May 9, 2019, 3:08 pm
Last edit by: Goldorak
FLYING BLUE ULTIMATE
Main facts
Ultimate is the top status in FB. It may be added to Club 2000 – Skipper status.
While other FB status (Silver/Gold/Platinum) are based on experience points earning (XP), Ultimate status is obtained by Ultimate XP (UXP) earning. UXPs are earned exclusively on AF- and KL-coded (= marketed) flights, whatever the operating airline.
Some examples :
- CDG-JFK AF-marketing, AF-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- CDG-JFK DL-marketing, AF-operating : NON-eligible to UXP earning
- AMS-BOS KL-marketing, DL-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- BOS-IND KL-marketing, DL-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- SIN-SYD AF-marketing, QF-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- CDG-FCO AZ-marketing, AZ-operating : NON-eligible to UXP earning
XP earned via AFKL Amex cards are not eligible (those are XP and not UXP).
To qualify for Ultimate, it is needed to have 900 UXP over a year. It is similar to the normal XP counter, resetting as soon as the tier is reached. Ultimate is valid for 1 year once granted. Note 03/2023 : the qualification system just changed from 1800 UXP over 2 years to 900 UXP/1 year. Some transitional measures are in place for the current Ultimate members. See here for details about handling of transition period :
https://www.flyingblue.com/fr/landin...m_content=main
Since 03/2023, a rollover of surplus UXP (over 900) is now possible to the next year and only to the next year (example : year 1, the member earns 2000UXP. At the end of year 1, only 900 UXP will be rolled-over to year 2 and the remaining 1100 UXP earned in Y1 will be lost and not be transferred to year 3. If during year 2, the member earned 1000 new (fresh) UXP, 100 will be rolled-over to year 3.
Hard benefits
- All FB Platinum/Club 2000-Skipper benefits
- Access to a Travel Assistant service 24/7. They are reachable by phone or by email. In practice, from 8 pm to 8 am CET, calls are taken by the Platinum line.
- highest priority on waiting list and in case of irrops
- Possibility to register up to 8 persons who can benefit from Sky Priority services and lounge access when traveling with the Ultimate member and on same PNR (lounge access is only in AFKL lounges here).
- one companion Platinum card
- when the Ultimate member is flying P, 2 guests are allowed in CDG P lounge.
- Zone 1 boarding, irrespective of travel class.
- Access to Hertz Platinum status
- four one-class upgrade certificates per membership year, requiring 1 from W to J, or 2 from Y to J. Upgrades are confirmed instantly at the time of booking (via the Travel Assistant). One voucher = one way. Vouchers can also be used by one of the 8 registered friend/family members travelling by themselves. In case of a long-haul flight with a medium-haul connection/feeder (e.g. CDG-AMS-JFK), the medium-haul segment will be upgraded also with still only one voucher used. In case of 2 long-haul flights in connection (e,g. DXB-CDG-JFK), the use of 2 vouchers is required to upgrade the 2 segments. Upgrade vouchers are usable only on AF- or KL-marketing and operating flights and the PNR must contains only the AFKL flights to be upgraded (if the PNR contains other non-AFKL flights, you cannot upgrade even just the AFKL flights).
The upgrade coupons are valid as soon as you reach Ultimate and is valid for 12 months. The vouchers need to be used within the membership year, but can be applied for travel post expiry date.
Rules for eligible booking classes for the upgrade vouchers are described below :
AF flights, long-haul
Premium Eco to Business
Original booking class : A, S, W
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C (it means that if the flight has only J fare available, one cannot upgrade)
Eco to Business (all flights, except to/from USA, Canada, Mexico)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N, R
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C (it means that if the flight has only J fare available, one cannot upgrade)
Eco to Business (flights to/from USA, Canada, Mexico, including LAX-PPT)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N
Upgraded booking class : Z, C
KL flights, long-haul
Eco to Business (all flights, except to/from USA, Canada, Mexico and DEL)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N, R
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C
Eco to Business (flights to/from USA, Canada, Mexico and DEL)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N
Upgraded booking class : Z, I.
Airline-specific soft (unpublished) benefits
- AF, KL and contract staff at airports have a popup message on their computer screen when checking-in an Ultimate pax or when scanning a BP at the lounge (AFKL lounges only) asking them to be attentive at any special request of the Ultimate pax. See also below for airport-specific soft benefits. There is no known official policy for operational upgrades of Ultimates, but Ultimate members have all reported on FT a higher rate of op-up (but those remain rare !).
- AF and KL cabin crews are instructed to provide extra care and attentions on-board. It can take different forms : special greetings, extra amenities (pillow, oshibori, etc), F&B from the upper class, upgrades on board (Y to J medium haul, W to J or Y to W long haul), earlier and quicker meal service. This is not systematic and is up to the appreciation of the crew. Based on the reports of Ultimate members of this forum, AF crews seems to be more compliant than KL crews with those directives, although there has been several reports in this thread of nice attentions provided by KL crews.- Unlimited downloads (any day) in AF PLAY app.
Other Skyteam airlines do not provide any extra service or attentions to FB Ultimate passengers.
Airport-specific soft (unpublished) benefits
All benefits below should be understood for departure, unless otherwise noted. In addition to what is mentioned below, it has been reported several cases of expedited transfers organised by AFKL staff in case of short/endangered connection at various airports.
Please complete/edit this list as needed.
AFKL HUBS
Amsterdam
- AMS : some reserved tables in the Non-Schengen lounges. Reserved area in the Schengen lounge (need to ask staff at long entrance). Pre-boarding sometimes granted at the gate.
Paris CDG
Paris ORY
EUROPE
Austria
- VIE: no special treatment to report
Croatia
- DBV: no special treatment to report
- SPU: no special treatment to report (not even lounge access)
Czech Republic
- PRG: no special treatment to report. Pre-boarding refused.
Denmark
- CPH: no special treatment to report
France (non-hubs)
- AJA: no special treatment to reportMain facts
Ultimate is the top status in FB. It may be added to Club 2000 – Skipper status.
While other FB status (Silver/Gold/Platinum) are based on experience points earning (XP), Ultimate status is obtained by Ultimate XP (UXP) earning. UXPs are earned exclusively on AF- and KL-coded (= marketed) flights, whatever the operating airline.
Some examples :
- CDG-JFK AF-marketing, AF-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- CDG-JFK DL-marketing, AF-operating : NON-eligible to UXP earning
- AMS-BOS KL-marketing, DL-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- BOS-IND KL-marketing, DL-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- SIN-SYD AF-marketing, QF-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- CDG-FCO AZ-marketing, AZ-operating : NON-eligible to UXP earning
XP earned via AFKL Amex cards are not eligible (those are XP and not UXP).
To qualify for Ultimate, it is needed to have 900 UXP over a year. It is similar to the normal XP counter, resetting as soon as the tier is reached. Ultimate is valid for 1 year once granted. Note 03/2023 : the qualification system just changed from 1800 UXP over 2 years to 900 UXP/1 year. Some transitional measures are in place for the current Ultimate members. See here for details about handling of transition period :
https://www.flyingblue.com/fr/landin...m_content=main
Since 03/2023, a rollover of surplus UXP (over 900) is now possible to the next year and only to the next year (example : year 1, the member earns 2000UXP. At the end of year 1, only 900 UXP will be rolled-over to year 2 and the remaining 1100 UXP earned in Y1 will be lost and not be transferred to year 3. If during year 2, the member earned 1000 new (fresh) UXP, 100 will be rolled-over to year 3.
Hard benefits
- All FB Platinum/Club 2000-Skipper benefits
- Access to a Travel Assistant service 24/7. They are reachable by phone or by email. In practice, from 8 pm to 8 am CET, calls are taken by the Platinum line.
- highest priority on waiting list and in case of irrops
- Possibility to register up to 8 persons who can benefit from Sky Priority services and lounge access when traveling with the Ultimate member and on same PNR (lounge access is only in AFKL lounges here).
- one companion Platinum card
- when the Ultimate member is flying P, 2 guests are allowed in CDG P lounge.
- Zone 1 boarding, irrespective of travel class.
- Access to Hertz Platinum status
- four one-class upgrade certificates per membership year, requiring 1 from W to J, or 2 from Y to J. Upgrades are confirmed instantly at the time of booking (via the Travel Assistant). One voucher = one way. Vouchers can also be used by one of the 8 registered friend/family members travelling by themselves. In case of a long-haul flight with a medium-haul connection/feeder (e.g. CDG-AMS-JFK), the medium-haul segment will be upgraded also with still only one voucher used. In case of 2 long-haul flights in connection (e,g. DXB-CDG-JFK), the use of 2 vouchers is required to upgrade the 2 segments. Upgrade vouchers are usable only on AF- or KL-marketing and operating flights and the PNR must contains only the AFKL flights to be upgraded (if the PNR contains other non-AFKL flights, you cannot upgrade even just the AFKL flights).
The upgrade coupons are valid as soon as you reach Ultimate and is valid for 12 months. The vouchers need to be used within the membership year, but can be applied for travel post expiry date.
Rules for eligible booking classes for the upgrade vouchers are described below :
AF flights, long-haul
Premium Eco to Business
Original booking class : A, S, W
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C (it means that if the flight has only J fare available, one cannot upgrade)
Eco to Business (all flights, except to/from USA, Canada, Mexico)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N, R
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C (it means that if the flight has only J fare available, one cannot upgrade)
Eco to Business (flights to/from USA, Canada, Mexico, including LAX-PPT)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N
Upgraded booking class : Z, C
KL flights, long-haul
Eco to Business (all flights, except to/from USA, Canada, Mexico and DEL)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N, R
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C
Eco to Business (flights to/from USA, Canada, Mexico and DEL)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N
Upgraded booking class : Z, I.
Airline-specific soft (unpublished) benefits
- AF, KL and contract staff at airports have a popup message on their computer screen when checking-in an Ultimate pax or when scanning a BP at the lounge (AFKL lounges only) asking them to be attentive at any special request of the Ultimate pax. See also below for airport-specific soft benefits. There is no known official policy for operational upgrades of Ultimates, but Ultimate members have all reported on FT a higher rate of op-up (but those remain rare !).
- AF and KL cabin crews are instructed to provide extra care and attentions on-board. It can take different forms : special greetings, extra amenities (pillow, oshibori, etc), F&B from the upper class, upgrades on board (Y to J medium haul, W to J or Y to W long haul), earlier and quicker meal service. This is not systematic and is up to the appreciation of the crew. Based on the reports of Ultimate members of this forum, AF crews seems to be more compliant than KL crews with those directives, although there has been several reports in this thread of nice attentions provided by KL crews.- Unlimited downloads (any day) in AF PLAY app.
Other Skyteam airlines do not provide any extra service or attentions to FB Ultimate passengers.
Airport-specific soft (unpublished) benefits
All benefits below should be understood for departure, unless otherwise noted. In addition to what is mentioned below, it has been reported several cases of expedited transfers organised by AFKL staff in case of short/endangered connection at various airports.
Please complete/edit this list as needed.
AFKL HUBS
Amsterdam
- AMS : some reserved tables in the Non-Schengen lounges. Reserved area in the Schengen lounge (need to ask staff at long entrance). Pre-boarding sometimes granted at the gate.
Paris CDG
- CDG 2E:
- Departure : Escort from check-in to immigration in the morning (super fast track). Reserved space at K/L/M lounges. Pre-boarding upon request at the gate before beginning of general boarding
- Arrival : access to dedicated lane at passport control, all the way to the left, follow the "ULTIMATE" sign.
- Departure : There is a special Ultimate check-in counter in the SkyP zone (on the left of terminal). Reserved room in the lounge. Pre-boarding upon request at the gate before beginning of general boarding. Escort is provided from the counter to security (skipping the line).
- Arrival : no special treatment to report
- Departure : Reserved space in the lounge
- Arrival : no special treatment to report
Paris ORY
- Departure : Reserved space at Schengen and non-Schengen lounges. Pre-boarding upon request at the lounge.
- Arrival : no special treatment to report
EUROPE
Austria
- VIE: no special treatment to report
Croatia
- DBV: no special treatment to report
- SPU: no special treatment to report (not even lounge access)
Czech Republic
- PRG: no special treatment to report. Pre-boarding refused.
Denmark
- CPH: no special treatment to report
France (non-hubs)
- BES: no special treatment to report
- BIQ: no special treatment to report
- BOD: pre-boarding from lounge to plane inconsistently proposed
- CDG: see top of the list in "AFKL hubs".
- LYS: Escort from lounge to plane when flying from B gates provided upon request . Preboarding with escort to the plane consistently provided.
- MPL: pre-boarding with escort from lounge to plane, sometimes proposed (AF agent comes to the contract lounge to meet the Ultimate guest)
- MRS: no special treatment to report
- NCE: Reserved area in Infinity lounge (inconsistently provided : seems to be provided only when lounge crowded). Pre-boarding with escort from lounge to plane, sometimes proposed.
- NTE: no special treatment to report
- ORY: see top of the list in "AFKL hubs".
- PUF: bypass queue at security and pre-boarding provided upon request
- RNS: bypass queue at security and pre-boarding provided upon request
- TLS: Escort from check in to lounge inconsistently provided. Pre-boarding consistently provided
Germany
- BER: no special treatment to report
- DUS: no special treatment to report
- FRA: no special treatment to report
- HAM: no special treatment to report
- HAJ: No special treatment to report.
- MUC: Reserved area in the lounge, escort from lounge to plane with pre-boarding proposed.
- STR: reserved area in the lounge, pre-boarding
Greece
- ATH: no special treatment to report
- HER: no special treatment to report
- JTR: no special treatment to report
Hungary
- BUD: escort through security from check-in to lounge proposed
Ireland
- DUB: no special treatment to report
Italy
- BLQ: escort from check-in to lounge, and through security to plane.
- BRI: no special treatment to report
- CTA: no special treatment to report
- FCO: no special treatment to report
- FLR: no special treatment to report
- LIN: no special treatment to report
- MXP: pre-boarding granted by request
- VCE: escort through security from check-in to lounge, pre-boarding with escort from lounge to plane (not always consistently proposed)
- NAP: no special treatment to report
Netherlands
- AMS: see top of the list in "AFKL hubs".
Norway
- OSL: no special treatment to report
- TRF: no special treatment to report
- KRS: no special treatment to report
- SVG: no special treatment to report
Poland
- WAW: no special treatment to report
- KRK: no special treatment to report
- GDN: no special treatment to report
Portugal
- LIS: pre-boarding proposed upon request
Russia
- SVO: no special treatment to report
- LED: no special treatment to report
Spain
- AGP: no special treatment to report
- BCN: no special treatment to report
- MAD: no special treatment to report
- PMI: no special treatment to report
- SVQ: no special treatment to report
- TFS: no special treatment to report
- VLC: no special treatment to report
Sweden
- ARN: no special treatment to report
- GOT: no special treatment to report
Switzerland
- GVA: pre-boarding upon request. Reserved area in the lounge
- ZRH: no special treatment
United Kingdom
- ABZ: no special treatment to report
- EDI: no special treatment to report
- LHR: no special treatment to report
NORTH AMERICA
Canada
- YUL: Escort from check-in to lounge upon request. Reserved area in lounge, pre-boarding with escort from lounge to plane
- YYZ: escort on arrival through immigration, consistently offered. / Escort from check-in to lounge and from lounge to airplane
- YQB: escort from check-in to lounge proposed
- YVR: no special treatment to report
USA
- ATL: no special treatment to report (in connection)
- BOS: escort through security from check-in to lounge, pre-boarding, all consistently provided mostly spontaneously, sometimes upon request. A separate room in the AF lounge is also proposed.
- DTW: no special treatment to report (starting from DTW or in connection)
- IAD: escort through security from check-in to lounge upon request, but inconsistently provided. Reserved area at the lounge.
- IAH: no special treatment to report
- JFK (AF only / terminal 1) : reserved table in the dining area of the lounge (upstairs),
- JFK (KL only / terminal 4) : no special treatments to report.
- LAX: no special treatment to report
- ORD: On arrival, escort through immigration (not consistently provided). On departure, escort through security to lounge and from lounge to plane (pre-boarding)
- MSP: no special treatment to report, except one case of special DL Elite VIP treatment with expedited immigration and Porsche transfer to/from lounge (not a regular benefit to expect)
- SEA: pre-boarding with escort to plane
- SFO: reserved area in lounge
Mexico
- MEX (Terminal 1): escort through security to lounge with access to dedicated space. Ride from lounge to gate. Sometimes escort on arrival
CENTRAL & SOUTH AMERICA
- BOG: no special treatment to report
- LIM: escort to lounge, provided spontaneously
- GIG: Pre-boarding upon request.
- GRU: escort in case of short connection upon request, inconsistently provided; as of 02/2024 pre-boarding offered at check-in and provided by gate-staff (inconsistently provided).
- SCL: as of 03/2024 escort to lounge offered at departure check-in, pick-up from lounge and pre-boarding done
- EZE: escort to lounge with special crew lane for immigration provided spontaneously
ASIA / PACIFIC
- BKK: escort through security from check-in to lounge, upon request but inconsistently proposed. In connection : escort in case of short connection (better to request it before departure).
- BLR: escort from lounge to gate, pre-boarding provided
- BOM : escort from plane to immigration, and from checkin to the lounge
- DEL: as of 01/2024 escort upon arrival; proactive pre-departure call to arrange terminal entry via VIP entrance and escort to gate for pre-boarding (if lounge used, offered to pick up for pre-boarding)
- HKG: no special treatment to report.
- HND: Arrival : new 09/2023 = escort through immigration. Departure : escort from check-in desk to private (crew) security, proposed spontaneously
- KIX: Arrival : escort through immigration, wait at baggage claim. Departure : escort from check-in desk to lounge All proposed spontaneously
- SIN: no special treatment to report
CARIBBEAN & INDIAN OCEAN
- CUR: no special treatment to report, there is no (sky)priority lane for security or immigration, but escort/short track is available for 100 $.
- HAV: at departure, escort from check in counters until security checks. Pre-boarding offered. No escort at arrival. No reserved space in Lounge.
- FDF: No reserved space in Lounge. Pre-boarding upon request at the gate.
- MRU: escort on arrival through immigration. Unknown for departures (no data point)
- PTP: Reserved table in lounge. Pre-boarding upon request at the lounge with escort from lounge to plane.
- RUN: Pre-boarding proposed at check-in and in the lounge, with escort from lounge to plane. Reserved seats in lounge
- SXM: Escort for incoming transit pax (from/to AF flight) through passport controls and security, pre-boarding pro-actively offered for AF departure
MIDDLE EAST
- AUH : no special treatment to report
- BEY: no special treatment to report
- DXB: escort from check-in to lounge and from lounge to plane, all upon request, consistently provided. Access to the Ahlan lounge (normally reserved for P pax) instead of Skyteam lounge.
- JED: no special treatment to report
- RUH: no special treatment to report
- IST: no special treatment to report
AFRICA
- AGA: escort from check in to lounge and from lounge to aircraft, provided spontaneously
- CAI: no special treatment to report
- CMN: escort on arrival through immigration (not always consistently provided)
- CPT: escort from counter to lounge, provided spontaneously
- JNB: escort from counter to lounge (no fast track at immigration), provided spontaneously
- LOS: no special treatment to report
- RAK: escort on arrival, upon request (not provided on departure)
- RBA: on departure : escort to lounge and to plane, provided spontaneously.
- TUN: escort on arrival through immigration provided. Escort from check-in to lounge provided
- ZNZ: no special treatment to report (not even lounge access)
Flying Blue Platinum Ultimate Status
Sep 10, 2018, 4:55 am
#1456
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 366
Yes, they do - now already;
But for my part the psychology behind is a bit wicked by now: they react and are consequently on a personal basis 'nicer' to me, but not in general to the entire ULTI group. My level of embarrassment to 'complain' is in the meantime so high that I stopped pushing as my pushing for a better program can be easily misunderstood as 'pushing for personal benefits', which is not what I intend and never have done.
But for my part the psychology behind is a bit wicked by now: they react and are consequently on a personal basis 'nicer' to me, but not in general to the entire ULTI group. My level of embarrassment to 'complain' is in the meantime so high that I stopped pushing as my pushing for a better program can be easily misunderstood as 'pushing for personal benefits', which is not what I intend and never have done.
Sep 10, 2018, 4:34 pm
#1457
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: HAG
Programs: Der 5* FTL
Posts: 7,973
However, I and others with similar travel patterns aren’t usually bothered by that: I almost never check luggage, and the seating algorithm works so well that I always end up in one of the priority seats anyway, including blocked neighbouring seat.
So, yes, it’s „arrogant“ in attitude, but it’s a no-harm-done non-event in 99% of cases.
So, yes, it’s „arrogant“ in attitude, but it’s a no-harm-done non-event in 99% of cases.
Sometimes, I know in advance I will have baggage, in those times, it's usually just fine to book a classic fare (except those times it's literally impossible, because reasons... like trying to use an OTA to force J/Y combo on a multicity/openjaw... but I am getting OT).
Other times, however, I might not know until last minute. I expect that it very much could have happened to any of you - just before you leave for the airport, someone tries to give you a parting gift of a bottle of wine, or some homemade jam.. Now, when flying with Skyteam - all I have to do is check a bag in. For free, with my card. No problem at all. When flying LH Group, I'd be SOOL. Having to deal with either declining the gift (which in some cultures could be a huge faux pas), or the annoyance and stress of arranging a payment for extra bag on short notice.
Sep 11, 2018, 9:04 pm
#1459
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Champaign, IL
Programs: AF/KL FB Ultimate Platinum for Life/Club 2000, UA MileagePlus
Posts: 524
Is HON more difficult to obtain? Arguably yes. But I take the reasoning the other way around: if I did all the flying on air France and KLM that gets me HONCircle, what would I get with them? A program where I’d still stand in the same long lines on Monday morning at 2F, use the same lounge (maybe with the benefit of the zoo-type exposure that comes with the benefit of not having to fight for space), take the same bus and ride the same train in 2E, and so on. That’s the real difference.
A few years back, the Spiegel published an interesting article about how we perceive things, illustrating their point with concrete examples in our everyday life, e.g., what we think of the car that we own. While one customer would squawk about his car because after eight years of service he had to replace the windshield wipers (the nostalgia for car equipment built to last forever), another would praise his car because he only has to go to the dealership twice a year to get it maintained. It is all a matter of perception (and of expectation). Being accustomed to the plebeian conditions of long hauls, the additional attention, the possibility to get upgraded regularly with miles, the safety net of the Travel Assistant team, all by virtue of the Ultimate program, have clearly made my flying experience more pleasant. Conversely, anyone used to a more lavish service, either on the ground or in the air (or both), will, I suppose, have a different perception.
San Gottardo, while I do understand the point that you are trying to get across, I must also emphasize that, inasmuch as I am concerned, the level of stress associated to flying has diminished significantly since I became Ultimate. Although I do agree that the service is far from flawless, I must also acknowledge that my stress has been assuaged, as I rely on the Travel Assistant team to anticipate irregularities and find reasonable options to address them. Barring one very unfortunate circumstance, they never failed me. I have come to be content with the offer, even though every now and again I inveigh not so much against the program per se, but against how it is implemented at the different stages of my travels, from check-in to in-flight service. There is evidently ample room for improvement.
If I understand you correctly, the real stumbling block is whatever causes stress to the traveler. I wholeheartedly agree with you. I note, however, that irrespective of the efforts of the Ultimate program management to alleviate the stress induced by long waits at passport control and security check, or by the noisy environment of the lounge (or even by the class of service on board), these efforts can be thwarted hands down by external obstacles over which the airline has no leverage. For instance, it would be so easy to introduce a fast track at CDG 2G to expedite entry in the international zone, were the airport administration a tad more cooperative.
In stark contrast with KLM at AMS, AF has really improved the lounge experience for its Ultimate clients at CDG in recent months (especially at 2E/L and M). The private space, away from the rumble of the jungle, offers a quiet, stress-free environment, conducive to get some work done. It is admittedly not the P lounge, but accessing the latter has proven a lost battle, even though the number of Ultimates transiting daily through CDG is rather limited (over a year period, I only met two in total at the AF lounges, but my statistics is just as limited).
Still, I am confident that there is a machine-learning component in the process, and that the overall Ultimate experience will progressively correct itself towards more consistency and improved adaptation to the needs of the ultra-frequent-flier. It may just take longer than we anticipated.
Sep 12, 2018, 4:51 am
#1460
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: CDG/AMS
Programs: FB Plat for life, FB PC, M&M FT, Hertz President (+ many low tier cards)
Posts: 2,777
Still, I am confident that there is a machine-learning component in the process, and that the overall Ultimate experience will progressively correct itself towards more consistency and improved adaptation to the needs of the ultra-frequent-flier. It may just take longer than we anticipated.
Sep 12, 2018, 5:10 am
#1461
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Champaign, IL
Programs: AF/KL FB Ultimate Platinum for Life/Club 2000, UA MileagePlus
Posts: 524
.
Sep 12, 2018, 1:02 pm
#1462
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: French riviera, France
Programs: Nice Airport Premier Plat, Flying Blue Platinum (Skyteam E+), Le Club Accor Plat
Posts: 103
Hello !
The topic is so long, all my apologies if the answer already exists. I checked before though the search feature.
At this moment I'm not so bad on my personal XP counter for reaching Ultimate (excel file of course).
I need to know if the "Extra XP bonus for Discount Pass" for Abonné holders is included on UXP counter ?
Each France metropolitan flight I have this extra +2XP, finally +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 .... it's a big amount !!
Best
The topic is so long, all my apologies if the answer already exists. I checked before though the search feature.
At this moment I'm not so bad on my personal XP counter for reaching Ultimate (excel file of course).
I need to know if the "Extra XP bonus for Discount Pass" for Abonné holders is included on UXP counter ?
Each France metropolitan flight I have this extra +2XP, finally +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 .... it's a big amount !!
Best
Sep 12, 2018, 2:31 pm
#1463
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,044
Hello !
The topic is so long, all my apologies if the answer already exists. I checked before though the search feature.
At this moment I'm not so bad on my personal XP counter for reaching Ultimate (excel file of course).
I need to know if the "Extra XP bonus for Discount Pass" for Abonné holders is included on UXP counter ?
Each France metropolitan flight I have this extra +2XP, finally +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 .... it's a big amount !!
Best
The topic is so long, all my apologies if the answer already exists. I checked before though the search feature.
At this moment I'm not so bad on my personal XP counter for reaching Ultimate (excel file of course).
I need to know if the "Extra XP bonus for Discount Pass" for Abonné holders is included on UXP counter ?
Each France metropolitan flight I have this extra +2XP, finally +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 +2 .... it's a big amount !!
Best
good luck by chasing the ULTI status
Sep 14, 2018, 1:14 pm
#1464
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,889
HKG
I have flown to HKG this week (AF J). Both flights super full all classes, including P, and this was like that several days before each flights as per Expertflyer.
On the good side, the service has been top notch both ways with chief pursers and J FA going the extra mile and providing extra attentions to please me. Very nice flight experiences, sincerely. ^
On the bad side, I fear that the ground staff in HKG has joined the dark side of the force, or at least the ones that were on duty on the day of my return flight. While this station has always provided very good Ulti service with escort through security and immigration to the lounge and then from lounge to plane (pre-boarding), it was first declined saying that it was done only for P, bla bla bla unless they receive special instructions from HQ bla bla bla. After a couple of arguments, I asked the agent to check with his supervisor. The supervisor came and reluctantly did half of the job after insisting. When I said half, I mean that she escorted me till past immigration and security and not even to the lounge and she asked « you’ll go to the plane by yourself, right ? ». I didn’t insist as I was tired of all that.
Consistency, training, training and training...
On the good side, the service has been top notch both ways with chief pursers and J FA going the extra mile and providing extra attentions to please me. Very nice flight experiences, sincerely. ^
On the bad side, I fear that the ground staff in HKG has joined the dark side of the force, or at least the ones that were on duty on the day of my return flight. While this station has always provided very good Ulti service with escort through security and immigration to the lounge and then from lounge to plane (pre-boarding), it was first declined saying that it was done only for P, bla bla bla unless they receive special instructions from HQ bla bla bla. After a couple of arguments, I asked the agent to check with his supervisor. The supervisor came and reluctantly did half of the job after insisting. When I said half, I mean that she escorted me till past immigration and security and not even to the lounge and she asked « you’ll go to the plane by yourself, right ? ». I didn’t insist as I was tired of all that.
Consistency, training, training and training...
Sep 15, 2018, 1:13 am
#1465
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,044
HKG
i flight that route quite regularly but I admit that I usually opt for CX which offers to me a more consistent service in J with more flight attendants. I feel me bettter served in J as One World Sapphire (Gold) versus AF in J as ULTI member 🙄
As I do my check in in the town and use the express MTR, I never went to AF counters when I flew with them but security control were always quite express there before the night flights.
Besides that when I have to check in luggage (which I avoid!), I am now fed up with the waiting time at 2E.
Arrivals at Roissy 1 or terminal A lead to much shortened delivery time in the morning .
But indeed Goldorak, your recent experience shows again the low level of consistency of the ULTI prog
i flight that route quite regularly but I admit that I usually opt for CX which offers to me a more consistent service in J with more flight attendants. I feel me bettter served in J as One World Sapphire (Gold) versus AF in J as ULTI member 🙄
As I do my check in in the town and use the express MTR, I never went to AF counters when I flew with them but security control were always quite express there before the night flights.
Besides that when I have to check in luggage (which I avoid!), I am now fed up with the waiting time at 2E.
Arrivals at Roissy 1 or terminal A lead to much shortened delivery time in the morning .
But indeed Goldorak, your recent experience shows again the low level of consistency of the ULTI prog
Sep 15, 2018, 9:04 pm
#1466
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Champaign, IL
Programs: AF/KL FB Ultimate Platinum for Life/Club 2000, UA MileagePlus
Posts: 524
I have flown to HKG this week (AF J). Both flights super full all classes, including P, and this was like that several days before each flights as per Expertflyer.
On the good side, the service has been top notch both ways with chief pursers and J FA going the extra mile and providing extra attentions to please me. Very nice flight experiences, sincerely. ^
On the bad side, I fear that the ground staff in HKG has joined the dark side of the force, or at least the ones that were on duty on the day of my return flight. While this station has always provided very good Ulti service with escort through security and immigration to the lounge and then from lounge to plane (pre-boarding), it was first declined saying that it was done only for P, bla bla bla unless they receive special instructions from HQ bla bla bla. After a couple of arguments, I asked the agent to check with his supervisor. The supervisor came and reluctantly did half of the job after insisting. When I said half, I mean that she escorted me till past immigration and security and not even to the lounge and she asked « you’ll go to the plane by yourself, right ? ». I didn’t insist as I was tired of all that.
Consistency, training, training and training...
On the good side, the service has been top notch both ways with chief pursers and J FA going the extra mile and providing extra attentions to please me. Very nice flight experiences, sincerely. ^
On the bad side, I fear that the ground staff in HKG has joined the dark side of the force, or at least the ones that were on duty on the day of my return flight. While this station has always provided very good Ulti service with escort through security and immigration to the lounge and then from lounge to plane (pre-boarding), it was first declined saying that it was done only for P, bla bla bla unless they receive special instructions from HQ bla bla bla. After a couple of arguments, I asked the agent to check with his supervisor. The supervisor came and reluctantly did half of the job after insisting. When I said half, I mean that she escorted me till past immigration and security and not even to the lounge and she asked « you’ll go to the plane by yourself, right ? ». I didn’t insist as I was tired of all that.
Consistency, training, training and training...
Well, that sucks. Out of the different outstations I transit through, I thought that HKG was one of the most effective in enforcing the directives for Ultimate PAXs. I never had any quibble or matter to complain about. I will be there next Friday and let you know whether your feedback has been heeded. Stay tuned for more...
Sep 15, 2018, 11:05 pm
#1467
Join Date: Apr 2005
Programs: Eurostar Carte Blanche, SBB-CFF-FFS GA-AG, SNCF Grand Voyageur LeClub
Posts: 7,832
Since ground assistance is the topic, what are your experiences at CDG? Still nothing at 2F, how about 2E? The "fast fast lane" at CDG was a temporary solution, or is this still around? And how about departure? Any assistance/escorts there?
Sep 16, 2018, 3:21 am
#1468
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,889
In 2E, the situation is still the same : assistance/escort through immigration is provided on departure and arrival until 2pm. After 2pm, on departure, it’s up to the goodwill of the check-in agents. AF introduced that in April 2017 as a temporary solution but we made clear with AF that removing this perk would be a huge mistake as this is the most tangible Ulti perk.
Outside that, whatever the terminal, there is assistance provided in case of risk of mIsconnection, but this is hit and missed and not always done in the most efficient way. But sometimes, it can be great.
Sep 16, 2018, 4:09 am
#1469
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hong Kong, France
Programs: FB , BA Gold
Posts: 15,532
I have flown to HKG this week (AF J). Both flights super full all classes, including P, and this was like that several days before each flights as per Expertflyer.
On the good side, the service has been top notch both ways with chief pursers and J FA going the extra mile and providing extra attentions to please me. Very nice flight experiences, sincerely. ^
On the bad side, I fear that the ground staff in HKG has joined the dark side of the force, or at least the ones that were on duty on the day of my return flight. While this station has always provided very good Ulti service with escort through security and immigration to the lounge and then from lounge to plane (pre-boarding), it was first declined saying that it was done only for P, bla bla bla unless they receive special instructions from HQ bla bla bla. After a couple of arguments, I asked the agent to check with his supervisor. The supervisor came and reluctantly did half of the job after insisting. When I said half, I mean that she escorted me till past immigration and security and not even to the lounge and she asked « you’ll go to the plane by yourself, right ? ». I didn’t insist as I was tired of all that.
Consistency, training, training and training...
On the good side, the service has been top notch both ways with chief pursers and J FA going the extra mile and providing extra attentions to please me. Very nice flight experiences, sincerely. ^
On the bad side, I fear that the ground staff in HKG has joined the dark side of the force, or at least the ones that were on duty on the day of my return flight. While this station has always provided very good Ulti service with escort through security and immigration to the lounge and then from lounge to plane (pre-boarding), it was first declined saying that it was done only for P, bla bla bla unless they receive special instructions from HQ bla bla bla. After a couple of arguments, I asked the agent to check with his supervisor. The supervisor came and reluctantly did half of the job after insisting. When I said half, I mean that she escorted me till past immigration and security and not even to the lounge and she asked « you’ll go to the plane by yourself, right ? ». I didn’t insist as I was tired of all that.
Consistency, training, training and training...
HKKG now has one flight per day. If they have 4 F pax they don't have the staff for other Ulti. And the evening departure is the most busy time for third-party staff as this is the time when most European flights depart, as well as many to Australia and America.
With all due respect, this thread spends a lot on escort service and I understand that it can be useful (although not much needed at HKG where you will never take more than ten minutes to clear security+immigration). But I don't see how AF can guarantee the service at outstations. Setting the expectation that you will always get it is unrealistic and not a sufficient reason to get "mad"
.BTW Goldorak, the typhoon is slowly moving away but it was a bad one. Five out of eight of my big trees are down. Flooding is bad. Hope that HKG did not get damaged like KIX. Update: HKG just announce that it will resume normal operation in the morning. Great news.
Last edited by brunos; Sep 16, 2018 at 4:19 am
Sep 16, 2018, 8:04 am
#1470
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,889
I don't think that outstations can play the law of large numbers.
HKKG now has one flight per day. If they have 4 F pax they don't have the staff for other Ulti. And the evening departure is the most busy time for third-party staff as this is the time when most European flights depart, as well as many to Australia and America.
With all due respect, this thread spends a lot on escort service and I understand that it can be useful (although not much needed at HKG where you will never take more than ten minutes to clear security+immigration). But I don't see how AF can guarantee the service at outstations. Setting the expectation that you will always get it is unrealistic and not a sufficient reason to get "mad".
HKKG now has one flight per day. If they have 4 F pax they don't have the staff for other Ulti. And the evening departure is the most busy time for third-party staff as this is the time when most European flights depart, as well as many to Australia and America.
With all due respect, this thread spends a lot on escort service and I understand that it can be useful (although not much needed at HKG where you will never take more than ten minutes to clear security+immigration). But I don't see how AF can guarantee the service at outstations. Setting the expectation that you will always get it is unrealistic and not a sufficient reason to get "mad"
.Indeed, this thread is talking a lot about escort and expedited services. Why ? Simply because this is the most important benefit (along with reserved lounge area) for very frequent travelers like Ulti/HON/etc. Most of the rest is in the nice-to-have category. And this needs to be provided as a consistent perk and not just sometimes, if the weather is nice or if the agents are in a good mood that particular day. To have now “tested” a very significant number of airports since I am Ulti, I can tell you that it is just a question of goodwill and professionalism under the management of the station manager. I have seen outstations with limited ressources providing extraordinary/top notch service while some others with plenty of staff and at non-peak times did not want to move a finger remaining on super lazy mode. What made me upset in HKG is that it was a “consistent” station until now.
