Fraudulent pax onboard AF/KL - your stories
Aug 14, 2019, 3:13 pm
#1
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Fraudulent pax onboard AF/KL - your stories
I had a first time story last week on my flight ORD-CDG. I was in J at the window and I boarded first before anyone else to have the opportunity to take pictures of the new cabins while the flight was empty. At one point during the boarding process, a guy arrived and was obviously seated close to me and he started to install himself at this seat. The guy never said a word, so clearly he was not bothering me. But, my gut feeling was telling me that this guy was not a J regular. But of course nothing wrong with that. Every J regular had his/her first time and it could also have been an op-up.
He took the menu and amenity kits distributed, put the socks and slippers on. He had the Champagne pre-take off. We took off and minutes after the crew was released from their seats, one flight attendant came and ask him his BP. And then said, sorry sir you are in 40K (random seat number here of course). So they ask him very politely and with a lot of professionalism to leave and go to his assigned seat. He never said a word. But he took his time to take all is belongings.
The chief purser came to discuss with me afterwards and said that was a 1st time for her on a US route. She said that they have very frequently this problem on some routes and one famous for that was BEY.
I thought it would be funny to start a thread on this and share our AF/KL stories
He took the menu and amenity kits distributed, put the socks and slippers on. He had the Champagne pre-take off. We took off and minutes after the crew was released from their seats, one flight attendant came and ask him his BP. And then said, sorry sir you are in 40K (random seat number here of course). So they ask him very politely and with a lot of professionalism to leave and go to his assigned seat. He never said a word. But he took his time to take all is belongings.
The chief purser came to discuss with me afterwards and said that was a 1st time for her on a US route. She said that they have very frequently this problem on some routes and one famous for that was BEY.
I thought it would be funny to start a thread on this and share our AF/KL stories
Aug 14, 2019, 5:21 pm
#2
Join Date: Sep 2016
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I've had it happen before with people simply taking my seat. Not asking, but by the time I get to my seat, there'd be a couple there with one of them in my seat, asking me if I'd mind sitting elsewhere.
I'd be fine with considering a move if asked, but if you take my seat I'm not exceptionally motivated to do you any favors.
I'd be fine with considering a move if asked, but if you take my seat I'm not exceptionally motivated to do you any favors.
Aug 15, 2019, 2:06 am
#3
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On my last AF flight (CDG-AMS), a guy came over and told me to get out of his seat, 2F.
I called over the purser, who explained to the gentleman that he did indeed have CDG Terminal 2F, but his assigned seat was further back...
Not KL/AF, but I was on an AZ flight to Rome back in January. A "kid" in a tracksuit and talking non-stop on his phone took 3F, the seat directly behind mine, in the last row of a very quiet business cabin (I don't always choose 2F, I swear!). Even after the door closed, the plane had pushed back, and the flight safety demonstration had been completed, and we were on our long taxi to the runway, he continued to talk on his phone. Eventually, the purser noticed and asked him to switch off his device. For good measure, he also asked to see his boarding pass - and swiftly sent him to his assigned seat (which was only a few rows further back) before the plane took off.
If he'd just hung up on his call, he might very well have kept his seat - at least until the meals were being served!
I called over the purser, who explained to the gentleman that he did indeed have CDG Terminal 2F, but his assigned seat was further back...
Not KL/AF, but I was on an AZ flight to Rome back in January. A "kid" in a tracksuit and talking non-stop on his phone took 3F, the seat directly behind mine, in the last row of a very quiet business cabin (I don't always choose 2F, I swear!). Even after the door closed, the plane had pushed back, and the flight safety demonstration had been completed, and we were on our long taxi to the runway, he continued to talk on his phone. Eventually, the purser noticed and asked him to switch off his device. For good measure, he also asked to see his boarding pass - and swiftly sent him to his assigned seat (which was only a few rows further back) before the plane took off.
If he'd just hung up on his call, he might very well have kept his seat - at least until the meals were being served!
Last edited by irishguy28; Aug 15, 2019 at 2:29 am Reason: spelling
Aug 15, 2019, 3:34 am
#4
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I witness that kind of behavior from time to time, albeit infrequently.
Of course one only notices the ones who sooner or later get caught. Some may get away with it.
On shorthaul KL flights it is common for the purser to do a quick J headcount as soon as boarding has been completed. This sometimes results in pax sitting in seats that should be vacant according to the manifest being asked to show their boarding card. In the majority of cases they turn out to have seated themselves in the wrong seat (but right class), intentionally or inadvertedly.
On longhauls the crew will often go around the cabin with a pax list to take meal or beverage orders before departure, which will catch trespassers out.
Another category of interlopers comprises of those who sneak into the darkened J cabin on night flights to snooze in a flatbed seat. It wouldn't surprise me if quite a few of those don't get caught, or are only noticed when the lights come on for breakfast.
As for those who simply take the first seat they fancy and then expect the rightful occupant to move, I never argue with them. It's the cabin crew's job to sort that out. If that means they end up upgrading me, so much the better.
Some pax of course make honest mistakes. Until United discontinued Global First, I would fly them across the pond. My favorite seat on both the 767 and 777 was 1K. In fact, I've never flown UA longhaul in any other seat than 1K. Except for that one flight when another pax beat me to it. I boarded the aircraft and, purely out of force of habit, sat down in 1K, after stowing my stuff in various lockers and compartments. Not much later, and to my embarrassment, a gentleman with a boarding card for 1K showed up. Fortunately, he accepted my apologies and was happy to take 2K instead.
Johan
Of course one only notices the ones who sooner or later get caught. Some may get away with it.
On shorthaul KL flights it is common for the purser to do a quick J headcount as soon as boarding has been completed. This sometimes results in pax sitting in seats that should be vacant according to the manifest being asked to show their boarding card. In the majority of cases they turn out to have seated themselves in the wrong seat (but right class), intentionally or inadvertedly.
On longhauls the crew will often go around the cabin with a pax list to take meal or beverage orders before departure, which will catch trespassers out.
Another category of interlopers comprises of those who sneak into the darkened J cabin on night flights to snooze in a flatbed seat. It wouldn't surprise me if quite a few of those don't get caught, or are only noticed when the lights come on for breakfast.
As for those who simply take the first seat they fancy and then expect the rightful occupant to move, I never argue with them. It's the cabin crew's job to sort that out. If that means they end up upgrading me, so much the better.
Some pax of course make honest mistakes. Until United discontinued Global First, I would fly them across the pond. My favorite seat on both the 767 and 777 was 1K. In fact, I've never flown UA longhaul in any other seat than 1K. Except for that one flight when another pax beat me to it. I boarded the aircraft and, purely out of force of habit, sat down in 1K, after stowing my stuff in various lockers and compartments. Not much later, and to my embarrassment, a gentleman with a boarding card for 1K showed up. Fortunately, he accepted my apologies and was happy to take 2K instead.
Johan
Last edited by johan rebel; Aug 15, 2019 at 4:01 am Reason: clarification
Aug 15, 2019, 8:46 am
#5
Join Date: Jul 2015
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I've seen a guy take an empty J seat on AMS-CDG. Purser noticed the count being not right before departure, asking the man for his boarding pass, then sending him back. He got into a shouting match, but at the end went back.
Escorted out by the french police at CDG.
Escorted out by the french police at CDG.
Aug 15, 2019, 10:58 am
#6
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: CW
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I see this happen very often on KL longhaul flights. People with a Y boarding pass, shortly before or after take-off, grab their luggage and sneak into the J cabin. Most of the times they carry a box of chocolates or stroopwafels for the cabin crew.
They are called KLM staff.
They are called KLM staff.
Aug 15, 2019, 1:39 pm
#7
Join Date: Sep 2006
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Got an op-up from W to J on CDG-JFK (years ago, DL Silver at the time) and it was to a middle J seat. When I arrived to my seat, it was taken by a lady who pretended to be sleeping (unless she fell asleep 2 minutes after installing herself) and next to her was her was a gentleman traveling with her. I arrived and looked at both of them and he told me to take another seat because his wife could not be bothered as she was sleeping. A flight attendant quickly came to see what was going on, turns out none of them were sitting there, one of them was upgraded to W (oddly to my old seat) and the other one was in Y.
I was also accused of seat poaching once (not on AF/KL though). I was flying MIA-CDG on AA and a passenger arrived to my seat with an attitude and asked me for my boarding pass. Two flight attendants quickly arrived, and of course, being young (26-27 years old at the time) and not matching the rest of the cabin ethnic complexions immediately raised an alert to the flight attendants, who demanded to see my BP instead of the gentleman's BP. I pointed this out, which embarrassed at least one of them and asked the gentleman for his BP instead. Turns out he was sitting two or three rows behind. His words: I always sit here so I assumed I was sitting here today. Not an apology from him or the flight attendants.
I was also accused of seat poaching once (not on AF/KL though). I was flying MIA-CDG on AA and a passenger arrived to my seat with an attitude and asked me for my boarding pass. Two flight attendants quickly arrived, and of course, being young (26-27 years old at the time) and not matching the rest of the cabin ethnic complexions immediately raised an alert to the flight attendants, who demanded to see my BP instead of the gentleman's BP. I pointed this out, which embarrassed at least one of them and asked the gentleman for his BP instead. Turns out he was sitting two or three rows behind. His words: I always sit here so I assumed I was sitting here today. Not an apology from him or the flight attendants.
Aug 15, 2019, 3:31 pm
#9
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: MAN
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Not AF/KL, a few years ago after a tiring day in Bangkok I stumbled into 1A only to be curtly shouted at by the holder of the seat, my seat was 1L. I apologised profusely and settled in my correct seat and dozed off. The FA later told me that 1A guy was still angry and that I should apologise again. I didn't. He went mental at me in Heathrow. At least I got a good night's sleep I told him...
Aug 15, 2019, 3:42 pm
#10
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AFKL Platinum/Club 2000, UA Gold, Marriott Bonvoy Platinum
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Three years ago, CDG-TLV, Business Class, sitting in 1F. Late departure from CDG landing into TLV at circa 5:00am.
A man sits in 1A, then a couple comes to sit in 1B/1C. This obviously cannot happen as the middle seat (1B in this case) is left empty in medium haul J.
The chief purser comes and asks both men their boarding pass. One of them (the one in 1C) was effectively seated there, but the other one was at the back, first row of Y, in 4F, or rather "F4" as he was calling it.
The purser kindly asked him to go back to his seat and the man started to beg him so he could stay there, saying he wanted to be next to his boyfriend/husband, and that he would "stay quiet and not eat". He ended up complying with the instructions, and once he was on the way to his real seat, asked the purser if he could leave his bag in the J-class overhead bin. The purser nodded. Ouf, at least the bag was next to his boyfriend.
It was heart breaking, I tell you.
A man sits in 1A, then a couple comes to sit in 1B/1C. This obviously cannot happen as the middle seat (1B in this case) is left empty in medium haul J.
The chief purser comes and asks both men their boarding pass. One of them (the one in 1C) was effectively seated there, but the other one was at the back, first row of Y, in 4F, or rather "F4" as he was calling it.
The purser kindly asked him to go back to his seat and the man started to beg him so he could stay there, saying he wanted to be next to his boyfriend/husband, and that he would "stay quiet and not eat". He ended up complying with the instructions, and once he was on the way to his real seat, asked the purser if he could leave his bag in the J-class overhead bin. The purser nodded. Ouf, at least the bag was next to his boyfriend.
It was heart breaking, I tell you.
Aug 15, 2019, 11:44 pm
#11
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Flight JFK-CDG, Premiere on the A380, accused myself of being a fraud and then witnessing a real fraud:
Went on board, settled in 1A, but very quickly afterwards went to the washroom, passing in front of the cabin/stairs. Closing the washroom door, an FA blocked the door "Where are you from?" (With a heavy French accent - I suppose he wanted to say "which cabin do you sit in" or "what is your seat", but his English sentence conveyed something else). I stared at him, rolling my eyes, said "Turkey. And I'd like to use the washroom" and just closed the door, primarily driven by biological urgency than anything else. He later came to my seat, apologised profusely, I put him at ease by speaking French, he explained that he had wanted to "protect" the Premiere wash rooms from pax from other cabins and simply hadn't realised yet that I was a P pax. He was very embarrassed, especially when I told him that I understood the intention but asking where somebody was from was not a smart move, as it shouldn't matter whether I am Canadian, French or Russian to use the washroom.
On that same flight was a family of four. Parents with a teenage son and a small child (4-5 years old maybe). Had met them already in the P lounge in JFK, then they were walked to the plane like all the other P pax. Once on board, only the parents and the small kid settled in the P cabin, and they were the only other pax for at least 1.5 hours after takeoff. Next morning, when I woke up, I could see how the teenage son also woke up, in 3L, with all the bedding, all clad in the Premiere Pyjama, and then got the P breakfast service. Out of curiosity l watched on the pax manifest that the CDC had left lying in front: indeed, only 3 family members were booked in P, daddy was a Plat (but not for life or ULTI or C2000), mummy was no status, and the family name was not one which you would associate with special benefits extended to them.
Nice to know how they protect the washroom by asking inappropriate questions, but accept that families bring their members from other cabins into the P cabin.
Went on board, settled in 1A, but very quickly afterwards went to the washroom, passing in front of the cabin/stairs. Closing the washroom door, an FA blocked the door "Where are you from?" (With a heavy French accent - I suppose he wanted to say "which cabin do you sit in" or "what is your seat", but his English sentence conveyed something else). I stared at him, rolling my eyes, said "Turkey. And I'd like to use the washroom" and just closed the door, primarily driven by biological urgency than anything else. He later came to my seat, apologised profusely, I put him at ease by speaking French, he explained that he had wanted to "protect" the Premiere wash rooms from pax from other cabins and simply hadn't realised yet that I was a P pax. He was very embarrassed, especially when I told him that I understood the intention but asking where somebody was from was not a smart move, as it shouldn't matter whether I am Canadian, French or Russian to use the washroom.
On that same flight was a family of four. Parents with a teenage son and a small child (4-5 years old maybe). Had met them already in the P lounge in JFK, then they were walked to the plane like all the other P pax. Once on board, only the parents and the small kid settled in the P cabin, and they were the only other pax for at least 1.5 hours after takeoff. Next morning, when I woke up, I could see how the teenage son also woke up, in 3L, with all the bedding, all clad in the Premiere Pyjama, and then got the P breakfast service. Out of curiosity l watched on the pax manifest that the CDC had left lying in front: indeed, only 3 family members were booked in P, daddy was a Plat (but not for life or ULTI or C2000), mummy was no status, and the family name was not one which you would associate with special benefits extended to them.
Nice to know how they protect the washroom by asking inappropriate questions, but accept that families bring their members from other cabins into the P cabin.
Aug 16, 2019, 2:52 am
#13
Join Date: Mar 2010
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(...) Out of curiosity l watched on the pax manifest that the CDC had left lying in front: indeed, only 3 family members were booked in P, daddy was a Plat (but not for life or ULTI or C2000), mummy was no status, and the family name was not one which you would associate with special benefits extended to them.
Nice to know how they protect the washroom by asking inappropriate questions, but accept that families bring their members from other cabins into the P cabin.
Nice to know how they protect the washroom by asking inappropriate questions, but accept that families bring their members from other cabins into the P cabin.
Aug 16, 2019, 3:20 am
#14
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: CPT,AMS
Posts: 4,410
I once flew CPT-AMS, sitting in 6H with the window seat empty, had a light meal and went to sleep around 1AM, at some point it felt like there is someone sleeping in 6K but I wasn't sure if I was dreaming it until the purser came along the breakfast service to ask if I slept well and have I noticed that 'I had a guest for most of the night'
