Upgrade with miles - availbility

Old Feb 14, 18, 10:17 am
  #1  
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Upgrade with miles - availbility

I just wanted to upgrade a flight with AF booked in premium economy (booking class A) to business. The flight is on 20th. of may from BOG to CDG. I saw in expertflyer that booking class O is available. The flyingblue service center told me that there is no availbility for an upgrade. Anybody knows this problem or have a solution?

Last edited by JorgeGomez; Feb 14, 18 at 10:31 am
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Old Feb 14, 18, 10:45 am
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When Expertflyer starts processing Flying Blue ugprades, you can enquire with them about availability and have them process your upgrade based on their availability.

The correct way to check for upgrade availability is to see if the Flying Blue booking tool has a seat available at the Classic Rate for redemption.

If Flying Blue does not see availability, it doesn't matter what anybody else says.
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Old Feb 14, 18, 10:58 am
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Originally Posted by irishguy28 View Post
When Expertflyer starts processing Flying Blue ugprades, you can enquire with them about availability and have them process your upgrade based on their availability.

The correct way to check for upgrade availability is to see if the Flying Blue booking tool has a seat available at the Classic Rate for redemption.

If Flying Blue does not see availability, it doesn't matter what anybody else says.

Of course it is like that. But maybe anyone knows that diference between expertflyer (J9 C9 D9 I9 Z9 O9 W9 S9 A9 Y9 B9 M9
U9 K9 H9 L9 Q9 T9 E0 N9 R0 V0 X0) and Flying Blue? And also if I check in my Flying Blue account I can book an award ticket. So usually there should be a posibility for an upgrade. Unfortunately I cannot check an upgrade, because my Skymiles number is added to the booking.

Last edited by JorgeGomez; Feb 14, 18 at 11:07 am
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Old Feb 14, 18, 11:27 am
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Originally Posted by JorgeGomez View Post
Of course it is like that. But maybe anyone knows that diference between expertflyer (J9 C9 D9 I9 Z9 O9 W9 S9 A9 Y9 B9 M9
U9 K9 H9 L9 Q9 T9 E0 N9 R0 V0 X0) and Flying Blue? And also if I check in my Flying Blue account I can book an award ticket. So usually there should be a posibility for an upgrade. Unfortunately I cannot check an upgrade, because my Skymiles number is added to the booking.
I am unfamiliar with ExpertFlyer, but that presentation looks wrong.

"O" is indeed supposed to be reserved for Award Bookings, so it is strange to see it listed with all the revenue classes [some of which are now bookable via MIles and also via Cash]. It is also strange to see it set to "9", as I doubt KLM would ever dream of allowing 9 business class redemptions on a single flight.

It was my understanding that looking up award availability was different in Experflyer than looking up general (cash) availability; you should only be presented with that limited subset of fareclasses used for Awards, and only in the context of using miles. The result you have printed out above cannot possible relate toa "miles only" query, as you have the full set of (cash) fares. But even that looks wrong.

See for example, this thumbnail fromt he "Airline Award & Upgrade " feature of this page:

https://www.expertflyer.com/frequent-flyer-programs



You shouldn't be getting a full printout of all possible classes when querying Award space.

And, as stated above, the only correct and easily-verified source for this information is Flying Blue. If the Flying Blue tool won't offer a Classic Award at the lowest rate, there is no "O" for you to upgrade into. Checking anywhere else is a waste of time. Trying to determine what the data provided anywhere else means is a waste of time.

ExpertFlyer and other tools may work well with US-based airlines, as the bulk of the paying customers are probably based there, and those airlines are of most interest to ExpertFlyer customers.

Clearly, the results for Flying Blue are not accurate.

In short, this appears to be more a question of Expertflyer rather than KLM/Flying Blue.

EDIT: Remove your Skymiles number from the booking. This can be done via the Kenya Airways website.
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Last edited by irishguy28; Feb 14, 18 at 11:37 am
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Old Feb 14, 18, 3:27 pm
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It is very expensive to upgrade from PE 'A' to business.
I suggest you try to have the class 'S' or 'W' (I have do this before).

Also (by experience), the 'O' class for upgrade is not the same numbers of seat available with Flying Blue.
I have see in the pass 'O9', but no seat avalaible for Flying Blue, but more than 9 for Skymiles...
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Old Feb 14, 18, 3:36 pm
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I just checked Expert Flyer - On BOG-CDG, AF 429, May 20 there is indeed 9 availability of award O.
I've found quite often consistency between the award results and the results on FB.




And in fact it's consistent for normal awards.
Are you sure it's not a problem caused by a married segment? There have been reports ( Upgrade with Miles - Two Segments ) of FB checking your whole flight to final destination and not the single leg for upgrade - thus limiting the availability of O in the case of married segments. In the same day, for example, combining AF429 with AF1630 to CDG-MXP brings O availability to 0.
Are you connecting to any other airport?


t

Last edited by Andy82; Feb 14, 18 at 4:03 pm Reason: Added link.
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Old Feb 14, 18, 4:13 pm
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As mentioned. O9 does appear to be correct.

OP, is the ticket you are trying to upgrade a paid ticket on AF stock, not a codeshare? If so then call back. It should be allowed.
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Old Feb 15, 18, 6:55 am
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Iīm having the same problem, on exactly the same route BOG-CDG, on 12 May. O class is available on AF 429 on the website for Flying Blue redemption, but not for upgrades according to the FB service centre. Iīve already called 3 times, always with the same result. Thereīs also no upgrade option when I look up the booking on the Air France and KLM websites. I can only assume itīs married segment logic at work, since Iīll connect to ZYR by train from CDG - which isntīt upgradeable anyway. Very weird that they would restrict upgrade space on the long-haul flight because of a connecting train trip.
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Old Feb 15, 18, 1:43 pm
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Originally Posted by skimthetrees View Post
As mentioned. O9 does appear to be correct.

OP, is the ticket you are trying to upgrade a paid ticket on AF stock, not a codeshare? If so then call back. It should be allowed.
Yes it is a paid ticket on AF stock.
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Old Feb 15, 18, 2:00 pm
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Originally Posted by Andy82 View Post
I just checked Expert Flyer - On BOG-CDG, AF 429, May 20 there is indeed 9 availability of award O.
I've found quite often consistency between the award results and the results on FB.




And in fact it's consistent for normal awards.
Are you sure it's not a problem caused by a married segment? There have been reports ( Upgrade with Miles - Two Segments ) of FB checking your whole flight to final destination and not the single leg for upgrade - thus limiting the availability of O in the case of married segments. In the same day, for example, combining AF429 with AF1630 to CDG-MXP brings O availability to 0.
Are you connecting to any other airport?


t
Sorry I wrote it wrong. The route is BOG-CDG. It's my return flight. The outbound flight is already upgraded. But I did the same like you. Experflyer shows availbilty O9. It is also possible to book an award ticket. But the FB service center cannot upgrade the flight because the system don't shows availability. I called again and mentioned that it is possible to book an award ticket and that booking class O is available. The agent told me that is right, but in booking class O there are contingents for upgrades and contingens for award tickets. The contingent for award tickets is still available but the contingent for upgrades is sold out. So that should be the problem.
I have a married ticket, right. It is BOG-CDG-DUS. But this should not be a problem, because I could upgrade the outbound flight CDG-BOGand the agent was only looking for upgrade the the long haul flight BOG-CDG she told me.

Last edited by JorgeGomez; Feb 15, 18 at 2:37 pm
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Old Feb 17, 18, 10:12 pm
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Originally Posted by JorgeGomez View Post
Sorry I wrote it wrong. The route is BOG-CDG. It's my return flight. The outbound flight is already upgraded. But I did the same like you. Experflyer shows availbilty O9. It is also possible to book an award ticket. But the FB service center cannot upgrade the flight because the system don't shows availability. I called again and mentioned that it is possible to book an award ticket and that booking class O is available. The agent told me that is right, but in booking class O there are contingents for upgrades and contingens for award tickets. The contingent for award tickets is still available but the contingent for upgrades is sold out. So that should be the problem.
I have a married ticket, right. It is BOG-CDG-DUS. But this should not be a problem, because I could upgrade the outbound flight CDG-BOGand the agent was only looking for upgrade the the long haul flight BOG-CDG she told me.
Ah, this is exactly the problem -- married segments. There is O9 BOG-CDG but there is O0 BOG-DUS via CDG. You will have to get AF to unmarry the segments in order to upgrade BOG-CDG.
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Old Feb 18, 18, 12:55 am
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Is it possible to 'unmarry' segments? I still wonder if married segments are the problem for my itinerary on 12 May, too (BOG-CDG-ZYR)?
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Old Feb 21, 18, 1:20 am
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Originally Posted by europeflyer View Post
Is it possible to 'unmarry' segments? I still wonder if married segments are the problem for my itinerary on 12 May, too (BOG-CDG-ZYR)?
I would think it is possible to divorce the segments but this may require a refare of the ticket. I am making an educated guess. I do not know for sure.

Your problem is not married segments. BOG-CDG on 5/12 is O0.
5/13 BOG-CDG-ZYR has O7 so if you can change to 5/13 it looks like it could work.
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Old Feb 21, 18, 1:31 am
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From my experience EF is indeed pretty accurate and reflects in real time the availability when it comes to AF.
When I see availability on EF and FB tells me there is no award available online I usually call them ; if it does not work the HUACA rule applies.
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Old Feb 21, 18, 9:47 am
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Originally Posted by skimthetrees View Post
Your problem is not married segments. BOG-CDG on 5/12 is O0.
5/13 BOG-CDG-ZYR has O7 so if you can change to 5/13 it looks like it could work.
Thanks! I may try that.

But why would the AF website allow me to book a 'Classic Award' in Business for BOG-CDG on 12 May if it is O0? I thought these awards also book into O?

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