New long-haul Affaires product unveiled on Sept 21st 2010!
Sep 21, 2010, 4:22 am
#31
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The pictures available under the "download the photos" link are actually way more informative than the text.
And it's all bad news: same layout, same general design. The only difference it seems is a footrest integrated in what formerly was the cubbyhole in which the bottom end of the seat used to sit when reclined. Plus of course a 16/9 screen.
I find it ridiculous that they would even dare calling it a new product, as it merely seems like yet another NEV version to me. The allegedly "improved controls" actually only feature two buttons, like a 90s TGV. Up and down. Gone is the possibility to control your back and legs inclinations separately.
Also, not that I care, but after reading so much marketing crap about it, I find it funny that they don't explain why it is a benefit for their customers to have gotten rid of the massage function.
The more I look at it, the more it looks like they actually devised another cost-cutting measure and are yet again trying to pass it as a customer experience improvement.
I guess I should give them the benefit of the doubt and wait until I get to try this new seat out, but the pictures really leave little room for doubt IMO.
And it's all bad news: same layout, same general design. The only difference it seems is a footrest integrated in what formerly was the cubbyhole in which the bottom end of the seat used to sit when reclined. Plus of course a 16/9 screen.
I find it ridiculous that they would even dare calling it a new product, as it merely seems like yet another NEV version to me. The allegedly "improved controls" actually only feature two buttons, like a 90s TGV. Up and down. Gone is the possibility to control your back and legs inclinations separately.
Also, not that I care, but after reading so much marketing crap about it, I find it funny that they don't explain why it is a benefit for their customers to have gotten rid of the massage function.
The more I look at it, the more it looks like they actually devised another cost-cutting measure and are yet again trying to pass it as a customer experience improvement.
I guess I should give them the benefit of the doubt and wait until I get to try this new seat out, but the pictures really leave little room for doubt IMO.
Fully agree. The whole thing is a joke...
Sep 21, 2010, 4:25 am
#32
Join Date: Mar 2007
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PDF
Also download the pdf for your daily dose of aggravating AF marketing BS.
To be fair, they do call it a "near-horizontal" bed, so they are honest on one front. But the usual crap about how ergonomic's specialists helped design the seat or the priceless "The cabin crew are never very far away to make passengers real espresso coffee" really do make one wonder how stupid they think their FFs are.
Again, so !!
To be fair, they do call it a "near-horizontal" bed, so they are honest on one front. But the usual crap about how ergonomic's specialists helped design the seat or the priceless "The cabin crew are never very far away to make passengers real espresso coffee" really do make one wonder how stupid they think their FFs are.
Again, so
!!
Sep 21, 2010, 4:25 am
#33
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Sep 21, 2010, 4:31 am
#34
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Sep 21, 2010, 4:41 am
#35
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As the A380 is such a relatively new plane, why on earth didn't AF fit new chairs from day one instead of waiting a few year and get the whole thing retro-fitted? Was it because of the delay of the arrival of the initial A380?
OT: And why doesn't the A380 have an Y+ cabin?
OT: And why doesn't the A380 have an Y+ cabin?
As regards putting this new J seat from the start, I guess it's a combination of a) further delays by altering the original order, and b) the new J seats had not been selected/chosen/decided on, and consequently were not ready to be installed, last year.
Sep 21, 2010, 5:00 am
#36
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It will be very nice when LX has it's entire fleet (for me, especially ZHR-NBO) with flat seats. With IB I will take advantage perhaps when the BA merger is completed and they update their routes. As for VS, they don't fly to Europe so I can never, and have never tried their biz seats.
Sep 21, 2010, 5:12 am
#37
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Very disapointing.
I love the appelation "near flat" on one of the photos.
When they started installing their lie-flat numerous years ago, they already claimed that it was 2 meters long. Of course, as you get your feet under the head of the guy in front of you... Actually standing up also gets you more than 2 meters.
Pictures leave little room for doubt. Sad, sad, sad.
I love the appelation "near flat" on one of the photos.
When they started installing their lie-flat numerous years ago, they already claimed that it was 2 meters long. Of course, as you get your feet under the head of the guy in front of you... Actually standing up also gets you more than 2 meters.
Pictures leave little room for doubt. Sad, sad, sad.
Sep 21, 2010, 6:47 am
#41
Join Date: Apr 2005
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I am not joking or making one of my usual slightly caustic statements, but when I skimmed over the brochure just very briefly because I didn't have more time I saw those seats but continued browsing, thinking those were the old seats that were shown for comparison.
Only later did I realize that these were the new seats.
I find this extremely disappointing. I did have some hopes that after sort of LCCing its domestic/European product but at the same time making some improvements to its longhaul P and J classes AF was going to make a big leap forward to firmly establish itself among at least the leading European carriers.
However, what we have seen here is an extremely timid re-hash of the same ole seat - basically this is NEV 4 - and no other novelties or improvements to the longhaul J product. And no, I do not take the marketing bla bla on renovated lounges and changes to catering as a novelty. It is precisely that: a renovation, i.e. the same thing at the core just face-lifted a bit. Just like the seat. Nothing new, just slightly face-lifted.
If AF spends EUR 110 MM on this then I am afraid that I have to find this a big waste. It moves AF to a level that already today is no longer up to date, but with the money spent this offering will stick around until approx. 2016-2017. By when this seat will not only be yesterday's seat - which is what it is today - but a couple of generations behind what others offer.
I cannot find words for how disappointed I am about this missed opportunity to do something revolutionary but instead doing something which is a nice but almost unnoticeable "enhancement".
Sorry AF, I still try to like you a lot, but now you've lost me.
LX serves NBO with the A330-300 since some months (I believe since around Easter this year?). The A333 has the new F and J classes since delivery and reviews are mostly positive.
Only later did I realize that these were the new seats.
I find this extremely disappointing. I did have some hopes that after sort of LCCing its domestic/European product but at the same time making some improvements to its longhaul P and J classes AF was going to make a big leap forward to firmly establish itself among at least the leading European carriers.
However, what we have seen here is an extremely timid re-hash of the same ole seat - basically this is NEV 4 - and no other novelties or improvements to the longhaul J product. And no, I do not take the marketing bla bla on renovated lounges and changes to catering as a novelty. It is precisely that: a renovation, i.e. the same thing at the core just face-lifted a bit. Just like the seat. Nothing new, just slightly face-lifted.
If AF spends EUR 110 MM on this then I am afraid that I have to find this a big waste. It moves AF to a level that already today is no longer up to date, but with the money spent this offering will stick around until approx. 2016-2017. By when this seat will not only be yesterday's seat - which is what it is today - but a couple of generations behind what others offer.
I cannot find words for how disappointed I am about this missed opportunity to do something revolutionary but instead doing something which is a nice but almost unnoticeable "enhancement".
Sorry AF, I still try to like you a lot, but now you've lost me.
LX serves NBO with the A330-300 since some months (I believe since around Easter this year?). The A333 has the new F and J classes since delivery and reviews are mostly positive.
Sep 21, 2010, 6:55 am
#42
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What a complete waste of money I'd rather they kept their millions and left us with the old seats. It was annoying that the old seats were not fully flat but comparatively it was less annoying than a 'new' seat which completely ignores the trend in the industry. If I were an AF share holder I would be seriously questioning the waste of company money on such a non-event at a time of financial difficulties...
I'd rather they kept their millions and left us with the old seats. It was annoying that the old seats were not fully flat but comparatively it was less annoying than a 'new' seat which completely ignores the trend in the industry. If I were an AF share holder I would be seriously questioning the waste of company money on such a non-event at a time of financial difficulties...
Sep 21, 2010, 7:01 am
#43
Join Date: Jan 2004
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At €110m AF is being robbed blind (if it is true) for a seat that is already VERY outdated. Mind you I am not surprised. AF is allergic to product development as this hilarious attempt at PR spin shows. Even the US carriers are ahead on this. The competition must be laughing their you know whats off!!
Sep 21, 2010, 7:14 am
#44
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 1,589
Af New Business Class - No Flat Seat
AF previewed their new business class on Facebook. Hard product barely changed, same seat, angled not horizontal, with tweakings such as larger TV, footrest access for disabled people...
Apparently they are also improving the check in, the food and the bar (with a fridge).
Some good steps but the seat, although already good, still lags a large part of competition...
Apparently they are also improving the check in, the food and the bar (with a fridge).
Some good steps but the seat, although already good, still lags a large part of competition...
Sep 21, 2010, 7:24 am
#45
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eh? NEV4? 
I truely can't make anything else of this.
No doubt the seats have evolved into something more comfy and more practical with a better sleeping position...but...the competition is in another universe I think?
Who knows, maybe it is a miracle seat and once we sit/sleep in it we'll go WOW. But from what I can see so far: NEV4
I truely can't make anything else of this.
No doubt the seats have evolved into something more comfy and more practical with a better sleeping position...but...the competition is in another universe I think?
Who knows, maybe it is a miracle seat and once we sit/sleep in it we'll go WOW. But from what I can see so far: NEV4