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New policy for paid and miles upgrades (AF/KL) - sept 2017

New policy for paid and miles upgrades (AF/KL) - sept 2017

Old May 5, 21, 8:53 am
  #1231  
 
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Originally Posted by Klems View Post
"NDPU"
What does NDPU mean? No discounted premium upgrades? And what are the reasons for getting this?
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Old May 5, 21, 10:03 am
  #1232  
 
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Booked it
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Old May 5, 21, 10:04 am
  #1233  
 
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Originally Posted by Goldorak View Post
this seems a very good offer to me. Take it. I doubt you’ll have something better later.
Done! Thank you for the advice! Feels like a good use of those miles even though I know folks say it's generally better to just book into J directly.
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Old May 5, 21, 12:57 pm
  #1234  
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Originally Posted by Klems View Post
I don't fly as often as you do but it's the same for me, it's been 2-3 years since I got a good upgrade offer. But I'm pretty sure I have the dreaded "NDPU" mention on my profile, so I wonder if that has an impact on the OLCI upgrades.
yes, it is supposed to have an impact. I am sure I have this mention as well
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Old May 5, 21, 1:43 pm
  #1235  
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Originally Posted by Fates View Post
Done! Thank you for the advice! Feels like a good use of those miles even though I know folks say it's generally better to just book into J directly.
It is a good use of those miles. I flew CDG-MIA in Premium Economy in early March; my tix were around 1200 euros roundtrip, and at OLCI they offered me and upgrade to J for 299 euros or 41000 miles (which I declined for various reasons, including it being an empty day flight). My return trip MIA-CDG was in early April, and I wasn't offered anything (flight was empty, too)! You just never know.
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Old May 6, 21, 4:58 am
  #1236  
 
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Originally Posted by David7 View Post
What does NDPU mean? No discounted premium upgrades? And what are the reasons for getting this?
the revenue management wants to make sure that people keep booking business class tickets instead of economy tickets with cheap upgrades. maybe they also want to lure people into business class with cheap upgrade prices so they book business class from the start in the future.
they probably check your ticket history and I'd guess the more premium tickets you bought in recent history will increase the chance of the "NDPU" marker because they want the business class paying customers to keep buying premium tickets.
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Old May 6, 21, 7:31 am
  #1237  
 
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Originally Posted by David7 View Post
What does NDPU mean? No discounted premium upgrades? And what are the reasons for getting this?
You can see more details in this thread. But yes, that's supposedly what it means. I'm pretty sure I have it because back in January, I tried to get a discounted upgrade from J to P at the airport and the check in agent told me that I had a note on my file saying I couldn't get it (spoiler alert, I still got it, after a lot of negotiation and a very willing check in agent).

I used to take advantage of those discounted upgrades from Y to J, but exactly like what f0zzyNUE said, my travel patterns changed maybe 5 years ago or so: I started booking J tickets outright more often (prices between US East Coast and Europe in J started dropping significantly a few years ago, now it's pretty standard to find $~2k roundtrip, that used to be unthinkable). So I think that because I may now be categorized as a more premium flyer, they don't see a reason why they would extend discounted prices to me anymore, even when I book Y.
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Old May 6, 21, 1:03 pm
  #1238  
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Originally Posted by Klems View Post
You can see more details in this thread. But yes, that's supposedly what it means. I'm pretty sure I have it because back in January, I tried to get a discounted upgrade from J to P at the airport and the check in agent told me that I had a note on my file saying I couldn't get it (spoiler alert, I still got it, after a lot of negotiation and a very willing check in agent).

I used to take advantage of those discounted upgrades from Y to J, but exactly like what f0zzyNUE said, my travel patterns changed maybe 5 years ago or so: I started booking J tickets outright more often (prices between US East Coast and Europe in J started dropping significantly a few years ago, now it's pretty standard to find $~2k roundtrip, that used to be unthinkable). So I think that because I may now be categorized as a more premium flyer, they don't see a reason why they would extend discounted prices to me anymore, even when I book Y.
I think it’s hard to draw conclusions here, like for trying to decrypt the famous AF algorithm for operational upgrades. I am Ultimate, so by definition, I am a premium class flyer long-haul. For paid upgrades on long- or medium-haul flights, over the last years before I was Ulti or since I am Ulti, I had sometimes some interesting offers and some non-interesting ones. I benefited from the interesting ones from time to time. Since the beginning of the pandemic, all my business travels stopped and all my flights were personal trips and all but one were domestic and EU trips for obvious reasons. For those trips since May 2020, it happened that I booked 2 or 3 trips in J upfront because prices were good (sometimes cheaper than Y), but for all the other ones in Y, the upgrade offers were all in the 300€ range. So, should I believe that because I booked 3 or 4 trips in J out of something like 20 in one year, I have this suspected insane NDPU mention in my profile? I have the feeling that it is more complicated than this. Could be wrong of course.
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Old May 7, 21, 4:14 am
  #1239  
 
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Originally Posted by Goldorak View Post
I think it’s hard to draw conclusions here, like for trying to decrypt the famous AF algorithm for operational upgrades. I am Ultimate, so by definition, I am a premium class flyer long-haul. For paid upgrades on long- or medium-haul flights, over the last years before I was Ulti or since I am Ulti, I had sometimes some interesting offers and some non-interesting ones. I benefited from the interesting ones from time to time. Since the beginning of the pandemic, all my business travels stopped and all my flights were personal trips and all but one were domestic and EU trips for obvious reasons. For those trips since May 2020, it happened that I booked 2 or 3 trips in J upfront because prices were good (sometimes cheaper than Y), but for all the other ones in Y, the upgrade offers were all in the 300€ range. So, should I believe that because I booked 3 or 4 trips in J out of something like 20 in one year, I have this suspected insane NDPU mention in my profile? I have the feeling that it is more complicated than this. Could be wrong of course.
yep. it might be a lot more complicated with additional criteria like
* do the previous trips look like business trips (e.g. return flight before the weekend)
* how often has an offered upgrade already been taken in the last months
* how frequently do you travel
* do you travel alone or with companions
* do you book flexible or discount type fares
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Old May 7, 21, 9:07 am
  #1240  
 
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BCN-AMS
AMS-VIE

both flights on E175 and upgrades for more than 150e each flight.
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Old May 9, 21, 7:36 am
  #1241  
 
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CDG-MEX with AF, from economy (N) to business, at OLCI: ca. 1400 EUR or 62700 miles. Took the miles offer. The economy cabin was half-full, only 6 passengers in the business cabin.
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Old May 9, 21, 7:19 pm
  #1242  
 
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Originally Posted by Goldorak View Post
I have the feeling that it is more complicated than this. Could be wrong of course.
Oh you are most likely not wrong . Just trying to find some logic in the madness, so thanks for your data points! We need someone to apply for a job as an Air France software engineer to take a peak at the code .
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Old May 18, 21, 8:32 am
  #1243  
 
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Was offered at OLCI a few days ago the following :

IAD - CDG from Y to J : 1 279 € or 77 k miles
CDG - FRA : 279 € or 40 k miles

No thanks. Especially as the forward section of Y was pretty empty (had centre row of 4 to myself to lie down.....)
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Old May 20, 21, 7:03 am
  #1244  
 
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Originally Posted by Klems View Post
Oh you are most likely not wrong . Just trying to find some logic in the madness, so thanks for your data points! We need someone to apply for a job as an Air France software engineer to take a peak at the code .
Yes. Somebody with a strong AS programming background (AS = artificial stupidity).
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Old May 21, 21, 2:53 am
  #1245  
 
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SDQ-CDG on the cheapest possible ticket in Y

Y to Y+ 490 EUR (empty cabin)
Y to J 1256 EUR (one empty seat, it is 2 rows of 2-3-2)
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