Last edit by: irishguy28
Introduction
As you have been following the past thread, the Flying Blue programme will change as of 1 April 2018. In order to split the discussion from the earlier thread, we have created a new thread.
On 6 November Flying Blue has organised a press conference to inform the public about the changes to the programme. In addition, a mailing will be sent out to all members on the 6th and 7th of November and more information can be found on the designated website (link: https://explorefurther.flyingblue.com).
As an introduction, please find a summary of the changes below.
Please note that at the current time there is no difference expected to the benefits of the current tier.
Change 1: no more level miles, no more segments, but Experience Points
As of 1 April 2018 you will no longer earn level miles and segments per flight, but you will earn Experience Points (XP). The number of XP earned per flight depends on your cabin (multiplier times 2 for Premium Economy, 3 for business, 5 for La Premiere) and the type of flight (distinction between domestic, medium haul, long-haul 1/2/3).
For flights between 1 January 31 March 2018 all earned level miles and segments will be converted into XP (1 segment = 7 XP; 1,000 level miles = 5 XP for members outside France). Please note that the highest conversion applies (it is not cumulative).
The number of XP required per tiers is:
- 100 for Silver;
- 180 for Gold;
- 300 for Platinum;
- 1,800 for Platinum Ultimate (in 2 years).
Please note that for current flyers who qualify on segments based on only intra-EU flights this could see an increase in the number of flights required. However, if you fly a mix if intra-EU and intercontinental (but qualify on segments), this will most likely see a reduction in the number of flights required to qualify.
For elite members, there is a roll-over of all XP above your tier threshold.
The rules for soft-landing have been extended. It is now no longer required to make at least 1 qualifying flight and in case you do not meet your threshold you will only drop one tier.
Change 2: number of miles earned dependent on fare paid (including fuel surcharge)
The number of award miles (for AF/KL/A5) earned is now depending on the fare paid (including fuel surcharge). Ivory members earn 4 miles per Euro, Silver 6, Gold 7 and Platinum 8.
Also earn award miles on AF/KL purchases (relating to seats, baggage and meals) according to the above schedule.
Earnings on partners remains as-is (based on fare class and distance flown).
Change 3: dynamic pricing of award tickets (on AF/KL/HV)
Another change will be that award tickets will have dynamic pricing, e.g. an award AMS-JFK could be more expensive than an award DUS-AMS-JFK. This is also in line with change 2, as flights from AMS are also more expensive than flights from DUS (you also earn more miles).
This also implies that we will see a difference in the number of miles required per flight. For example, an award from continental Europe to continental USA will currently set you back 25,000 miles for a one-way in economy. It does not matter if you fly to LAX or NYC, the number of miles is currently fixed. Under the new proposition, this will change. The cheaper flight (in this example: NYC) will see a slight reduction in the number of miles required, whilst LAX will see a slight increase in the number of miles required.
Furthermore, there will be a standard base level for the number of miles required per destination. As the standard revenue price increases, so does the number of award miles.
Change 4: status valid for 12 months (+ 3 months), personal membership year
FB will be moving away from membership year = calendar year (in case of upgrade of tier). Instead, FB will have an individual membership year. This means that after obtaining the higher tier, you will have 12 months to requalify. Benefit of this is that members are not bound by the calendar year (e.g. members who earn 20,000 level miles in a December of a given year and 20,000 level miles in January of the next year, do not have any benefit of their flights in case limited flights before/after).
I know some will feel that this is a significant downgrade compared to the current at maximum 27 months. Please note that based on FB information the majority of members (re)qualify in the last quarter of the year.
In addition, please note that for an Ivory member would like to go obtain Platinum in one year, as it will become more difficult, as (s)he will have to earn each threshold (so not 300 XP in the first year, but (100 + 180 + 300 = 580 XP).This is only applicable in the first year.
Change 5: changes to the co-branded American Express credit cards (FR/NL)
Currently you earn segments and level miles (on AF/KL purchases for Gold and Platinum card holders). This will change that you will receive additional XP when reaching your membership anniversary each year.
As you have been following the past thread, the Flying Blue programme will change as of 1 April 2018. In order to split the discussion from the earlier thread, we have created a new thread.
On 6 November Flying Blue has organised a press conference to inform the public about the changes to the programme. In addition, a mailing will be sent out to all members on the 6th and 7th of November and more information can be found on the designated website (link: https://explorefurther.flyingblue.com).
As an introduction, please find a summary of the changes below.
Please note that at the current time there is no difference expected to the benefits of the current tier.
Change 1: no more level miles, no more segments, but Experience Points
As of 1 April 2018 you will no longer earn level miles and segments per flight, but you will earn Experience Points (XP). The number of XP earned per flight depends on your cabin (multiplier times 2 for Premium Economy, 3 for business, 5 for La Premiere) and the type of flight (distinction between domestic, medium haul, long-haul 1/2/3).
For flights between 1 January 31 March 2018 all earned level miles and segments will be converted into XP (1 segment = 7 XP; 1,000 level miles = 5 XP for members outside France). Please note that the highest conversion applies (it is not cumulative).
The number of XP required per tiers is:
- 100 for Silver;
- 180 for Gold;
- 300 for Platinum;
- 1,800 for Platinum Ultimate (in 2 years).
Please note that for current flyers who qualify on segments based on only intra-EU flights this could see an increase in the number of flights required. However, if you fly a mix if intra-EU and intercontinental (but qualify on segments), this will most likely see a reduction in the number of flights required to qualify.
For elite members, there is a roll-over of all XP above your tier threshold.
The rules for soft-landing have been extended. It is now no longer required to make at least 1 qualifying flight and in case you do not meet your threshold you will only drop one tier.
Change 2: number of miles earned dependent on fare paid (including fuel surcharge)
The number of award miles (for AF/KL/A5) earned is now depending on the fare paid (including fuel surcharge). Ivory members earn 4 miles per Euro, Silver 6, Gold 7 and Platinum 8.
Also earn award miles on AF/KL purchases (relating to seats, baggage and meals) according to the above schedule.
Earnings on partners remains as-is (based on fare class and distance flown).
Change 3: dynamic pricing of award tickets (on AF/KL/HV)
Another change will be that award tickets will have dynamic pricing, e.g. an award AMS-JFK could be more expensive than an award DUS-AMS-JFK. This is also in line with change 2, as flights from AMS are also more expensive than flights from DUS (you also earn more miles).
This also implies that we will see a difference in the number of miles required per flight. For example, an award from continental Europe to continental USA will currently set you back 25,000 miles for a one-way in economy. It does not matter if you fly to LAX or NYC, the number of miles is currently fixed. Under the new proposition, this will change. The cheaper flight (in this example: NYC) will see a slight reduction in the number of miles required, whilst LAX will see a slight increase in the number of miles required.
Furthermore, there will be a standard base level for the number of miles required per destination. As the standard revenue price increases, so does the number of award miles.
Change 4: status valid for 12 months (+ 3 months), personal membership year
FB will be moving away from membership year = calendar year (in case of upgrade of tier). Instead, FB will have an individual membership year. This means that after obtaining the higher tier, you will have 12 months to requalify. Benefit of this is that members are not bound by the calendar year (e.g. members who earn 20,000 level miles in a December of a given year and 20,000 level miles in January of the next year, do not have any benefit of their flights in case limited flights before/after).
I know some will feel that this is a significant downgrade compared to the current at maximum 27 months. Please note that based on FB information the majority of members (re)qualify in the last quarter of the year.
In addition, please note that for an Ivory member would like to go obtain Platinum in one year, as it will become more difficult, as (s)he will have to earn each threshold (so not 300 XP in the first year, but (100 + 180 + 300 = 580 XP).
Change 5: changes to the co-branded American Express credit cards (FR/NL)
Currently you earn segments and level miles (on AF/KL purchases for Gold and Platinum card holders). This will change that you will receive additional XP when reaching your membership anniversary each year.
Upcoming changes to Flying Blue in 2018
#1546
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,794
Apologies, I made a mistake in the program: this would not be the Delta "Miles + Cash" Program (which allows to reduce the payment in miles on award tickets), but the Delta "Pay with Miles" Program, which is only available to cardholders of the American Express Delta credit cards (Gold, Platinum, Reserve etc...) to pay a revenue tickets with miles, by tranches of 5,000 SkyMiles (you need to have a minimum balance of 5,000 DL miles in order to pay with your miles).
Details are on this link:
https://www.delta.com/content/www/en...ith-miles.html
And apparently, according The Points Guy, tickets paid under the program Pay with Miles are still considered as revenue tickets, which would seem to make my strategy work (and earn XP):
https://thepointsguy.com/2015/04/is-...deal-or-a-dud/
https://thepointsguy.com/2014/12/del...miles-in-2015/
Cheers,
-vinnyc
Details are on this link:
https://www.delta.com/content/www/en...ith-miles.html
And apparently, according The Points Guy, tickets paid under the program Pay with Miles are still considered as revenue tickets, which would seem to make my strategy work (and earn XP):
https://thepointsguy.com/2015/04/is-...deal-or-a-dud/
https://thepointsguy.com/2014/12/del...miles-in-2015/
Cheers,
-vinnyc
#1547
Join Date: Apr 2017
Programs: Flying blue LTP Ultimate, SPG platinum, Hertz Platinum, Sixt Platinum
Posts: 190
Today I tried to book a long haul flight with miles for 3 passengers in J. Nothing available on the website with miles but availability with €.
I called TA who told me only some classes of booking are available with miles.
From the communication about the Flying Blue changes in April I understood that every available seat is available for purchase with miles. Did I get this wrong?
Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
I called TA who told me only some classes of booking are available with miles.
From the communication about the Flying Blue changes in April I understood that every available seat is available for purchase with miles. Did I get this wrong?
Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
#1548
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,550
#1549
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,794
As rightly pointed by Irishguy28, the dynamic pricing scheme for awards is applicable for bookings from June. Until that, the old scheme applies, meaning that you need award inventory to be able to book award tickets.
#1550
formerly mattking2000
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: DXB
Programs: BA|AC|AZ|SPG|H|FPC
Posts: 1,175
This may seem like a dumb question, but I can't seem to find the answer on AF/KL Flying Blue website or the FAQ thread, so here goes!
I'm investigating this program as Skyteam seems to be the preferred option for my upcoming new job, but I won't be flying in Europe much -- does FB have a minimum AF/KL/HV/KQ sector requirement (kind of like BA does with its 4 sectors)? Can you qualify based solely on XP from partners (DL, CZ, KE)?
I'm investigating this program as Skyteam seems to be the preferred option for my upcoming new job, but I won't be flying in Europe much -- does FB have a minimum AF/KL/HV/KQ sector requirement (kind of like BA does with its 4 sectors)? Can you qualify based solely on XP from partners (DL, CZ, KE)?
#1553
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hong Kong, France
Programs: FB , BA Gold
Posts: 15,495
This may seem like a dumb question, but I can't seem to find the answer on AF/KL Flying Blue website or the FAQ thread, so here goes!
I'm investigating this program as Skyteam seems to be the preferred option for my upcoming new job, but I won't be flying in Europe much -- does FB have a minimum AF/KL/HV/KQ sector requirement (kind of like BA does with its 4 sectors)? Can you qualify based solely on XP from partners (DL, CZ, KE)?
I'm investigating this program as Skyteam seems to be the preferred option for my upcoming new job, but I won't be flying in Europe much -- does FB have a minimum AF/KL/HV/KQ sector requirement (kind of like BA does with its 4 sectors)? Can you qualify based solely on XP from partners (DL, CZ, KE)?
Not sure why FB would be your preferred option is you are to be based in DXB and don't expect to do 4 segments on AFKL.
If you care about status, and apparently you do as you talk about XP, note that domestic flights bring very few XPs. That applies to DL flights within the US (including to Hawaii) or flights within China (including Hong Kong).
As mentioned by Fabo.sk you also need to reach silver (no real benefits) before you can attack gold as your XPs will be reset to zero when you reach silver.
#1554
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Cologne
Programs: FB Plat, IHG RA Spire, TK Elite+, HH Diamond, LH SEN, Marriott Titanium
Posts: 972
Just finished this trip last week and tried to claim the missing miles as they hadn't appear on my account. I was unable to use the online form so I contacted AF on twitter and they said the following:
"Thank you very much for contacting us. We have carefully checked your reservation and are sorry to inform you that your flights with Jet Airways are not eligible for the Miles accrual, as they were operated by KLM. The flights marketed as Jet Airways and operated by other Airlines are not eligible for the Miles accrual. We kindly invite you to learn more about the conditions of earning Miles with Jet Airways on the following page: https://flyingblue.com/en/partners/airline/airline-jet-airways/presentation?promotions=false&spend=false& earn=false …. We remain at your disposal for any further query and wish you a lovely day."
Welp...
Edit: Guess this is karma...more importantly, anyone got any advice where I should stash these miles? I don't believe I can put them with VS. Can I put them with Delta? or would the best option just be with Jet?
Last edited by Lewis42; May 14, 2018 at 5:39 am Reason: added section asking for advice
#1556
formerly mattking2000
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: DXB
Programs: BA|AC|AZ|SPG|H|FPC
Posts: 1,175
Thanks! This program is definitely looking good
Here's my take, based on 2x DXB-PRG, 4x DXB-URC, 1x DXB-DMM/JED/RUH each per year:
- OK program: 39.5k miles, 50k required for gold
- CZ program: 63k km, 80k km required for gold
- DL program: too confusing (heh), + I don't get to enjoy the benefits of intra-US travel upgrades as that's not going to be part of the job. If it were to happen I'd probably credit that to BA TPs.
- FB: 318 XP, 280 XP req for gold
Not to mention, there's a plethora of resources on here to maximize usage of accrued FB points as well as a great resource to get advance information of upcoming changes. The same can`t be said of OK/CZ!
The accrued points + status can also be put towards a nice leisure trip on AF in F every so often
For me and my upcoming travel patterns, it seems to make sense. Would be happy to be proven wrong!
You don't need any segment and AFKL.
Not sure why FB would be your preferred option is you are to be based in DXB and don't expect to do 4 segments on AFKL.
If you care about status, and apparently you do as you talk about XP, note that domestic flights bring very few XPs. That applies to DL flights within the US (including to Hawaii) or flights within China (including Hong Kong).
As mentioned by Fabo.sk you also need to reach silver (no real benefits) before you can attack gold as your XPs will be reset to zero when you reach silver.
Not sure why FB would be your preferred option is you are to be based in DXB and don't expect to do 4 segments on AFKL.
If you care about status, and apparently you do as you talk about XP, note that domestic flights bring very few XPs. That applies to DL flights within the US (including to Hawaii) or flights within China (including Hong Kong).
As mentioned by Fabo.sk you also need to reach silver (no real benefits) before you can attack gold as your XPs will be reset to zero when you reach silver.
- OK program: 39.5k miles, 50k required for gold
- CZ program: 63k km, 80k km required for gold
- DL program: too confusing (heh), + I don't get to enjoy the benefits of intra-US travel upgrades as that's not going to be part of the job. If it were to happen I'd probably credit that to BA TPs.
- FB: 318 XP, 280 XP req for gold
Not to mention, there's a plethora of resources on here to maximize usage of accrued FB points as well as a great resource to get advance information of upcoming changes. The same can`t be said of OK/CZ!
The accrued points + status can also be put towards a nice leisure trip on AF in F every so often
For me and my upcoming travel patterns, it seems to make sense. Would be happy to be proven wrong!
#1557
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: PEK, AUS, WAS, HKG
Programs: CX Gold
Posts: 1,117
Thanks! This program is definitely looking good
Here's my take, based on 2x DXB-PRG, 4x DXB-URC, 1x DXB-DMM/JED/RUH each per year:
- OK program: 39.5k miles, 50k required for gold
- CZ program: 63k km, 80k km required for gold
- DL program: too confusing (heh), + I don't get to enjoy the benefits of intra-US travel upgrades as that's not going to be part of the job. If it were to happen I'd probably credit that to BA TPs.
- FB: 318 XP, 280 XP req for gold
Not to mention, there's a plethora of resources on here to maximize usage of accrued FB points as well as a great resource to get advance information of upcoming changes. The same can`t be said of OK/CZ!
The accrued points + status can also be put towards a nice leisure trip on AF in F every so often
For me and my upcoming travel patterns, it seems to make sense. Would be happy to be proven wrong!
Here's my take, based on 2x DXB-PRG, 4x DXB-URC, 1x DXB-DMM/JED/RUH each per year:
- OK program: 39.5k miles, 50k required for gold
- CZ program: 63k km, 80k km required for gold
- DL program: too confusing (heh), + I don't get to enjoy the benefits of intra-US travel upgrades as that's not going to be part of the job. If it were to happen I'd probably credit that to BA TPs.
- FB: 318 XP, 280 XP req for gold
Not to mention, there's a plethora of resources on here to maximize usage of accrued FB points as well as a great resource to get advance information of upcoming changes. The same can`t be said of OK/CZ!
The accrued points + status can also be put towards a nice leisure trip on AF in F every so often
For me and my upcoming travel patterns, it seems to make sense. Would be happy to be proven wrong!
2x DXB-PRG roundtrip (RT) = 2 * 2 * 8XP = 32 XP
4x DXB-URC RT = 4 * 2 * 8XP = 64 XP
1x DXB-DMM/JED/RUH RT = 2 * 2 * 5XP * 3 = 60 XP (*3 because I assume this means three separate trips).
So you have just 156 XP. How did you get 318 XP?
#1558
formerly mattking2000
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: DXB
Programs: BA|AC|AZ|SPG|H|FPC
Posts: 1,175
Are you sure your calculations of XP are correct? Assuming all Economy class flights:
2x DXB-PRG roundtrip (RT) = 2 * 2 * 8XP = 32 XP
4x DXB-URC RT = 4 * 2 * 8XP = 64 XP
1x DXB-DMM/JED/RUH RT = 2 * 2 * 5XP * 3 = 60 XP (*3 because I assume this means three separate trips).
So you have just 156 XP. How did you get 318 XP?
2x DXB-PRG roundtrip (RT) = 2 * 2 * 8XP = 32 XP
4x DXB-URC RT = 4 * 2 * 8XP = 64 XP
1x DXB-DMM/JED/RUH RT = 2 * 2 * 5XP * 3 = 60 XP (*3 because I assume this means three separate trips).
So you have just 156 XP. How did you get 318 XP?
#1559
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: United Kingdom
Programs: Bonvoy LTTitanium, BAEC Silver
Posts: 590
Hey guys, currently platinum but will drop to gold based on the new rules as I won't hit 300 XP. Next year I'll most likely lose gold as I won't hit 180 XP next year. Given the new +3 months rule, would it be within my interests to delay hitting gold in order to prolong my soon to be gold status? I'm currently on 173 XP and if I hit 183 in July 2018 does that mean my Gold will expire in October 2019?
#1560
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: MAN
Programs: FB Platinum
Posts: 500
Hey guys, currently platinum but will drop to gold based on the new rules as I won't hit 300 XP. Next year I'll most likely lose gold as I won't hit 180 XP next year. Given the new +3 months rule, would it be within my interests to delay hitting gold in order to prolong my soon to be gold status? I'm currently on 173 XP and if I hit 183 in July 2018 does that mean my Gold will expire in October 2019?