New "Europe Classic Awards"
 

I didn't see this posted before (moderators, if I'm wrong, feel free to delete of course).
I received yesterday the AF-FB Amex newsletter and there was something regarding FB I was not aware of regarding a new Europe classic award scheme that will be introduced from tomorrow (06/10). To make it clear, it's not an Amex perk but a FB one.
Here's what they say :
"Réserver un billet prime sur le vol de votre choix à la dernière minute ou pendant les périodes de forte affluence peut s’avérer très difficile. Aussi, pour vous permettre de réserver plus facilement un billet prime en Classe Economique sur ses vols européens et domestiques, Air France vous propose à partir du 6 octobre une nouveauté : les Primes Europe Classic.

"En vous donnant accès à un plus grand nombre de sièges prime en Classe Economique sur les vols européens et domestiques d’Air France, les Primes Europe Classic augmentent vos chances de pouvoir réserver un billet prime à la date et l’horaire qui vous conviennent.

Pour 125% du montant de Miles-Prime d’un billet prime classique, les primes Europe Classic sont proposées à tous les membres Flying Blue sur les vols opérés par Air France.
A ce jour, KLM et les autres partenaires aériens ne proposent pas de Prime Europe Classic."

Quick translation : it will be easier to book award seats on AF European and domestic flights from oct 6, especially on peak travel dates and times, for 125% of number of miles needed for a classic award. KLM do not offer this (AF flights only).

So it's a kind of elite award system (extra inventory for 125% miles) but not reserved for elites (available to all). The name given is really confusing as they still use the "classic" name :confused:
Extra inventory is always welcome but we all know the poor value of miles redemption on European flights. It could be intesresting if we can have access to the busy flights (morning/evening weekdays) full of pax travelling for business but I doubt they will open many seats on such flights as they fill them easily with paying pax.

Interestingly, there is not a word about this on AF and FB web sites. It's only on Amex site.

Could it be part of the new T&C we heard were coming but nothing was announced yet ?

In my opinion intra-Europe awards are only useful/worthwhile if you have to do a one-way.

OP mentioned busy flights. I concur in doubting the availability of award seats on such flights.

New award booking class in Europe
 

October 13,

In order to provide additional supplies in Voyageur cabin on domestic flights in France and Europe Network AIR FRANCE, a new premium class of service is now available
It costs 25% more miles compared to Voyageur Classic.


Dates: Application for immediate bookings and travel.
Booking class: T
Name: Classic Europe Award
Areas where you can book this class:
- Domestic France
- From France to Europe and vice versa 1/2/3
- Europe and between Europe 1/2/3 1/2/3
This class can be used on flights to Europe and can not be booked for international flights to PrePost
All travel must be booked on T AF only


The cost of changes and cancellation of € 45 applies.
It can be offered to all customers Flying Blue (not Elite and Elite)
Reservations are made online and by phone

Amount of Miles:
Europe 1 to Europe 1 : 12500
Europe 1 to Europe 2 : 15625
Europe 2 to Europe 2: 15625
Europe 1 to Europe 3: 18750
Europe 2 Europe 3 to: 18750
Europe 3 to Europe 3: 18750

Fare Basis
TFB

I think it has been already mentionned some days ago.

My questions are :
- Does T open when X is zeroed or can both coexist?
- If so, is the introduction of T class lead to the reduction of X class?

It seems to me that this new class is just like the introduction of yield management within award tickets. We already know that RM decides to relase or not award seats but with this new class, the job of the RM might also decide to close X and open T, being both in Economy, just like they do with R, W, N, Y etc... for revenue tickets. Hence my first question.

I fear that in the future, there will be less X seats available, meaning that awards will simply cost more.

Sorry, will you mention the link?
It's a new information available today to TA.

Posted by Goldorak 09 days ago
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/flyin...y-06-10-a.html

Thank you for pointing that out.

Thanks Gajan !

They say "a higher number of seats" so obviously we will have : X+T>X

But will "new" X be the same number as "old" X?

damned, I am recognized :)
It's the official statement.

In view of AF's marketing lingo that sells everything as an enhancement, this could well just mean that T class offers you seats you would not have otherwise.

To put it in a formula, I think it does not imply more than

Xnew < Xnew + T.

In particular, it does not necessarily imply

Xold < Xnew + T.

Well, let's assume the current number of seats for a given flight is : X6

Now, will AF do?
1/ When the 6 six seats are taken (X0), RM opens T3
2/ The number of classic seats is reduced to (X3 for instance), and when all are gone (X0), RM opens T6

In both cases, the number of award seats indeed has increased (from 6 to 9) and the rule is "first-come, first-served". But with option 2, one pays the award at a higher price (both in average and marginally).

Also, I re-read my previous post. It makes no sense to have X and T available at the same time because as these classes have the same restrictions, non one would buy T if X is avaialble.

Both will be open at the same time, but as long as X's stock is gone, only T will be displayed online. Just as for the Elite awards...

Their management of award and classes is absurd. T is also a revenue bucket, there are flight with X wide open and T closed, and a few have X closed and T open. T is the cheapest booking class for fares without minimum stays, so pretty much sold out several days before departure, to force business travellers to buy more expensive fares. Moreover, T fares are quite cheap usually, around 100-200 EUR before taxes and surcharges... not a good value for a return trip!

Knowing AF, it necessarily implies that Xnew<Xold

let me precise that T is a new award class ant t-inventory is NOT linked to x-inventory. upon request, AF told me that we not have more than twice the number of award seats available. and the advantage of T-inventory is - it's restricted to FB members and not open to all other partners.

I see this as a huge advantage and real improvement compared to the situation we had before.

in T-class, compared with X-class, 30 days before the flight date; so availability for AF/KL members should be over 3 times the availability for members from other SkyTeam FFPs, for a small surcharge.

I fully agree ^, but would love to see it extended (in a more moderate fashion) to long-haul flights.

I am a bit confused as I received the following e-mail today:

Short translation:

Europe Classic awards are available on AF and KLM according to this message. The website states that Europe Classic awards are only available on AF.

Have I missed something?

Very strange indeed. The FB communication received and quoted in my initial post was saying "A ce jour, KLM et les autres partenaires aériens ne proposent pas de Prime Europe Classic.". Translation : as of today, KLM and other airline partners do not propose Europe classic awards. May be they changed their mind and implemented it for KLM also, which would be nice ?
FB web site still mentions AF only.

Update from Flying Blue: KLM has also implemented Europe Classic Awards
 

I have received a reply from Flying Blue that KLM have also implemented Europe Classic Awards. They will change the website a.s.a.p.

Gajan

warning from a SM member
 

Wow... this reeks of DL. That is the same way DL presented its case when they introduced the 3 tier award scheme. This has the potential to be quite an "enhancement".

Some points:

• SM had 2 tiers, just like FB. At one point instead of Low/High awards they introduced :-:Medium:-:.
• The introduction of a 3rd tier of awards sounded promising. They said that it would enhance availability. It hasn't. They said that only high-demand flights would have Med availability when Low won't be available, and only very few (around Xmas or during the Cannes festival, etc.) would be priced at High. This tuned out to be a lie.
• Only low DL awards are available to partner programs (sound familiar?), and only low partner awards are available to DL. Med and High awards can only be booked by SM members.
• Mileage requirements were subsequently increased for High awards.
• The end result: MAJOR devaluation of miles. Low awards are hard to come by; most awards are Med/High. Combining award levels (one segment Low + one segment Med) is a pain - the system ends up adding the segments instead of pricing O/D.

This was a major blow to SM members and this FB "enhancement" has the potential to screw things up big time. First just AF. Now KL too. Soon, the other FB airlines (KQ, RO). First just intra-EU flights. At some point this will be rolled out to all flights and you end up with a 3 tier model like DL. If I were a FB member I would be worried...

Thanks florin for posting this.

Since the beggining of that new enhancement, I am worried.

Unless I am mistaken there is no European programme that has that the number of miles needed for an award are divided into various zones unlike US programmes where it is more common.

I doubt they can make a significant change like that unless more competitors follow.

As far as I know, M&M doesn't have the double-priced FLEX awards either, and FB has had that for a while. So this hasn't stopped them before...


ETA: When DL introduced the 3-tier scheme, nobody had that in the US either (...and still, nobody else has it.)

Does anyone know the remaining Europe Classic Award Booking Classes (i.e. AF C, KL Y & KL C)?

I think it only applies to AF Y, not to business, not to KL.

I think this link is always right (with class T added)

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/flyin...-upgrades.html

Well, it definitely also applies to KL Y:

[KVS Availability Tool 6.9.8/Diamond - Amadeus: Awards/SkyTeam/FR-AF]
[KVS Availability Tool 6.9.8/Diamond - Amadeus: Awards/SkyTeam/FR-AF]