they are clear that they only want to preserve everyone's status, so the help is for those who can't do what you have already managed to do (or, using rollover from years ago, already had built up). Their intention is not to help people increase their status. As you are platinum that is less of an issue, but if they just added an amount* to everyone's account regardless, that would go towards helping lots of people to increase in status. I guess we can also take it that, for those Platinums carrying large Rollover balances, they don't want to increase that. To feel that you are losing out comes from a perspective where you think people fly only for status, and that therefore everyone else won't need to bother flying, and that you ultimately didn't need to fly either, had you only known)

*amount - it's also difficult to know what amount everyone should get, if it is not chosen, as in this scheme, to be the amount that it is just enough to maintain status. I'm sure you might come with a figure that you would find acceptable or fair, based solely on your circumstances - but imagine if they then added that same fixed amount to everyone's account. That would have all sorts of different outcomes - rather than, as in the current scheme, ensuring that everyone who currently holds status will, at the very least, retain that status for another year.
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Last edited by irishguy28; Apr 15, 2020 at 5:09 am
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Old Apr 15, 2020, 5:08 am
  #134  
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: AMS
Programs: Hilton Diamond, FB Plat
Posts: 312
I've just sent FB an Email praising the incentive to retain status, but that I'm very disappointed that the biggest customers with rollover XP get hit hardest and will see no benefit whatsoever.
I have ~1 'buffer' year of platinum XP which I'm now 'losing' completely next year because I cannot fly, get any status benefits or build up any points for the foreseeable months.

I recommend all other plat members to do exactly the same. I'd rather see a 'break/freeze' of XP for this year that doesn't count towards PFL than to deduct XP next year and lose all progress due to this year.
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Old Apr 15, 2020, 5:36 am
  #135  
Hilton 25+ BadgeMarriott 10+ Badge
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 4,320
As someone with load of rollover XP's I'm more in favour of them just NOT doing anything and those that lose status, lose it, and those that have sufficient rollover XP's maintains the status if sufficient. This way I as someone that flew and have my business to the alliance will not feel so unfairly treated....as usual, they must have some crazy intern coming up with such a scheme...

This way, at least it will reduce the number of pax eligible for the SkyPriority access especially the lounges and during boarding...in a fair way.
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