onlysuites

I am a KLM Elite member and i expect to hit their top tier of membership next month on a trip to Asia.
I cant seem to find any info at all on Air France's membership levels and what benefits they come with?

I would love some information on what benefits i can expect with Air France once the get together goes ahead!

What is their upgrade policy like?

If i travel with KLM to east asia and back i gain enough miles for a upgrade to USA or a free flight within Europe is that the case with Air France?

What about confirmed upgrades within USA like KLM offers its Platinum Elites. Does AF partners do the same?

How many miles do you get for a flight from Paris to NY? Any how many do you need to upgrade to Business?

Air france has three classes on all Long distance or do some have two?

Thanks

dctorres

Welcome to FlyerTalk and the AF forum. We look forward to your participation.

My best advice is to first do a search in this forum for Frequence Plus Rouge, which should give you a rundown of benefits. There has even been a few threads in the past week or two on this.

However, in terms of benefits, I think those listed on the SkyTeam web site will most be of interest to you (as I understand it, KLM will be part of SkyTeam in March? 2004).

Sadly, AF may be on the only major carriers not to offer upgrades to its upper tier elites. Generally speaking, if a flight it oversold, top tiers might get upgraded (but we've seen examples where AF has given them to DL elites).

Yes, flying to Asia and back should get you a roundtrip ticket in Europe or an upgrade to the US (25k).

Some routes have a 2 class system, others a 3 class system. There is a recent thread on the upcoming biz/1st class overhauls.

I don't remember how many miles there are to NYC, I think there is a mileage counter on the AF web site. However, you need 25k to upgrade -- but only from a full-fare economy ticket. AF will only upgrade this fare, though I've heard stories of K fares being upgraded.

Hope this helps.

NickW

As opposed to, say for example, BA? I think the concept of unpaid upgrades for elites is the exception rather than the rule for European carriers!

dctorres

[quote]<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by NickW:
[b] As opposed to, say for

onlysuites

Yeah i think we are lucky in that case. Although CO have changed their rules and cheap buckets tickets only get 50% now. I have read in a few forums that NW might follow suit. Hopefully KLM doesn't follow that line as i travel 99% on bucket tickets.

Steve Fenton

I think it is Star\Alliance here we come as the AF programme is so far behind the times it brings water to my eyes.

The world travel market has seen enormous pressure applied to anyone who has to travel with work.

Mileage programmes have to take this into account otherwise the foundation of the business will walk.

Choice of carrier now is bigger than it ever was and the flyer can be better informed today thanks to the internet.

If an airline wants a frequent flyer then they should simply say fly with us and you will get miles. However, if you employ marketing people who often live in La La land and only think the bull they write is what really happens on a day to day basis, then Asta la vista baby.

Add to a basically awful FF programme, the typically confusing manner which AF run it and then get passengers to use the CDG hub, then I think you will see people walking away.

Or is it me ?

dctorres

I'm not sure -- what exactly is your complaint about the AF FF programme? (Not much time to research your past posts...)

onlysuites

Very well said. A frequent flyer should be someone who flies the airline regularly and it shouldnt matter what ticket he is holding.

I fly for pleasure all of the time and i travel quite a lot. I am going to hit KLM Platinum Elite status and that comes at 75,000 miles, which is quite a lot. Now if i go to the travel agent i am not going to ask for the most expensive Economy ticket which is around £1000 quid to the far east just so i can get extra miles. I am going to get the cheapest ticket which is ually half the price.
KLM have been good to me by giving me points even when i fly on Bucket tickets and i have showed them loyalty back by only flying them! Which i wouldnt have done if they didnt give miles on Bucket seats.

Another thing i dont understand is how BA and AF will only upgrade a High Fare. That doesnt make any sense as you can get a return trip in Business to NY with BA for 1,200 return from a Bucket shop. And a full priced Economy ticket will be around £600+ and that will only upgrade you one class to their Premium Economy! And if you get a full priced Premium Econ ticket, i am sure that will cost around the £1,000 mark. So why waste points upgrading, might aswell buy a cheap Business ticket? Doesnt make sense to me!

Am i right in thinking that this is true?
I hope flying dutchman goes on for a long while yet.

JOUY31

DL, CO, AA and BA at least, to my knowledge, treat you according to the fare you pay, either by diminishing the benefits (and/or the speed at which you reach higher status) when flying on a discounted fare, or enhancing your benefits (and/or speeding up the way you reach higher status) when you fly on full fare.

The DL and CO boards will provide you with much more information and comments on this topic.


[This message has been edited by JOUY31 (edited 10-21-2003).]

Steve Fenton

Just wasted a lot of time on AF. Trying to book flights on the website is a joke. It is loaded to make sure they sting you for maximum fare in every way. Then it will not let you book and referes you to the sales #. They of course quote you fares that are stupid money.

They seem to think that as you want to travel next week you will pay a fortune. The website was quoting £120 + tax for the fare I wanted. When I went to book it, it was £377 + tax. I then went on Kelkoo ad got the same fare for £129 inc tax.

I have been chasing the FP office in London for flights still not credited over the last 12 months with partner airlines.With KLM now you see your account within days showing the flights you have made. Since March I have made 43 flights with KLM and all have been posted within 5 days max.

If an airline wants FF's they better wake up and look around, corporate travel budgets carry no fat and its down to the individual in many cases to book his or her own flights at the best price.

If I ever caught any of my staff booking flights to make sure they got miles I would fire them on the spot. I would also deduct what I calculated as the money the have wasted from their final pay cheque.

I think if KLM adopt these stupid ways of running a FF programme it will be a big burn up for me and off to Star Alliance

dctorres

I have not had the same experience. I had no troubles booking a return ticket to the US on the AF web site, with the stipulation that it be a Deeply Discounted ticket (Guess what? Getting full miles for it too. Wouldn't happen on DL, AA or CO). They didn't gouge me with the highest price - in fact, it gave me the lowest fares -- I couldn't book a full-fare economy ticket.

As for the mileage credit, you are comparing apples and oranges -- almost every flight I've had on AF this year was credited within 2 days. The one or two that didn't was credited within 5 days once I faxed my receipt and boarding pass. In fact, AF will allow you to call in with this information and have it credited almost immediately.
In your case, it was with partner airlines. The delays, though not 12 months is to be expected. It usually takes 5-7 days to be credited. However, I have had similar, indeed longer, delays on patner airlines when crediting AF to those accounts.

12 months is ineed a long time and unacceptable. Have you sent your boarding passes and ticket receipts to FP in Paris or just to London?

NickB

But it would on KL, and with a 125% bonus to boot if you are top elite and 100% if mid-rank.
On the basic point, though, I agree with you. The AF website is by no means the best around, but it is not the nightmare that Steve depicts. This being said, it could do with improvements and so could the site as a whole. Facilities for Frequent flyers are virtually non-existent on the site: you can see the balance of your account and change your number (not even your address) and that's it.

THis is true, but KL is hardly an example of exemplary efficiency here either. OK as long as it is a core partner, but more problematic with the minor ones. I have NEVER had a KL-coded DUB-AMS flight post spontaneously. I always have to go via the retroactive route, and sometimes have to insist because KL have lost what I sent them, etc...

NickB

As an aside, why do people get so worked up about the airline's own flight booking engines on their website? There is a plethora of third-party booking sites that are miles better than any airline's own. I can see the point when the airline website has special fares unavailable elsewhere or a bonus for booking online, but neither of these applies to AF currently. In theory, it should with 'A La Carte', but I have not yet noticed massive savings to be had through this.

dctorres

AF will also give you the elite bonuses on deeply discounted tickets (which is why I put almost everything on AF instead of DL).

onlysuites

So elites get Miles on all ticket types?