KLM versus Air France in business class

Old Nov 25, 19, 3:11 am
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Question KLM versus Air France in business class

Next year I will fly either KLM or Air France in business class to CDG. It would be SFO-LAX-CDG on Air France 777-300ER or SFO-AMS-CDG on KLM 787-10. I believe both have 1-2-1 seating. I'm under the impression that Air France has better food and wine, but on the other hand I like the first leg of a trip such as this to be the long haul (and thus KLM), to minimize chances of delays or cancellations in the firs leg messing up a trip. Does anyone have any recommendation re one versus the other, in terms of hard product, service, IFE, etc?

Thanks for any advice.
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Old Nov 25, 19, 3:43 am
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Originally Posted by Thunderroad View Post
Next year I will fly either KLM or Air France in business class to CDG. It would be SFO-LAX-CDG on Air France 777-300ER or SFO-AMS-CDG on KLM 787-10.....Does anyone have any recommendation re one versus the other, in terms of hard product, service, IFE, etc?

Thanks for any advice.
you can see numerous recent reports which will help you to get an idea

https://flight-report.com/en/s/?airl...=0&annee=0&J=1

https://flight-report.com/en/s/?airl...=0&annee=0&J=1
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Old Nov 25, 19, 5:36 am
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And you will find numerous threads in the sub-forums. I like AF better because I find them higher-end but KL is fine and their seats are similar. Beware that some AF aircraft still have old seats (e.g. A380).
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Old Nov 25, 19, 6:01 am
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Between the two I always prefer AF as I'm not a big fan of the 2-2-2- setup of KLM J, and Schipol has really underwhelming lounges (plus a lot of broken walkways...).

That said, CDG is unfortunately not the most efficient airport for changing, the different terminals in 2 can be confusing, and occasionally require bus transfer.
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Old Nov 25, 19, 6:07 am
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You will find lots of different opinions around here, but in the end, KL and AF have a very similar reverse herringbone seat, and service of both carriers can be very good. Just make sure you select an AF777 or KL787, not a KL777 or AF A380.

I personally prefer KLM
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Old Nov 25, 19, 6:41 am
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Originally Posted by Thunderroad View Post
Next year I will fly either KLM or Air France in business class to CDG. It would be SFO-LAX-CDG on Air France 777-300ER or SFO-AMS-CDG on KLM 787-10. I believe both have 1-2-1 seating. I'm under the impression that Air France has better food and wine, but on the other hand I like the first leg of a trip such as this to be the long haul (and thus KLM), to minimize chances of delays or cancellations in the firs leg messing up a trip. Does anyone have any recommendation re one versus the other, in terms of hard product, service, IFE, etc?

Thanks for any advice.
The obvious choice for me would be AF, especially as you are flying to Paris as your destination.
KLM probably has the edge on IFE however AF is better at food, overall luxury feel and of course the lounges at CDG are superior to their equivalents at AMS.
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Old Nov 25, 19, 7:12 am
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Originally Posted by Thunderroad View Post
Next year I will fly either KLM or Air France in business class to CDG. It would be SFO-LAX-CDG on Air France 777-300ER or SFO-AMS-CDG on KLM 787-10. I believe both have 1-2-1 seating. I'm under the impression that Air France has better food and wine, but on the other hand I like the first leg of a trip such as this to be the long haul (and thus KLM), to minimize chances of delays or cancellations in the firs leg messing up a trip. Does anyone have any recommendation re one versus the other, in terms of hard product, service, IFE, etc?

Thanks for any advice.
Why not fly SFO-CDG direct?
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Old Nov 25, 19, 7:39 am
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I would go for KLM for more personal service, the food looks imho badly but tastes fine, NF champagne is very decent, however AF has got now Charles Heidsieck, which would be my go. Anyway, the KLM house as a gift would make me fly long haul with KL
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Old Nov 25, 19, 9:09 am
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Have you been to the brand-new non Schengen KLM lounge recently? its a different cookie than what it was. You can not call that new lounge underwhelming..
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Old Nov 25, 19, 9:20 am
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Thanks very much for the helpful replies, folks. It turns out that my choice is non-existent. I'm booking an award ticket and it seems that the KLM availability is phantom despite it's appearing available online. The CSRs I've spoken to see it too, at first, but then find out that it's not actually available for a few days I'm interested in. I still welcome any more thoughts for future reference, but might not have the choice for this trip (unless things change within the 24 hour refund window) and have booked AF.

Originally Posted by brunos View Post
Why not fly SFO-CDG direct?
It's because that route is only available at a prohibitive cost in miles. Sorry I didn't initially note that this is an award booking.
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Old Nov 25, 19, 12:35 pm
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Originally Posted by Hollandair View Post
Have you been to the brand-new non Schengen KLM lounge recently? its a different cookie than what it was. You can not call that new lounge underwhelming..
Careful saying that around these parts, there's an entire thread of people claiming it's basically on par with Guantanamo Bay as far as treatment goes. It even has a -shock- paid-for restaurant in addition to the free offerings. It's the end of the world. Apparently.

OP: I pick whatever has direct aisle access. If both do, I pick KLM; I prefer the food and service.
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Old Nov 25, 19, 1:57 pm
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I would go for 787 regardless of the airline. Because 777-300 is old and noisy and has to be decommissioned. The most important difference is the cabin pressure and humidity, which are higher in 787 (and A350/A380) compared to 777, so you will feel much better after the flight. For the very same reason, I would prefer A380 to any Boeing -- the upper deck in A380 is very quiet.
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Old Nov 25, 19, 2:11 pm
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Originally Posted by chil View Post
Because 777-300 is old and noisy and has to be decommissioned.
hmmmm
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Old Nov 25, 19, 2:22 pm
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I would pick AF for the better food and wine, but transferring at CDG isn't fun. KLM has better service overall, plus you get one of those tiny Dutch houses.
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Old Nov 25, 19, 2:35 pm
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Originally Posted by Sleepy_Sentry View Post
I would pick AF for the better food and wine, but transferring at CDG isn't fun.
We keep reading this constantly but, sorry, this is plainly wrong for many years now for intra AF/KL/DL connections. Those are very easy and very quick for the immense majority of them. Yes, AMS is still better/easier than CDG overall, but saying that connections CDG for AF are not fun, horrible, etc is just wrong.
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