Simultaneous SkyMiles and Flying Blue accounts

Old Dec 15, 19, 1:11 pm
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Simultaneous SkyMiles and Flying Blue accounts

Hi everyone!

I'm currently with Delta SkyMiles (making Platinum this year), however the vast majority of my SkyTeam flying nowadays is with AF/KLM. Since my Citi Premier card allows the conversion to Flying Blue and redemption rates and availability on Europe-Africa routes are much better than with DL, I'm thinking of creating a Flying Blue account and using it strictly as a redemption route for Citi points.

This opens up a question, if I'm redeeming a flight via my Flying Blue account, but I also have status with Delta, how would the benefits work (e.g. SkyPriority, extra bags, lounge access)?

Also, if (down the road) I decide to start crediting miles from paid AF/KLM tickets to Flying Blue while still having Delta status, could I:
1) Use the existing DL status for the perks
2) Earn Flying Blue miles for the paid ticket
In other words, can 1) and 2) be done at the same time?

Thanks in advance for the info!
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Old Dec 15, 19, 3:56 pm
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I have both account also (FB & SM).

Most of the time I credit my AF flight on SM, and my DL flight on FB.
I found this is the best way to "optimize" miles, I have reach Diamond on SM quite "easily" (around 5 trips YUL-CDG-PVG in PE).

Yes, sometime it is tricky to put one cards and have miles credited to the other.
Yes you can have one account on your boarding pass, and when arrive at the lounge use the other.

But , be very careful, I have be "catch" 2x, the agent at the lounge change my account without advising me, and have the transaction be reserve is not easy.

Also using a smile (and a "please") help a lots...
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Old Dec 15, 19, 8:33 pm
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And the next thread started by OP will be “I wanted to credit the flights to FB, but they have been credited to DL and both airlines refuse to change, please help ,”
to OP : just joking, no offense to you. it’s just that we had a lot of cases like that recently in this forum

More seriously, to come back to your questions, yes it is possible but as FBPlatinum said, it can be tricky sometimes and you may face some problems of flights credited to the “wrong” programme.
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Old Dec 16, 19, 4:11 am
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Originally Posted by dmitriy55 View Post
Thanks in advance for the info!
In theory this is possible, but in practice, it will not work out the way you expect.

You will quickly find that your Delta flights will start randomly, or consistently, posting to your Flying Blue account. Even when you have taken great care to keep them forensically separated.
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Old Dec 16, 19, 12:57 pm
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Originally Posted by FBplatinum View Post
But , be very careful, I have be "catch" 2x, the agent at the lounge change my account without advising me, and have the transaction be reserve is not easy.

Also using a smile (and a "please") help a lots...
Yes, indeed about being nice & polite to ground agents.

Originally Posted by Goldorak View Post
And the next thread started by OP will be I wanted to credit the flights to FB, but they have been credited to DL and both airlines refuse to change, please help ,
Yes, this is exactly the scenario that I was trying to avoid with being a member of both programs at the same time. That being said, how difficult is it to "reverse" miles out of one program and into another?

Originally Posted by irishguy28 View Post
You will quickly find that your Delta flights will start randomly, or consistently, posting to your Flying Blue account. Even when you have taken great care to keep them forensically separated.
Thanks for all the responses. It does sound like there is no way to "cleanly" separate the transactions on the two programs. A bit disappointing, but, as they say, c'est la vie...
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Old Dec 16, 19, 9:43 pm
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Originally Posted by dmitriy55 View Post
Yes, this is exactly the scenario that I was trying to avoid with being a member of both programs at the same time. That being said, how difficult is it to "reverse" miles out of one program and into another?



Thanks for all the responses. It does sound like there is no way to "cleanly" separate the transactions on the two programs. A bit disappointing, but, as they say, c'est la vie...
Im not giving up on having both FB and Skymiles active and in use at the same time. I think its ridiculous that the recommended fix is to close one of them, but thats just me...

I had some miles credit to FB recently and got them reversed after around 6 emails, 2 FB messages and 3 phone calls. (I think the emails were effective, but maybe they save notes when I call?)

Make sure you get a paper boarding pass for all flights showing the correct FFP with your account # and be prepared to be persistent.
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Old Dec 17, 19, 2:27 am
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I guess, assuming that it's the correct FF number that's there in the reservation system and on the ticket, at the time of the flight, how does it actually happen that the "wrong" FF program gets credited?
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Old Dec 17, 19, 7:18 am
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Originally Posted by dmitriy55 View Post
I guess, assuming that it's the correct FF number that's there in the reservation system and on the ticket, at the time of the flight, how does it actually happen that the "wrong" FF program gets credited?
If you go to the lounge and access with other FF cards

Example:

The FF on your boarding pass and your reservation is SM cards (Silver), but you access the lounge with a FB cards (Platinum) (this is what I do at my begin with my SM cards).

The lounge staff can change your FF # on your reservation and put the FB one. As I say before, you must be careful when you use both cards in the same "trip".

This can also happen if you try to have an additional bag at the check in desk.
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Old Dec 17, 19, 8:23 am
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Originally Posted by FBplatinum View Post
If you go to the lounge and access with other FF cards

This can also happen if you try to have an additional bag at the check in desk.
Got you, makes sense. Seems like one needs to be super careful with this, but it's possible overall, save for an occasional necessary "reversal"
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Old Dec 17, 19, 8:34 am
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Originally Posted by dmitriy55 View Post
I guess, assuming that it's the correct FF number that's there in the reservation system and on the ticket, at the time of the flight, how does it actually happen that the "wrong" FF program gets credited?
Even if only one FFP number/status appears on your boarding pass - and clearly a boarding pass is designed to only show one single FFP number/programme - there is no such restriction on airline reservations. The boarding pass may show only the most recent number added, but the reservation can - and does - remember all previous iterations of any other numbers previously entered into the field.

Don't assume that just because a new number is associated with a booking, that the previous number is bumped off. In many cases, all previous numbers remain associated with the booking.

And, of course, in such cases the miles may go to any of those other programmes.

Apologies for the blurriness of the image - I posted this many years ago on a different thread, but the image is no longer hosted by TinyPic and I could only grab this blurry copy from a Google cache - but here is an example of a KLM reservation, as viewed on the Garuda site, showing that 3 separate FFP numbers were associated with the reservation. An AZ number (listed twice; at the time, AZ was my main programme, and there were issues with successfully adding Alitalia numbers on the KLM website. The KLM website would complain that the number was incorrect/badly formatted/didn't exist, but viewing the reservation elsewhere - at the time Garuda was the place to do so - showed that each entry that was outwardly rejected by the KLM website, and which did not appear at all to have been associated with the booking when looking at it on the KLM website, had in fact been associated with the reservation.




(In the above, the last line reads: "frequent flyer(s): AZ XXXXXXXX, KL XXXXXXXXXX, AZ XXXXXXXXXX. In those days, it sometimes was necessary to use leading zeroes when using 8-digit AZ numbers on AF/KL, explaining why the number was entered as both an 8-digit and 10-digit variant; in desperation at not having the AZ number added by the KL website (though in actuality, it had added them), I then also added my FB number. Hence the 3 "separate" frequent flyer programmes listed).

Don't even ask me, at this remove, where the miles ended up.

Don't make the mistake that when you "update" the FFP number - or ask an agent to remove and replace an FFP number - that all trace of the previous number(s) has/have been expunged, and that the miles will go to the only number you think is in the reservation.

It doesn't mean that at all.

The answer: Observe complete and total "hygiene" when dealing with reservations. Do not look at one reservation, bearing a "good" number, when logged in using the FFP account/airline account of a different number. Do not rely on the ability to "replace" a number. Refrain from adding any number to your reservation - and yes, this means booking without being logged into your airline/FFP account - until you know for certain which airline/FFP you want to earn those miles in

Last edited by irishguy28; Dec 17, 19 at 8:39 am
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Old Dec 17, 19, 11:14 am
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Originally Posted by irishguy28 View Post
The answer: Observe complete and total "hygiene" when dealing with reservations. Do not look at one reservation, bearing a "good" number, when logged in using the FFP account/airline account of a different number. Do not rely on the ability to "replace" a number. Refrain from adding any number to your reservation - and yes, this means booking without being logged into your airline/FFP account - until you know for certain which airline/FFP you want to earn those miles in
This is very helpful. I didn't realize that the GDS can actually hold 2+ airline numbers and the ground agent "removing" an FF number from the record is not a reliable indicator that it's really gone. That being said, this rules out being able to utilize the "benefits" of status in one FF program, while crediting the flight to another one, at least not without the risks involved.
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Old Dec 17, 19, 12:02 pm
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Also, make sure you are logged out of everything when you check-in online for your flight. I'm so nutty after my last experience that I don't even call them from my cellphone that is associated with multiple FFPs. (Probably don't make a difference, but at this point I am not taking any chances.)
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Old Dec 17, 19, 2:10 pm
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Originally Posted by dmitriy55 View Post
That being said, this rules out being able to utilize the "benefits" of status in one FF program, while crediting the flight to another one, at least not without the risks involved.
It doesn't.

Carry your status card with you.

Present your status card to obtain your status benefits. But ensure that the agent doesn't add this number to your reservation, as most are trained to do. Just explain what you are doing - earning in one programme, using the status of another. It is perfectly legal and allowed. There are separate FQTV and FQTS fields which allow the reservation to hold the details of two separate programs - one in which status is being earned, and a different one from which status benefits are derived. This was never fully utilised, and the FQTS field (which would be the one granting status) is unknown to most agents/travellers etc. The myriad of individual systems/interfaces may not even support the ability to fill this separate field. The myriad of individual airline back end systems may not even bother to look at this field, so there is no consistent guarantee that it would actually work as designed, across all airlines/reservation types.

Trust me - asking an agent to fill in these fields separately will probably be met with blank stares. Some systems may not allow access to the separate FQTS field. Even if the agent has a system which should be able to access these separate fields (and I have never seen a user-accessible website/tool that allows you to query/populate an FQTS field for any of your reservations), you must assume that they will do it incorrectly, or not at all. Hence, while technically it was foreseen to allow exactly the seamless operation of the behavour you want, it has never been put into practice, and will not work for you as intended regardless of your attempts to get it to do so. Therefore, you must act carefully so that your behavour alone will bring about the desired outcome, without requiring or asking for assistance from any agent or employee, regardless of how capable they may appear to be.



(That said, you will find some agents who claim that you can only earn in the programme whose status perks you use. Just hope that you don't meet one of these.)

Last edited by irishguy28; Dec 17, 19 at 2:20 pm
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Old Dec 17, 19, 4:26 pm
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Thank you very much for the informative response. That being said, is it possible to access Skyteam lounges with the status card (now virtual with DL) and by showing the boarding pass visually, but asking the agents not to pull up the reservation itself?
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Old Dec 17, 19, 6:49 pm
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Originally Posted by dmitriy55 View Post
Thank you very much for the informative response. That being said, is it possible to access Skyteam lounges with the status card (now virtual with DL) and by showing the boarding pass visually, but asking the agents not to pull up the reservation itself?
Yes.

Just tell them you are not sure what FF program you want the miles credited.

But, if you already know what program, I strongly suggest to have it put FIRST. In case the staff (or the system) automatically put it...
In this case, just show your boarding pass at the lounge and explain them you want the miles credited to this FF, but want to use the other FF card to access the lounge.

I never have problem with this at AF & KLM lounge when I begin the SM program (until I am gold).
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