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Virgin Atlantic, Air France and KLM launch codeshare partnership

Virgin Atlantic, Air France and KLM launch codeshare partnership

Old Mar 4, 19, 9:08 am
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Virgin Atlantic, Air France and KLM launch codeshare partnership

Today it was announced that AFKL, DL & VS have a new code share agreement: https://www.airfranceklm.com/en/news...re-partnership

I believe very good developments in strengthening the Skyteam network in western Europe and UK in particular. Curious to see how soon FlyBe gets adopted into Virgin and if all those flights become available as well.
Looked at the KLM website and saw the VS flights are already bookable.
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Old Mar 4, 19, 9:21 am
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There's no mention of the FF benefits and if we would have access to VS ClubHouse.
Also flyingblue website hasn't yet been updated with the details.
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Old Mar 4, 19, 9:30 am
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But there is mention of earning miles. I'm sure the benefits will be there, especially lounge access for business class pax.

https://news.delta.com/virgin-atlant...re-partnership

Subject to final clearance from regulators, the airlines will be founding members of a $13 billion trans-Atlantic partnership for customers between the UK, Europe and North America, offering over 300 daily trans-Atlantic flights, 108 non-stop routes, and over 340 destinations.

The $13 Billion part means that someone, somewhere is already counting the money.
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Old Mar 4, 19, 9:35 am
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Originally Posted by Mirk View Post
There's no mention of the FF benefits and if we would have access to VS ClubHouse.
Also flyingblue website hasn't yet been updated with the details.
Originally Posted by stimpy View Post
But there is mention of earning miles. I'm sure the benefits will be there, especially lounge access for business class pax.

https://news.delta.com/virgin-atlant...re-partnership

Subject to final clearance from regulators, the airlines will be founding members of a $13 billion trans-Atlantic partnership for customers between the UK, Europe and North America, offering over 300 daily trans-Atlantic flights, 108 non-stop routes, and over 340 destinations.

The $13 Billion part means that someone, somewhere is already counting the money.
Good point on the FB website. Not updated yet, but wouldn't make sense to not earn anything on these flights. As for KL, they will be KL coded, so I assume KL earnings apply regarding miles & XP. We'll probably find out about the rest soon enough

And indeed, the business case should be clear to the guys...
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Old Mar 4, 19, 9:49 am
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Virgin Atlantic has interesting 1-1-1 J configuration, except your socks are facing the aisle. Therefore one of the aisles (especially the one where there is a seat facing it from both sides) is a nice sock fest
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Old Mar 4, 19, 10:39 am
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Originally Posted by Mirk View Post
There's no mention of the FF benefits and if we would have access to VS ClubHouse.
Also flyingblue website hasn't yet been updated with the details.
Don't forget - this is just a codesharing arrangement.

All codeshares earn miles, regardless of operator.

The Flying Blue website won't be "updated" on the basis of this arrangement, which is merely codesharing. (e.g. you don't find Etihad, Qantas, etc listed on the Flying Blue partners page, because they are also mere codeshare partners)

(In due time, once the new JV is operational, then Virgin Atlantic should be announced as a new Flying Blue partner. Only at that stage will VS be mentioned on the Flying Blue website as a partner).
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Old Mar 4, 19, 11:01 am
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Originally Posted by irishguy28 View Post
Don't forget - this is just a codesharing arrangement.
Exactly, this is a non-event ahead of the full JV
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Old Mar 4, 19, 11:14 am
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Originally Posted by irishguy28 View Post
Don't forget - this is just a codesharing arrangement.

All codeshares earn miles, regardless of operator.

The Flying Blue website won't be "updated" on the basis of this arrangement, which is merely codesharing. (e.g. you don't find Etihad, Qantas, etc listed on the Flying Blue partners page, because they are also mere codeshare partners)

(In due time, once the new JV is operational, then Virgin Atlantic should be announced as a new Flying Blue partner. Only at that stage will VS be mentioned on the Flying Blue website as a partner).

Good point. Thanks!
Hopefully, the JV announcement isn't too far now.
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Old Mar 4, 19, 2:55 pm
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Originally Posted by irishguy28 View Post
Don't forget - this is just a codesharing arrangement.

All codeshares earn miles, regardless of operator.

The Flying Blue website won't be "updated" on the basis of this arrangement, which is merely codesharing. (e.g. you don't find Etihad, Qantas, etc listed on the Flying Blue partners page, because they are also mere codeshare partners)

(In due time, once the new JV is operational, then Virgin Atlantic should be announced as a new Flying Blue partner. Only at that stage will VS be mentioned on the Flying Blue website as a partner).
Clearly. So a FB member still does not earn miles/XP on a VS-coded flight and a FB Elite+ member has no VS lounge access on a VS-coded flight (unless flying J of course).
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Old Mar 4, 19, 10:40 pm
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Originally Posted by Mirk View Post
Hopefully, the JV announcement isn't too far now.
I would not at all be surprised if IAG engaged in legal delay tactics. Does anyone remember "No Way BA/AA" ? It used to be painted on the sides of all the VS airplanes.
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Old Mar 5, 19, 1:16 am
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Lounge

I'm looking forward to using my Platinum for life card in the Virgin flagship lounge at Heathrow.
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Old Mar 5, 19, 1:24 am
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Originally Posted by stimpy View Post
I would not at all be surprised if IAG engaged in legal delay tactics. Does anyone remember "No Way BA/AA" ? It used to be painted on the sides of all the VS airplanes.
I'm not sure if BA made any submissions regarding the proposed venture, but it has already been approved by the European Commission. All that's holding it up now is clearance in the US.

European Commission - PRESS RELEASES - Press release - Mergers: Commission approves acquisition of joint control over Virgin Atlantic by Air-France-KLM, Delta and Virgin Group
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Old Mar 5, 19, 1:27 am
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Originally Posted by irishguy28 View Post
I'm not sure if BA made any submissions regarding the proposed venture, but it has already been approved by the European Commission. All that's holding it up now is clearance in the US.

European Commission - PRESS RELEASES - Press release - Mergers: Commission approves acquisition of joint control over Virgin Atlantic by Air-France-KLM, Delta and Virgin Group
OK, good. Hopefully AA won't make a fuss.
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Old Mar 5, 19, 2:04 am
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Originally Posted by irishguy28 View Post
I'm not sure if BA made any submissions regarding the proposed venture, but it has already been approved by the European Commission. All that's holding it up now is clearance in the US.

European Commission - PRESS RELEASES - Press release - Mergers: Commission approves acquisition of joint control over Virgin Atlantic by Air-France-KLM, Delta and Virgin Group
I think that this is approval of AFKL taking a 31% stake in Virgin Atlantic, resulting in a joint-control by AFKL, DL and Sir Branson.
It does mention that AFKL, DL and VS intend to combine and expand their existing JV. I don't know if any new JV requires the approval of the EU. But if it does, the current approval text suggests that the EU would have no objections.
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Old Mar 5, 19, 2:32 am
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Originally Posted by brunos View Post
I think that this is approval of AFKL taking a 31% stake in Virgin Atlantic, resulting in a joint-control by AFKL, DL and Sir Branson.
It does mention that AFKL, DL and VS intend to combine and expand their existing JV. I don't know if any new JV requires the approval of the EU. But if it does, the current approval text suggests that the EU would have no objections.
The EC most certainly has to approve any such joint ventures. Afterall, collaborating to fix prices and co-ordinate schedules is the very definition of anti-competitive behaviour - that is why they must seek immunity for these "anti-trust joint ventures" in the first place.

(Here's the announcement of the EC approval for the DL/AF/KL/AZ JV: http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-15-4966_en.htm )

But you raise an interesting point. I had assumed that they hd sought approval for all aspects of the merger and JV - but the press release merely says that:

Originally Posted by [url=http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-19-1054_en.htm]EC
Today's decision approves the acquisition of joint control by Air France-KLM, Delta Air Lines Inc. and Virgin Group over Virgin Atlantic Limited by way of purchase of shares. At the same time, Air France-KLM, Delta and Virgin Group intend to enhance the scope of their existing cooperation in the provision of air transport services for passengers and cargo by combining and expanding two pre-existing “metal neutral” joint venture arrangements between Delta and Air France-KLM, and between Delta and Virgin Atlantic. These are cooperative arrangements in which they jointly plan and manage capacity, pricing, and inter-airline financial settlements, with all participating airlines sharing profits equally.
Which may mean that they have to seek separate approval for the new JV and that this was not already approved at this time.

(The full decision has not yet been published so it is difficult to say - but approval seems all but certain anyway)
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