What will be JOON's first [last] routes?

Old Nov 27, 2017, 4:00 pm
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JOON is definitely an AIR FRANCE child.

They haven't even started flying and already the first strikes are announced: http://www.air-journal.fr/2017-11-27...l-5191123.html
tff and Carel1 like this.
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Old Nov 27, 2017, 4:11 pm
  #92  
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Originally Posted by San Gottardo
JOON is definitely an AIR FRANCE child.

They haven't even started flying and already the first strikes are announced: http://www.air-journal.fr/2017-11-27...l-5191123.html
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Old Nov 29, 2017, 3:38 pm
  #93  
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Uneventful quick return flight to TXL in Economy. On the way back, I was offered a second whisky by a courteous PNC. I suppose next week, I will have to pay for the alcoholic drinks and get used to the sneakers
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Old Nov 30, 2017, 2:43 am
  #94  
 
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New routes for Joon (link in French)

https://www.boursier.com/actions/act...8.html?sitemap
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Old Nov 30, 2017, 4:15 am
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Originally Posted by LY777
New routes for Joon (link in French)

https://www.boursier.com/actions/act...8.html?sitemap
This is a nightmare. Be ready to see all the medium haul network transferred to Joon. FCO and IST? This is ridiculous.
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Old Nov 30, 2017, 4:31 am
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Originally Posted by olivedel
This is a nightmare. Be ready to see all the medium haul network transferred to Joon. FCO and IST? This is ridiculous.
Is there a difference regarding the service in Y between AF and Joon?
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Old Nov 30, 2017, 6:17 am
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I noticed a few weeks ago on an upcoming trip to OSL that the E190 was swapped with an A320... now I better understand.
Btw now it is even an A321 (flight in May 18).
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Old Nov 30, 2017, 7:33 am
  #98  
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Originally Posted by olivedel
This is a nightmare. Be ready to see all the medium haul network transferred to Joon. FCO and IST? This is ridiculous.
The fully flexible CDG-TXL return flights in Business is still around EUR 1,374. Not much of an improvement, if any.
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Old Nov 30, 2017, 1:40 pm
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Originally Posted by JOUY31
The fully flexible CDG-TXL return flights in Business is still around EUR 1,374. Not much of an improvement, if any.
Form my understanding, only Y will be cheaper on JOON. In Y you will ha e to pay extra for all sorts of things. J is supposed to be pretty much the same kind of pricing and all inclusive service as on AF (in NEV4 for now...)

So basicall, from my understanding, JOON wants to be LCC in Y and business as usual in J.
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Old Nov 30, 2017, 5:55 pm
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Joon to IST, grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!

Here is my question though, currently this season AF is only flying 1x to IST for the first time ever. They are supposed to go back to 2 or 3x next summer. Are all flights going to be Joon, or just one? What about the stinky ATlas Global codeshares? How do they fit it?

This is another blow to Skyteam at IST. You know its "funny" When DL pulled out of IST 2 years ago, their standard line was, but you have all these other Skyteam partners you can fly, AF, KL, AZ, and at that time AF was 3x (4 in the past), KL 2x (3 in the past), AZ up to 3x (4x in the past) between FCO and MXP.

Now there is no Delta, AF and KL are down to a flight each per day (yes KL has a Pegasus codeshare out of SAW, did it once never again) and the Atlas Global codeshare (better than Pegasus but still subpar) and AZ currently does not exist out of IST (rumours that they will bring FCO back next summer..... there may not even be an AZ at that point). The Skyteam who was Americas bound, had a peak of 12 flights a day to choose from that could generally connect them to many flights to every destination in North America, in some cases like JFK, with anyone of a dozen options. Now there are 2 options (Atlas being a poor third) that miss decent connections to most North American cities, and one is going to Joon??!! Are they insane?
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Old Nov 30, 2017, 6:42 pm
  #101  
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Originally Posted by hfly
This is another blow to Skyteam at IST. You know its "funny" When DL pulled out of IST 2 years ago, their standard line was, but you have all these other Skyteam partners you can fly, AF, KL, AZ, and at that time AF was 3x (4 in the past), KL 2x (3 in the past), AZ up to 3x (4x in the past) between FCO and MXP.
It is not just ST. It is pretty much all European carriers which have substantially reduced service to Turkey. Europe-Turkey routes are heavily dominated by TK these days.
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Old Nov 30, 2017, 7:04 pm
  #102  
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Trust me Nick, I am very aware of this. But I would have thought that the ST carriers could have at least put up a bit of a fight. We are now going from all these options to essentially an LCC (oh sorry, I meant Millenial) option, which is sure to exacerbate the situation especially specifically IST-CDG has not been under a LCC onslaught, which was supposed to be the raison d'etre of Joon.
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Old Nov 30, 2017, 7:23 pm
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Originally Posted by hfly
Trust me Nick, I am very aware of this.
I do not doubt this for a nano-second.
But I would have thought that the ST carriers could have at least put up a bit of a fight.
I think that it would be surprising for an airline to invest in a route where it and all its peers are struggling to make money. These are typically the kind of routes that will receive the least love from the airline.
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Old Nov 30, 2017, 8:25 pm
  #104  
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Look, IST was/is seemingly a disaster for Skyteam. It was the second place with a Skyteam lounge after LHR and at its peak there were believe it or not up to 25 Skyteam flights a day!

Peak:
Aeroflot: 2 [] 2
Air France: 4 (5 at the very peak with that weird short lived Toulouse flight) [] 1 per day, add a half for the AF pax on the Atlas flights
Alitalia: 4 [] 0
China Southern: 1 [] 0
Czech Airlines:1 [] 0
Delta Airlines: 1 [] 0
Kenya Airlines: 1 [] 0 -although in fairness IIRC that route ended just before the lounge opened.
KLM: 3 [] 1
Korean Air: 1 [] 1
MEA: 2 [] 1
Saudia: 4 [] Probably 4 or 5 Saudia has a bunch of weird ones coming and going and on different days besides Riyadh and Jeddah, so they are possibly the only ones that have increased.
Tarom: 1-2 [] 1-2

So from as many as 25-26 a day down to maybe 12 on a good day.

Now with Joon, watch them close the Skyteam lounge and use a contract lounge................
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Old Nov 30, 2017, 8:26 pm
  #105  
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Originally Posted by Zembla
Form my understanding, only Y will be cheaper on JOON. In Y you will ha e to pay extra for all sorts of things. J is supposed to be pretty much the same kind of pricing and all inclusive service as on AF (in NEV4 for now...)

So basicall, from my understanding, JOON wants to be LCC in Y and business as usual in J.
The majority of European J pax are pax connecting to a longhaul J flight in CDG. Given that Joon will fly many important feeder cities, they need to keep J.
A few years ago, there were a lot of brainstorming at AF whether they would discontinue European J. The "European" team saw it as a loss-making product, but the "longhaul" team wanted to keep it. The answer was obvious.
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