Air France fuel surcharge: $100 o/w

Old Aug 20, 05, 8:19 am
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Angry Air France fuel surcharge: $100 o/w

Got the notice from Air France at work few days ago and they say the fuel surcharge on trans-atlantic flight was supposed to be raised from USD45.00 to USD55.00 in each direction.

However, since Friday 19AUG, the Air France threw in a separate USD 55.00 charge, which makes the surcharge now USD100.00 in each direction.

****See below for my post****

Last edited by jimyvr; Aug 23, 05 at 12:44 pm
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Old Aug 20, 05, 8:48 am
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seems to be correct information, for a award ticket to MSP, they want 210 taxes and fuel surtaxe, now.
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Old Aug 21, 05, 4:30 pm
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Does this affect previously booked award reservations that have not flown yet?
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Old Aug 21, 05, 5:02 pm
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Originally Posted by atlas1126
Does this affect previously booked award reservations that have not flown yet?
no it doesn't. in this case you are safe. they can't ask you money ... hope at least they can't
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Old Aug 21, 05, 7:26 pm
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Originally Posted by chrissxb
no it doesn't. in this case you are safe. they can't ask you money ... hope at least they can't
Thankfully, "Z" class discounted J fares have to be purchased 50+ days out. Have confirmed reservations within that window.
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Old Aug 22, 05, 4:20 am
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Originally Posted by chrissxb
seems to be correct information, for a award ticket to MSP, they want 210 taxes and fuel surtaxe, now.
Well, I am not sure that it has already been implemented. Trying a revenue booking on the AF web site, I found the following results :
- 186 euros for taxes (of which 76 euros for the current official fuel surcharge on the transatlantic segments)
- 15 euros for transaction fee

which means that airport taxes on this 4 segment trip would amount to 110 euros, which is not surprising. (OTOH, 110 euros minus 110 USD for the airport taxes would not be possible !)

Does anyone have an update on the implementation date ?

Last edited by JOUY31; Aug 22, 05 at 4:24 am
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Old Aug 23, 05, 12:11 pm
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Originally Posted by jiml1126
Got the notice from Air France at work few days ago and they say the fuel surcharge on trans-atlantic flight was supposed to be raised from USD45.00 to USD55.00 in each direction.

However, since Friday 19AUG, the Air France threw in a separate USD 55.00 charge, which makes the surcharge now USD100.00 in each direction.

Please be aware such dramatic change.
Does anyone have any idea at all of the fuel bill for a fully-loaded 777-300 or 747 or an Airbus 340 (they'll each be very different, I know) for a single transatlantic journey such as JFK - CDG? I haven't a clue. Are we talking about $50,000 or $100,000 or $250,000 or what?
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Old Aug 23, 05, 12:36 pm
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Originally Posted by rangerss75
Does anyone have any idea at all of the fuel bill for a fully-loaded 777-300 or 747 or an Airbus 340 (they'll each be very different, I know) for a single transatlantic journey such as JFK - CDG? I haven't a clue. Are we talking about $50,000 or $100,000 or $250,000 or what?
Don't know the fuel price exactly. I do know that for this flight about 80,000 - 85,000 kgs of fuel is required.
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Old Aug 23, 05, 12:44 pm
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Air France has fixed the Fuel Surcharge on Sabre system.

So right now the correct fuel surcharge on AF USD55.00, EACH WAY.

But the 100.00 O/W thing existed for at least 3-4 days now.
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Old Aug 23, 05, 12:44 pm
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Originally Posted by rangerss75
Does anyone have any idea at all of the fuel bill for a fully-loaded 777-300 or 747 or an Airbus 340 (they'll each be very different, I know) for a single transatlantic journey such as JFK - CDG? I haven't a clue. Are we talking about $50,000 or $100,000 or $250,000 or what?
Well, despite general consens among writers that fuel will kill the airlines profits these days, at least the European airlines charge more than they pay more these days, even adding ( just theoretically ) the interest on pre paid contracts etc.

The cost of fuel is certainly different from station to station and especially country to country, the UK notoriously being the most expensive country in Europe...

However a big international airline like AF will get nice discounts. Gallon at JFK should run around $ 1.50 to 1.60 at the moment.AF should get a discount of 30-40 % of the sticker price, so may pay around 100 cents / per gallon, if they hedged their fuel there and I am sure they did, cause they pretty much know exactly their demand there, it is probably even less...

Do not have the time to look up the amount of fuel a 777 or 744 needs for the journey to CDG, but will update the thread later on...
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Old Aug 23, 05, 12:53 pm
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For the Jan-Mar 2005 quarter, the increase in fuel expenses by AFKL over the same period in 2004, excluding foreign exchange variation and volume increase, was 211 million euros, before hedging.

Gains from hedging accounted for 137 million euros.

The net increase in fuel expenses supported by AF was therefore 74 million euros for the quarter.

http://www.airfranceklm-finance.com...load.php?id=285

(slides 21 & 47)
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Old Aug 23, 05, 1:21 pm
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Originally Posted by JOUY31
For the Jan-Mar 2005 quarter, the increase in fuel expenses by AFKL over the same period in 2004, excluding foreign exchange variation and volume increase, was 211 million euros, before hedging.

Gains from hedging accounted for 137 million euros.

The net increase in fuel expenses supported by AF was therefore 74 million euros for the quarter.

http://www.airfranceklm-finance.com...load.php?id=285

(slides 21 & 47)
Since AF also offered 4.9 % more ASK in the same time period ( available seat kilometers ) it would be interesting to know, what the increase in fuel costs per ASK was, if there was any at all, the total number as pointed out in the report is not that important, at least as long as you offer more seat kilometers...

And additionally what did they make from the fuel surcharges....airlines are pretty good these days trying to explain the nasty surcharges
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Old Aug 23, 05, 1:33 pm
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Originally Posted by rangerss75
Does anyone have any idea at all of the fuel bill for a fully-loaded 777-300 or 747 or an Airbus 340 (they'll each be very different, I know) for a single transatlantic journey such as JFK - CDG? I haven't a clue. Are we talking about $50,000 or $100,000 or $250,000 or what?
Although I'm no expert, I believe that a transatlantic 777 trip is going to use roughly 60-65 tonnes of fuel. So using 65T, at the standard JET A1 density of 0.78kg/ltr, thats roughly 50,000ltrs. JET A1 here in London is about 45p/ltr as far as I am aware, so roughly $.80. This is of course a standard price, and airlines will of course have purchased their fuel at previously fixed prices, so are highly likely to be lower that this.

So a rough guess would be 50,000lts @ $.80 = $40,000

Does this sound right to anyone
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Old Aug 23, 05, 1:49 pm
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Well here we go, in a first attempt to answer to my own question, until Threy comes up with something more precise. Papa Hotel tells us that a journey such as JFK/CDG needs 80,000 to 85,000 kg of fuel, but he doesn't specify for which type of aircraft. 85,000 kg is 187,000 lbs and a gallon of aviation fuel (via a google search) weighs 6lbs, so 31,166 gallons are needed. Threy guesses that Air France would be paying around $1 a gallon at JFK. So thats $31,166 (lets say $32,000).

300 passengers on a 777-300 paying a surcharge of $55 each way will net $16,500 (or about half of the total cost of 32,000 gallons). 400 or 460 passengers on a 747 would bring in between $22,000 and $25,000.

Does all this sound reasonable? On this calculation, airline fares include the cost of fuel if it is running at half the present price. Any more than that has to be passed on via surcharges.
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Old Aug 23, 05, 1:54 pm
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Originally Posted by bhunwicks

Does this sound right to anyone
Thanks, bhunwicks. Quite different figures from my guesswork.

You can see what I'm getting at. But I guess the calculation needs someone who knows a lot more than I do.
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