sighos999

Hey all,

I had plenty of options to book business on an A380 from NYC to CDG, but opted for the 777 flying into ORY. Problem is I have a connection at CDG to Athens (12:30pm) 3.5 hours after landing at ORY (9:00am). I'm not checking bags. You think this transfer is doable?

I've never been to CDG or ORY. After reading a few messages in different places, the reviews on this transfer in such a short window are mixed. Should I bite the bullet and switch to the A380 flight direct to CDG? Or will I be fine at that time of day (again, 9:00am) making it to CDG in 3.5 hours?

San Gottardo

Hmm, let’s play this through. I assume you do not have.a passport from one of the EEA countries or Switzerland, right?

Arrive on the stand at 9am in ORY. At ORY, the JFK flight often (for me so far, always) gets deplaned by bus. Which means that you‘ll be at the terminal building around 9.20am.

Then, without EEA/SUI passport you‘ll stand in line which moves a little slower, say 20 minutes. So you‘re through immigration around 9.40am.

Let‘s assume you won‘t make the 9.45am bus, either because immigration takes a little longer or because you have luggage. So you take the 10.05am one.

The website says that travel time is 1h15 minutes. This is where it gets tricky. It may indeed be a bit more than an hour, for instance if you are making the transfer during the summer vacation months. Otherwise I would assume 1h45, just to be on the safe side and account for traffic (which can be horrible, although that time of the day is not the ultra-worst), for the bus not stopping at your terminal first, etc. That would get you to CDG 2F shortly before 12noon.

You could alternatively take a taxi, which will speed up the trip a bit, especially if you have a good driver. Even then, with lots of traffic, assume 1h30 just to be on the safe side (could be as little as 50 minutes if you are traveling during a slow month).

So you‘re at the counters of 2F at 12noon. If you have luggage, that is just about a bit too late, check-in for your 12.30pm departure closes at 11.50am. If you don‘t have luggage, you‘re fine. The 30 minutes before departure are sufficient to go through security and to your gate, even for a 5 minute stop at the lounge.

Thus: it‘s doable, but there are a number of unknowns in there that make all the difference: travel time/traffic situation between ORY and CDG, and whether you have luggage or not. Other things make take more/less time, such as immigration on arrival. And: bear in mind that the JFK-ORY flight might be delayed. It usually isn‘t, but you never know.

If the reason why you book this connection is because you want to go from JFK to ATH on a one-stop connection rather than on the non-stop DL flight, then you might consider another airport that is more pleasant for connection: Amsterdam, Munich, Zurich, Geneva.

If you are fine with Paris, but want the BEST business class seats, you may want to take any of the non-A380 flights (the first and the last one from JFK are on 777/789).

mlin32

I think the OP is talking about in reverse: Arriving at ORY but going to CDG for the correspondance to ATH.

Regardless I think it is doable, but does depend on a few variables not going wrong (traffic in Paris, the queue not being too bad upon arrival at CDG).

Zarmakuizz

It would be less stressful to stay at the same airport. As San Gottardo highlighted, even though it should be doable, many ifs can make you miss your connection. Summer times are even more unpredictable.
Meanwhile, staying 3 hours at the airport, you would have plenty of time to take a well deserved shower at the lounge.

San Gottardo

The reverse of what?

thibderoc

If OP wants to fly to ORY with 777 only to avoid the A380 NEV seats, I'd really advise not to do that.

Yes, BEST seat are far more comfortable than NEV seats.
Yes, NEV seats are not the industry standard.
But NEV seats are not a nightmare and I consider it to still be a comfortable way to cross the atlantic.

The small discomfort of NEV seats is nothing compared to spending one hour and a half in a bus between ORY and CDG (tip : you won't even see the Eiffel Tower in between), in a very tight cramped seat.

San Gottardo

+1

Especially since there are other airlines that have seats and service at least as good as Air France and that you also get you to Athens. Delta on the nonstop flight has fully reclinable seats, and so does Swiss via ZRH or GVA, and also Alitalia via FCO. None of these are substantial detours.

Klems

In my opinion it's just too short. As others mentioned it could be doable if 1/your flight is not delayed at all, 2/the lines are short, and 3/traffic is light but that's a LOT to hope for. I personally wouldn't do it because I would spend my entire travel time being stressed. Is there a later flight to Athens leaving from CDG? I think just an extra hour would make a world of difference for peace of mind. You could also chose to leave on a 777 that leaves NYC earlier if you can still change it, or take a Transavia flight to ATH from ORY (there is one leaving early afternoon I believe).

sighos999

Thanks for all of the helpful comments. A few points:
- Yes, on US passport
- Travel is next month
- I redeemed miles for the flight, so options are limited (particularly directly to Athens).
- I've never flown business on either of these, so comments about the experiences (specifically on the A380) are much appreciated
- I'm not familiar with Paris traffic, especially after 9:00am, which is my biggest concern. I imagine immigration on a Thursday morning isn't too bad. But that traffic on a business day....

Thanks, again. I'll let you all know what I decide.

thibderoc

If you've never been in Business in Air France, I can assure you that even with the A380, you'll have a perfectly fine experience.

Do get fooled by the bad comments on the A380 busines class seat of Air France : unless you are an experienced business class traveler, you'll be very happy to be on the upper deck of the Air France A380, with a seat much much better and bigger than in economy.

brunos

Tastes differ across passengers.
If you have never flown business longhaul on any airline, you will find the A380 seats nice.
if you are used to business on other airlines, you might find NEV very poor. Admittedly JFK-ORY is a very short flight. But personally I would never run the risk of NEV3 on a long flight as I am sure to have back problem with feet being quite low and my back bent.

If you fly in August, especially in the first two weeks of August, traffic will be very light and after 10am you could make it in less than an hour. However, you are always exosed to the risk of an accident on the freeway or its closure for works (often happens in August).

With business class priority, you should go through immigration reasonably fast. However, there might be other big birds landing at same time.

sighos999

Full disclosure, I just play the general points/miles game and have flown various business products. I'm pretty partial to the "pod" type seats (think transcon AA, JetBlue Mint, Delta One). I just don't want the A380 seats to be like a domestic first class (a wide leather seat, leg room, meals/drinks, but nothing special), especially on such a long flight. It sounds like that's not the case, so maybe the A380 (with no rushing at ORY/CDG) is the way to go.

Gig103

What you describe as your fear (a domestic First seat) sounds more like premium economy. Full disclosure I haven't flown the A380, but have checked out multiple videos on it and would take the paired seating and angle-flat over the airport transfer, personally. You still don't have anyone reclining into your space, and you get a business-class service

ijgordon

The "angled flat" seats were pretty much the industry standard for business class for the period about 5-12 years ago (though some airlines had full flat beds ~10-12 years ago). They were a big improvement from the prior generation of recliner seats -- but we're still talking about 50-60" pitch deep recliner/"cradle" seats, not the 38" domestic US seats.

That said, some people never liked the angle-flats, and claimed they would slide down in their sleep. IME, if you're a back sleeper, you may be better off only reclining ~90% of the way, which will be a slight "Z" shape and keep your butt in place. If you're a side or front sleeper, go all the way.

Personally, I sleep okay on angled flats (with Ambien of course!), but I don't like having a seatmate and there's a lack of storage in the seat area (you can't have a bag at your feet, because your feet essentially go under the seat in front of you when fully reclined). For day flights they're very comfortable but the storage issue is more acute since I'd be wanting to access things.

I would probably suck up the angled flat rather than doing a ORY-CDG shuffle. But since I've never done it, I should ask - is the RER (line B) a reasonable way to connect between the airports?

carnarvon

To be exact, the NEV4 is not angled flat, unlike the NEV3. It cannot make a Z shape.

​Its design is quite unique.

​​​​​The moving area of the seat consist in two cushions (for the bottom and for the back).

They slide so that the bottom supporting cushion reaches the shelf located in a box inside the back of the seat in front. This makes a flat and horizontal (not angled) area.

The cushion supporting the back makes a slight angle with the horizontal area.

A bit like in a bed with a pillow in the back, or in an electric hospital bed where your back is lifted up so you are able reach the dining table. Or a comfort armchair at the beach or swimming pool.