May 9, 2019, 3:08 pm
Last edit by: Goldorak
FLYING BLUE ULTIMATE
Main facts
Ultimate is the top status in FB. It may be added to Club 2000 – Skipper status.
While other FB status (Silver/Gold/Platinum) are based on experience points earning (XP), Ultimate status is obtained by Ultimate XP (UXP) earning. UXPs are earned exclusively on AF- and KL-coded (= marketed) flights, whatever the operating airline.
Some examples :
- CDG-JFK AF-marketing, AF-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- CDG-JFK DL-marketing, AF-operating : NON-eligible to UXP earning
- AMS-BOS KL-marketing, DL-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- BOS-IND KL-marketing, DL-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- SIN-SYD AF-marketing, QF-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- CDG-FCO AZ-marketing, AZ-operating : NON-eligible to UXP earning
XP earned via AFKL Amex cards are not eligible (those are XP and not UXP).
To qualify for Ultimate, it is needed to have 900 UXP over a year. It is similar to the normal XP counter, resetting as soon as the tier is reached. Ultimate is valid for 1 year once granted. Note 03/2023 : the qualification system just changed from 1800 UXP over 2 years to 900 UXP/1 year. Some transitional measures are in place for the current Ultimate members. See here for details about handling of transition period :
https://www.flyingblue.com/fr/landin...m_content=main
Since 03/2023, a rollover of surplus UXP (over 900) is now possible to the next year and only to the next year (example : year 1, the member earns 2000UXP. At the end of year 1, only 900 UXP will be rolled-over to year 2 and the remaining 1100 UXP earned in Y1 will be lost and not be transferred to year 3. If during year 2, the member earned 1000 new (fresh) UXP, 100 will be rolled-over to year 3.
Hard benefits
- All FB Platinum/Club 2000-Skipper benefits
- Access to a Travel Assistant service 24/7. They are reachable by phone or by email. In practice, from 8 pm to 8 am CET, calls are taken by the Platinum line.
- highest priority on waiting list and in case of irrops
- Possibility to register up to 8 persons who can benefit from Sky Priority services and lounge access when traveling with the Ultimate member and on same PNR (lounge access is only in AFKL lounges here).
- one companion Platinum card
- when the Ultimate member is flying P, 2 guests are allowed in CDG P lounge.
- Zone 1 boarding, irrespective of travel class.
- Access to Hertz Platinum status
- four one-class upgrade certificates per membership year, requiring 1 from W to J, or 2 from Y to J. Upgrades are confirmed instantly at the time of booking (via the Travel Assistant). One voucher = one way. Vouchers can also be used by one of the 8 registered friend/family members travelling by themselves. In case of a long-haul flight with a medium-haul connection/feeder (e.g. CDG-AMS-JFK), the medium-haul segment will be upgraded also with still only one voucher used. In case of 2 long-haul flights in connection (e,g. DXB-CDG-JFK), the use of 2 vouchers is required to upgrade the 2 segments. Upgrade vouchers are usable only on AF- or KL-marketing and operating flights and the PNR must contains only the AFKL flights to be upgraded (if the PNR contains other non-AFKL flights, you cannot upgrade even just the AFKL flights).
The upgrade coupons are valid as soon as you reach Ultimate and is valid for 12 months. The vouchers need to be used within the membership year, but can be applied for travel post expiry date.
Rules for eligible booking classes for the upgrade vouchers are described below :
AF flights, long-haul
Premium Eco to Business
Original booking class : A, S, W
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C (it means that if the flight has only J fare available, one cannot upgrade)
Eco to Business (all flights, except to/from USA, Canada, Mexico)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N, R
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C (it means that if the flight has only J fare available, one cannot upgrade)
Eco to Business (flights to/from USA, Canada, Mexico, including LAX-PPT)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N
Upgraded booking class : Z, C
KL flights, long-haul
Eco to Business (all flights, except to/from USA, Canada, Mexico and DEL)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N, R
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C
Eco to Business (flights to/from USA, Canada, Mexico and DEL)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N
Upgraded booking class : Z, I.
Airline-specific soft (unpublished) benefits
- AF, KL and contract staff at airports have a popup message on their computer screen when checking-in an Ultimate pax or when scanning a BP at the lounge (AFKL lounges only) asking them to be attentive at any special request of the Ultimate pax. See also below for airport-specific soft benefits. There is no known official policy for operational upgrades of Ultimates, but Ultimate members have all reported on FT a higher rate of op-up (but those remain rare !).
- AF and KL cabin crews are instructed to provide extra care and attentions on-board. It can take different forms : special greetings, extra amenities (pillow, oshibori, etc), F&B from the upper class, upgrades on board (Y to J medium haul, W to J or Y to W long haul), earlier and quicker meal service. This is not systematic and is up to the appreciation of the crew. Based on the reports of Ultimate members of this forum, AF crews seems to be more compliant than KL crews with those directives, although there has been several reports in this thread of nice attentions provided by KL crews.- Unlimited downloads (any day) in AF PLAY app.
Other Skyteam airlines do not provide any extra service or attentions to FB Ultimate passengers.
Airport-specific soft (unpublished) benefits
All benefits below should be understood for departure, unless otherwise noted. In addition to what is mentioned below, it has been reported several cases of expedited transfers organised by AFKL staff in case of short/endangered connection at various airports.
Please complete/edit this list as needed.
AFKL HUBS
Amsterdam
- AMS : some reserved tables in the Non-Schengen lounges. Reserved area in the Schengen lounge (need to ask staff at long entrance). Pre-boarding sometimes granted at the gate.
Paris CDG
Paris ORY
EUROPE
Austria
- VIE: no special treatment to report
Croatia
- DBV: no special treatment to report
- SPU: no special treatment to report (not even lounge access)
Czech Republic
- PRG: no special treatment to report. Pre-boarding refused.
Denmark
- CPH: no special treatment to report
France (non-hubs)
- AJA: no special treatment to reportMain facts
Ultimate is the top status in FB. It may be added to Club 2000 – Skipper status.
While other FB status (Silver/Gold/Platinum) are based on experience points earning (XP), Ultimate status is obtained by Ultimate XP (UXP) earning. UXPs are earned exclusively on AF- and KL-coded (= marketed) flights, whatever the operating airline.
Some examples :
- CDG-JFK AF-marketing, AF-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- CDG-JFK DL-marketing, AF-operating : NON-eligible to UXP earning
- AMS-BOS KL-marketing, DL-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- BOS-IND KL-marketing, DL-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- SIN-SYD AF-marketing, QF-operating : eligible to UXP earning
- CDG-FCO AZ-marketing, AZ-operating : NON-eligible to UXP earning
XP earned via AFKL Amex cards are not eligible (those are XP and not UXP).
To qualify for Ultimate, it is needed to have 900 UXP over a year. It is similar to the normal XP counter, resetting as soon as the tier is reached. Ultimate is valid for 1 year once granted. Note 03/2023 : the qualification system just changed from 1800 UXP over 2 years to 900 UXP/1 year. Some transitional measures are in place for the current Ultimate members. See here for details about handling of transition period :
https://www.flyingblue.com/fr/landin...m_content=main
Since 03/2023, a rollover of surplus UXP (over 900) is now possible to the next year and only to the next year (example : year 1, the member earns 2000UXP. At the end of year 1, only 900 UXP will be rolled-over to year 2 and the remaining 1100 UXP earned in Y1 will be lost and not be transferred to year 3. If during year 2, the member earned 1000 new (fresh) UXP, 100 will be rolled-over to year 3.
Hard benefits
- All FB Platinum/Club 2000-Skipper benefits
- Access to a Travel Assistant service 24/7. They are reachable by phone or by email. In practice, from 8 pm to 8 am CET, calls are taken by the Platinum line.
- highest priority on waiting list and in case of irrops
- Possibility to register up to 8 persons who can benefit from Sky Priority services and lounge access when traveling with the Ultimate member and on same PNR (lounge access is only in AFKL lounges here).
- one companion Platinum card
- when the Ultimate member is flying P, 2 guests are allowed in CDG P lounge.
- Zone 1 boarding, irrespective of travel class.
- Access to Hertz Platinum status
- four one-class upgrade certificates per membership year, requiring 1 from W to J, or 2 from Y to J. Upgrades are confirmed instantly at the time of booking (via the Travel Assistant). One voucher = one way. Vouchers can also be used by one of the 8 registered friend/family members travelling by themselves. In case of a long-haul flight with a medium-haul connection/feeder (e.g. CDG-AMS-JFK), the medium-haul segment will be upgraded also with still only one voucher used. In case of 2 long-haul flights in connection (e,g. DXB-CDG-JFK), the use of 2 vouchers is required to upgrade the 2 segments. Upgrade vouchers are usable only on AF- or KL-marketing and operating flights and the PNR must contains only the AFKL flights to be upgraded (if the PNR contains other non-AFKL flights, you cannot upgrade even just the AFKL flights).
The upgrade coupons are valid as soon as you reach Ultimate and is valid for 12 months. The vouchers need to be used within the membership year, but can be applied for travel post expiry date.
Rules for eligible booking classes for the upgrade vouchers are described below :
AF flights, long-haul
Premium Eco to Business
Original booking class : A, S, W
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C (it means that if the flight has only J fare available, one cannot upgrade)
Eco to Business (all flights, except to/from USA, Canada, Mexico)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N, R
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C (it means that if the flight has only J fare available, one cannot upgrade)
Eco to Business (flights to/from USA, Canada, Mexico, including LAX-PPT)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N
Upgraded booking class : Z, C
KL flights, long-haul
Eco to Business (all flights, except to/from USA, Canada, Mexico and DEL)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N, R
Upgraded booking class : Z, I, D, C
Eco to Business (flights to/from USA, Canada, Mexico and DEL)
Original booking class : Y, B, M, U, K, H, L, Q, T, N
Upgraded booking class : Z, I.
Airline-specific soft (unpublished) benefits
- AF, KL and contract staff at airports have a popup message on their computer screen when checking-in an Ultimate pax or when scanning a BP at the lounge (AFKL lounges only) asking them to be attentive at any special request of the Ultimate pax. See also below for airport-specific soft benefits. There is no known official policy for operational upgrades of Ultimates, but Ultimate members have all reported on FT a higher rate of op-up (but those remain rare !).
- AF and KL cabin crews are instructed to provide extra care and attentions on-board. It can take different forms : special greetings, extra amenities (pillow, oshibori, etc), F&B from the upper class, upgrades on board (Y to J medium haul, W to J or Y to W long haul), earlier and quicker meal service. This is not systematic and is up to the appreciation of the crew. Based on the reports of Ultimate members of this forum, AF crews seems to be more compliant than KL crews with those directives, although there has been several reports in this thread of nice attentions provided by KL crews.- Unlimited downloads (any day) in AF PLAY app.
Other Skyteam airlines do not provide any extra service or attentions to FB Ultimate passengers.
Airport-specific soft (unpublished) benefits
All benefits below should be understood for departure, unless otherwise noted. In addition to what is mentioned below, it has been reported several cases of expedited transfers organised by AFKL staff in case of short/endangered connection at various airports.
Please complete/edit this list as needed.
AFKL HUBS
Amsterdam
- AMS : some reserved tables in the Non-Schengen lounges. Reserved area in the Schengen lounge (need to ask staff at long entrance). Pre-boarding sometimes granted at the gate.
Paris CDG
- CDG 2E:
- Departure : Escort from check-in to immigration in the morning (super fast track). Reserved space at K/L/M lounges. Pre-boarding upon request at the gate before beginning of general boarding
- Arrival : access to dedicated lane at passport control, all the way to the left, follow the "ULTIMATE" sign.
- Departure : There is a special Ultimate check-in counter in the SkyP zone (on the left of terminal). Reserved room in the lounge. Pre-boarding upon request at the gate before beginning of general boarding. Escort is provided from the counter to security (skipping the line).
- Arrival : no special treatment to report
- Departure : Reserved space in the lounge
- Arrival : no special treatment to report
Paris ORY
- Departure : Reserved space at Schengen and non-Schengen lounges. Pre-boarding upon request at the lounge.
- Arrival : no special treatment to report
EUROPE
Austria
- VIE: no special treatment to report
Croatia
- DBV: no special treatment to report
- SPU: no special treatment to report (not even lounge access)
Czech Republic
- PRG: no special treatment to report. Pre-boarding refused.
Denmark
- CPH: no special treatment to report
France (non-hubs)
- BES: no special treatment to report
- BIQ: no special treatment to report
- BOD: pre-boarding from lounge to plane inconsistently proposed
- CDG: see top of the list in "AFKL hubs".
- LYS: Escort from lounge to plane when flying from B gates provided upon request . Preboarding with escort to the plane consistently provided.
- MPL: pre-boarding with escort from lounge to plane, sometimes proposed (AF agent comes to the contract lounge to meet the Ultimate guest)
- MRS: no special treatment to report
- NCE: Reserved area in Infinity lounge (inconsistently provided : seems to be provided only when lounge crowded). Pre-boarding with escort from lounge to plane, sometimes proposed.
- NTE: no special treatment to report
- ORY: see top of the list in "AFKL hubs".
- PUF: bypass queue at security and pre-boarding provided upon request
- RNS: bypass queue at security and pre-boarding provided upon request
- TLS: Escort from check in to lounge inconsistently provided. Pre-boarding consistently provided
Germany
- BER: no special treatment to report
- DUS: no special treatment to report
- FRA: no special treatment to report
- HAM: no special treatment to report
- HAJ: No special treatment to report.
- MUC: Reserved area in the lounge, escort from lounge to plane with pre-boarding proposed.
- STR: reserved area in the lounge, pre-boarding
Greece
- ATH: no special treatment to report
- HER: no special treatment to report
- JTR: no special treatment to report
Hungary
- BUD: escort through security from check-in to lounge proposed
Ireland
- DUB: no special treatment to report
Italy
- BLQ: escort from check-in to lounge, and through security to plane.
- BRI: no special treatment to report
- CTA: no special treatment to report
- FCO: no special treatment to report
- FLR: no special treatment to report
- LIN: no special treatment to report
- MXP: pre-boarding granted by request
- VCE: escort through security from check-in to lounge, pre-boarding with escort from lounge to plane (not always consistently proposed)
- NAP: no special treatment to report
Netherlands
- AMS: see top of the list in "AFKL hubs".
Norway
- OSL: no special treatment to report
- TRF: no special treatment to report
- KRS: no special treatment to report
- SVG: no special treatment to report
Poland
- WAW: no special treatment to report
- KRK: no special treatment to report
- GDN: no special treatment to report
Portugal
- LIS: pre-boarding proposed upon request
Russia
- SVO: no special treatment to report
- LED: no special treatment to report
Spain
- AGP: no special treatment to report
- BCN: no special treatment to report
- MAD: no special treatment to report
- PMI: no special treatment to report
- SVQ: no special treatment to report
- TFS: no special treatment to report
- VLC: no special treatment to report
Sweden
- ARN: no special treatment to report
- GOT: no special treatment to report
Switzerland
- GVA: pre-boarding upon request. Reserved area in the lounge
- ZRH: no special treatment
United Kingdom
- ABZ: no special treatment to report
- EDI: no special treatment to report
- LHR: no special treatment to report
NORTH AMERICA
Canada
- YUL: Escort from check-in to lounge upon request. Reserved area in lounge, pre-boarding with escort from lounge to plane
- YYZ: escort on arrival through immigration, consistently offered. / Escort from check-in to lounge and from lounge to airplane
- YQB: escort from check-in to lounge proposed
- YVR: no special treatment to report
USA
- ATL: no special treatment to report (in connection)
- BOS: escort through security from check-in to lounge, pre-boarding, all consistently provided mostly spontaneously, sometimes upon request. A separate room in the AF lounge is also proposed.
- DTW: no special treatment to report (starting from DTW or in connection)
- IAD: escort through security from check-in to lounge upon request, but inconsistently provided. Reserved area at the lounge.
- IAH: no special treatment to report
- JFK (AF only / terminal 1) : reserved table in the dining area of the lounge (upstairs),
- JFK (KL only / terminal 4) : no special treatments to report.
- LAX: no special treatment to report
- ORD: On arrival, escort through immigration (not consistently provided). On departure, escort through security to lounge and from lounge to plane (pre-boarding)
- MSP: no special treatment to report, except one case of special DL Elite VIP treatment with expedited immigration and Porsche transfer to/from lounge (not a regular benefit to expect)
- SEA: pre-boarding with escort to plane
- SFO: reserved area in lounge
Mexico
- MEX (Terminal 1): escort through security to lounge with access to dedicated space. Ride from lounge to gate. Sometimes escort on arrival
CENTRAL & SOUTH AMERICA
- BOG: no special treatment to report
- LIM: escort to lounge, provided spontaneously
- GIG: Pre-boarding upon request.
- GRU: escort in case of short connection upon request, inconsistently provided; as of 02/2024 pre-boarding offered at check-in and provided by gate-staff (inconsistently provided).
- SCL: as of 03/2024 escort to lounge offered at departure check-in, pick-up from lounge and pre-boarding done
- EZE: escort to lounge with special crew lane for immigration provided spontaneously
ASIA / PACIFIC
- BKK: escort through security from check-in to lounge, upon request but inconsistently proposed. In connection : escort in case of short connection (better to request it before departure).
- BLR: escort from lounge to gate, pre-boarding provided
- BOM : escort from plane to immigration, and from checkin to the lounge
- DEL: as of 01/2024 escort upon arrival; proactive pre-departure call to arrange terminal entry via VIP entrance and escort to gate for pre-boarding (if lounge used, offered to pick up for pre-boarding)
- HKG: no special treatment to report.
- HND: Arrival : new 09/2023 = escort through immigration. Departure : escort from check-in desk to private (crew) security, proposed spontaneously
- KIX: Arrival : escort through immigration, wait at baggage claim. Departure : escort from check-in desk to lounge All proposed spontaneously
- SIN: no special treatment to report
CARIBBEAN & INDIAN OCEAN
- CUR: no special treatment to report, there is no (sky)priority lane for security or immigration, but escort/short track is available for 100 $.
- HAV: at departure, escort from check in counters until security checks. Pre-boarding offered. No escort at arrival. No reserved space in Lounge.
- FDF: No reserved space in Lounge. Pre-boarding upon request at the gate.
- MRU: escort on arrival through immigration. Unknown for departures (no data point)
- PTP: Reserved table in lounge. Pre-boarding upon request at the lounge with escort from lounge to plane.
- RUN: Pre-boarding proposed at check-in and in the lounge, with escort from lounge to plane. Reserved seats in lounge
- SXM: Escort for incoming transit pax (from/to AF flight) through passport controls and security, pre-boarding pro-actively offered for AF departure
MIDDLE EAST
- AUH : no special treatment to report
- BEY: no special treatment to report
- DXB: escort from check-in to lounge and from lounge to plane, all upon request, consistently provided. Access to the Ahlan lounge (normally reserved for P pax) instead of Skyteam lounge.
- JED: no special treatment to report
- RUH: no special treatment to report
- IST: no special treatment to report
AFRICA
- AGA: escort from check in to lounge and from lounge to aircraft, provided spontaneously
- CAI: no special treatment to report
- CMN: escort on arrival through immigration (not always consistently provided)
- CPT: escort from counter to lounge, provided spontaneously
- JNB: escort from counter to lounge (no fast track at immigration), provided spontaneously
- LOS: no special treatment to report
- RAK: escort on arrival, upon request (not provided on departure)
- RBA: on departure : escort to lounge and to plane, provided spontaneously.
- TUN: escort on arrival through immigration provided. Escort from check-in to lounge provided
- ZNZ: no special treatment to report (not even lounge access)
Flying Blue Platinum Ultimate Status
May 20, 2020, 2:00 am
#2881
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,044
Thanks for the info !
Coming back to the actual situation and our ability to travel in a near future, France has just confirmed that all passengers coming back from outside Europe will go through a 14 days quarantine in a dedicated centre or at home which is a first step towards complete reopening.
Will probably keep my plans to go to GRU at the end of June, hoping that there won't be a 2nd wave until that.
Will probably postpone my trips to Italy & MEX that were planned in 2 weeks.
Spain is still applying a 14 days quarantine even for EU passengers so will skip this destination until measures are more flexible.
Received today a questionnaire from AF with several questions about suggestions to restart its activities in a near future
However and considering the health measures on board and at the airport, it will be as enjoyable as it used to be...
Coming back to the actual situation and our ability to travel in a near future, France has just confirmed that all passengers coming back from outside Europe will go through a 14 days quarantine in a dedicated centre or at home which is a first step towards complete reopening.
Will probably keep my plans to go to GRU at the end of June, hoping that there won't be a 2nd wave until that.
Will probably postpone my trips to Italy & MEX that were planned in 2 weeks.
Spain is still applying a 14 days quarantine even for EU passengers so will skip this destination until measures are more flexible.
Received today a questionnaire from AF with several questions about suggestions to restart its activities in a near future
However and considering the health measures on board and at the airport, it will be as enjoyable as it used to be...
it will take time to travel for business purposes : most firms are still applying travel restrictions for employees.
As well , most of my clients avoid physical meetings .
I do not expect major changes until the end of the year .
May 20, 2020, 2:21 am
#2882
Join Date: Mar 2017
Programs: FB Ultimate, Accor Diamond, HH Diamond, BW Diamond,Avis President, Hertz President Club
Posts: 137
Next one is to MRS on the 5th of June. My 8-years old me is wishing to be on the plane more than ever
May 26, 2020, 9:54 am
#2883
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Paris and around the WW
Programs: AF/KLM Club2000 Ultimate / M&M HON Circle / ALL Diamond / Hertz President Circle
Posts: 1,039
Hi Ulti guys,
I hope you're all safe and good
Quick question regarding the fact that A380 will not fly again in the future.
I have upcoming several booking in P with A380 to MEX. So far, the cabin map have not changed and I still can book some tickers until the end of 2020 with the olf A380 cabin map
What is going to happen ?
P cabin might not be kept in a near future. If so, how are they dealing with the existing bookings ?
If P cabin is kept with 77X, there will be way less seats so probably, some booking will have to be changed. In that case, why are they not updating right away the cabin map to prevent it to happen ?
Thanks
I hope you're all safe and good
Quick question regarding the fact that A380 will not fly again in the future.
I have upcoming several booking in P with A380 to MEX. So far, the cabin map have not changed and I still can book some tickers until the end of 2020 with the olf A380 cabin map
What is going to happen ?
P cabin might not be kept in a near future. If so, how are they dealing with the existing bookings ?
If P cabin is kept with 77X, there will be way less seats so probably, some booking will have to be changed. In that case, why are they not updating right away the cabin map to prevent it to happen ?
Thanks
May 26, 2020, 12:03 pm
#2884
Join Date: Mar 2017
Programs: FB Ultimate, Accor Diamond, HH Diamond, BW Diamond,Avis President, Hertz President Club
Posts: 137
Hi Ulti guys,
I hope you're all safe and good
Quick question regarding the fact that A380 will not fly again in the future.
I have upcoming several booking in P with A380 to MEX. So far, the cabin map have not changed and I still can book some tickers until the end of 2020 with the olf A380 cabin map
What is going to happen ?
P cabin might not be kept in a near future. If so, how are they dealing with the existing bookings ?
If P cabin is kept with 77X, there will be way less seats so probably, some booking will have to be changed. In that case, why are they not updating right away the cabin map to prevent it to happen ?
Thanks
I hope you're all safe and good
Quick question regarding the fact that A380 will not fly again in the future.
I have upcoming several booking in P with A380 to MEX. So far, the cabin map have not changed and I still can book some tickers until the end of 2020 with the olf A380 cabin map
What is going to happen ?
P cabin might not be kept in a near future. If so, how are they dealing with the existing bookings ?
If P cabin is kept with 77X, there will be way less seats so probably, some booking will have to be changed. In that case, why are they not updating right away the cabin map to prevent it to happen ?
Thanks
Same on my side but to MIA. I have booked a P ticket on February 21st with the A380. I've already raised the question to the TA and to the La Premičre TA. Both have said that they will use the 777 with P cabins to such destinations covered by the A380 and in order to increase the capacities, they will also retrofit the current 777 - 3 Classes with the P cabin.
If for any reason the day of the trip the plane doesn't have a P cabin they can: (i) put you in another flight having P (even if you need to connect to another flight); (ii) downgrade you to J, refund the difference but making you benefit of the P services. On destinations covered by other airlines having P they can transfer to such airline on a P cabin. But I bet you know already this
Cheers,
Alex
May 26, 2020, 2:22 pm
#2885
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,909
Same on my side but to MIA. I have booked a P ticket on February 21st with the A380. I've already raised the question to the TA and to the La Premičre TA. Both have said that they will use the 777 with P cabins to such destinations covered by the A380 and in order to increase the capacities, they will also retrofit the current 777 - 3 Classes with the P cabin.
Also, before the retrofit is done, I don’t think they have enough of the current fleet with P to cover both the current B777 P destinations + the current A380 destinations. Unless the network and frequencies are shrinked significantly releasing some planes available for other markets.
May 26, 2020, 11:12 pm
#2886
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,044
If for any reason the day of the trip the plane doesn't have a P cabin they can: (i) put you in another flight having P (even if you need to connect to another flight); (ii) downgrade you to J, refund the difference but making you benefit of the P services. On destinations covered by other airlines having P they can transfer to such airline on a P cabin. But I bet you know already this
Cheers,
Alex
i have been automatically rebooked in J, same flight number, same day.
BUT be aware that no tarif difference reimbursement was offered as AF in such cases automatically rebook P PAX in the highest business class fare bucket “J”
As a matter of fact J full fare price on this route was much higher than my original ticket price issues in F bucket price
I confirmed that P lounge Acces was accessible
May 27, 2020, 12:12 am
#2887
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Paris and around the WW
Programs: AF/KLM Club2000 Ultimate / M&M HON Circle / ALL Diamond / Hertz President Circle
Posts: 1,039
I experienced recently a cancellation of a P operated route (DXB) which turned into 772.
i have been automatically rebooked in J, same flight number, same day.
BUT be aware that no tarif difference reimbursement was offered as AF in such cases automatically rebook P PAX in the highest business class fare bucket “J”
As a matter of fact J full fare price on this route was much higher than my original ticket price issues in F bucket price
I confirmed that P lounge Acces was accessible
i have been automatically rebooked in J, same flight number, same day.
BUT be aware that no tarif difference reimbursement was offered as AF in such cases automatically rebook P PAX in the highest business class fare bucket “J”
As a matter of fact J full fare price on this route was much higher than my original ticket price issues in F bucket price
I confirmed that P lounge Acces was accessible
Meaning that AF can downgrade you from P to J without any compensation ? Obviously J full fare price was very expensive but you were not responsible of booking a last minute J ticket neither that they decided (or were forced) to switch to another plane...
Was it negotiable with AF if you were OK to postpone your trip to another flight or to the next day (if a P cabin was available) ?
May 27, 2020, 1:18 am
#2888
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,909
I experienced recently a cancellation of a P operated route (DXB) which turned into 772.
i have been automatically rebooked in J, same flight number, same day.
BUT be aware that no tarif difference reimbursement was offered as AF in such cases automatically rebook P PAX in the highest business class fare bucket “J”
As a matter of fact J full fare price on this route was much higher than my original ticket price issues in F bucket price
I confirmed that P lounge Acces was accessible
i have been automatically rebooked in J, same flight number, same day.
BUT be aware that no tarif difference reimbursement was offered as AF in such cases automatically rebook P PAX in the highest business class fare bucket “J”
As a matter of fact J full fare price on this route was much higher than my original ticket price issues in F bucket price
I confirmed that P lounge Acces was accessible
May 27, 2020, 1:33 am
#2889
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,044
Sorry I was maybe not specific enough : it happened with the switch to the summer season during which AF decided to operate this route without P.
In fact I’ve been rebooked weeks before the day of the flight.
i had a discounted F ticket (400€ penalty for change and cancelation).
i said AF that I cannot accept to flight in J with no reimbursement just because of the J bucket fare.
so AF proceed to the reimbursement or the F ticket without penalty and i had to do a full new booking in Business in a much cheaper price. As this was Weeks In advance I booked O bucket fare.
In fact I’ve been rebooked weeks before the day of the flight.
i had a discounted F ticket (400€ penalty for change and cancelation).
i said AF that I cannot accept to flight in J with no reimbursement just because of the J bucket fare.
so AF proceed to the reimbursement or the F ticket without penalty and i had to do a full new booking in Business in a much cheaper price. As this was Weeks In advance I booked O bucket fare.
May 27, 2020, 5:24 am
#2890
Join Date: Apr 2005
Programs: AF/KL FB Plat ; A3 Gold ; HH Gold ; IHG Plat Amb
Posts: 2,375
You should have accepted the involuntary downgrade to J without fare difference reimbursement... and claimed 75% of the ticket price for this segment as part of the EU261 regulations That would have been a cheap way to get business class and Premiere ground services 
That would have been a cheap way to get business class and Premiere ground services
May 27, 2020, 8:35 am
#2891
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hong Kong, France
Programs: FB , BA Gold
Posts: 15,545
Since the thread is moving from Ulti to P, I will throw my 2 cents.
The enthusiasm for flying will be seriously dampened for the coming year or two. Wealthy individuals who used to criss-cross the world for their pleasure will cut down their travels. Most companies suffer extensive financial problems and will cut on premium travel. Global trade and investment will not be on the rise in the coming years. Fancy company seminars and client conferences will diminish. I strongly doubt that the demand for F travel will be as large as before, at least for a long while.
AF, like other airlines is accumulating losses that are wiping out equity. F used to have 29 ac with F (19x4= 76 F seats on 77W and 10x9= 90 seats on A380), it is down to 19 ac. Unless a couple of other 77W have already started the process to be retrofitted with F, I don't think that AF will be in a financial position or desire to introduce F on additional ac. The motto for all airlines in the coming two years will be survival. Back in 2019, Ben Smith might have had the plan to keep La Premiere, which would require increasing the number of ac offering P. This is clearly not an urgent issue, but I doubt that the plan will stick. The only positive is that there will be quite a few iddle ac in the coming year(s) that could be retrofitted.
The enthusiasm for flying will be seriously dampened for the coming year or two. Wealthy individuals who used to criss-cross the world for their pleasure will cut down their travels. Most companies suffer extensive financial problems and will cut on premium travel. Global trade and investment will not be on the rise in the coming years. Fancy company seminars and client conferences will diminish. I strongly doubt that the demand for F travel will be as large as before, at least for a long while.
AF, like other airlines is accumulating losses that are wiping out equity. F used to have 29 ac with F (19x4= 76 F seats on 77W and 10x9= 90 seats on A380), it is down to 19 ac. Unless a couple of other 77W have already started the process to be retrofitted with F, I don't think that AF will be in a financial position or desire to introduce F on additional ac. The motto for all airlines in the coming two years will be survival. Back in 2019, Ben Smith might have had the plan to keep La Premiere, which would require increasing the number of ac offering P. This is clearly not an urgent issue, but I doubt that the plan will stick. The only positive is that there will be quite a few iddle ac in the coming year(s) that could be retrofitted.
May 27, 2020, 8:46 am
#2892
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Singapore
Programs: FB PFL, ALL Diamond, Marriott Ambassador, EK PLAT, Air Caraďbes Diam, SQ PPS, ̷IHG Diam
Posts: 97
Since the thread is moving from Ulti to P, I will throw my 2 cents.
The enthusiasm for flying will be seriously dampened for the coming year or two. Wealthy individuals who used to criss-cross the world for their pleasure will cut down their travels. Most companies suffer extensive financial problems and will cut on premium travel. Global trade and investment will not be on the rise in the coming years. Fancy company seminars and client conferences will diminish. I strongly doubt that the demand for F travel will be as large as before, at least for a long while.
AF, like other airlines is accumulating losses that are wiping out equity. F used to have 29 ac with F (19x4= 76 F seats on 77W and 10x9= 90 seats on A380), it is down to 19 ac. Unless a couple of other 77W have already started the process to be retrofitted with F, I don't think that AF will be in a financial position or desire to introduce F on additional ac. The motto for all airlines in the coming two years will be survival. Back in 2019, Ben Smith might have had the plan to keep La Premiere, which would require increasing the number of ac offering P. This is clearly not an urgent issue, but I doubt that the plan will stick. The only positive is that there will be quite a few iddle ac in the coming year(s) that could be retrofitted.
The enthusiasm for flying will be seriously dampened for the coming year or two. Wealthy individuals who used to criss-cross the world for their pleasure will cut down their travels. Most companies suffer extensive financial problems and will cut on premium travel. Global trade and investment will not be on the rise in the coming years. Fancy company seminars and client conferences will diminish. I strongly doubt that the demand for F travel will be as large as before, at least for a long while.
AF, like other airlines is accumulating losses that are wiping out equity. F used to have 29 ac with F (19x4= 76 F seats on 77W and 10x9= 90 seats on A380), it is down to 19 ac. Unless a couple of other 77W have already started the process to be retrofitted with F, I don't think that AF will be in a financial position or desire to introduce F on additional ac. The motto for all airlines in the coming two years will be survival. Back in 2019, Ben Smith might have had the plan to keep La Premiere, which would require increasing the number of ac offering P. This is clearly not an urgent issue, but I doubt that the plan will stick. The only positive is that there will be quite a few iddle ac in the coming year(s) that could be retrofitted.
May 27, 2020, 9:06 am
#2893
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,044
it depends how AF P class dependent of corporate is. If AF vast majority of PAX is high fortuned clients, the hit could be limited
May 27, 2020, 12:17 pm
#2894
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,909
I think we should continue the discussion about P in another thread and keep this thread for FB Ultimate topics. Could our moderators move the posts to another thread (existing or new) so we could continue the discussion there ?
May 28, 2020, 1:17 am
#2895
Join Date: Apr 2005
Programs: Eurostar Carte Blanche, SBB-CFF-FFS GA-AG, SNCF Grand Voyageur LeClub
Posts: 7,832
And if I may add a suggestion: do not merge it into the "some constructive criticism of Premiere" thread which has moved away from its original topic and become a dumping ground for all questions on Premiere, from some constructive criticism and benchmarks with other carriers to debate about how to replicate the coquillettes at home (and of course there is no debate that both question are of equally eminent importance). A new "Future of AF Premiere" thread would be good, we can discuss network, fleet, seats, ground offering but also how the transition phase with the A380 leaving will work... and every day someone can post a little prayer that P won't disappear.
Last edited by San Gottardo; May 28, 2020 at 1:43 am