US seat sale to LHR

Old Aug 5, 07, 12:26 pm
  #1  
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US seat sale to LHR

Saw an ad on priceline.com for a sale at Air Canada for prices starting at $394 rt from US cities to LHR. When I try to book on AC.com, I am getting prices of $197 rt ++ comes out to about $500 with tax. This is in US pricing, $209 cad was the starting price, about $550 cad all in. ITA says $215 cad each way plus tax for these dates. I was checking DTW DCA ORD in November, there is other availability before and after that as well at varying prices.

By the way, the fares are in N class, in fact it is the only fare offered under the "economy- lowest price" tab, it says it earns 100% status miles on the fare page but, this is obviously a gray area. I would book it if I knew I would earn miles. I did not post as a mileage run deal for this reason as well, its not that great a deal in my opinion without the miles.
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Old Aug 5, 07, 8:38 pm
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This is nothing new, it is a regular base pricing from many US east coast cities. Fuel surcharges add about another $150, whle UK government tacks on another $100+. These fares have been posted about hundreds of times when somebody else "discovers" them.
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Old Aug 5, 07, 10:24 pm
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Originally Posted by Shareholder View Post
This is nothing new, it is a regular base pricing from many US east coast cities. Fuel surcharges add about another $150, whle UK government tacks on another $100+. These fares have been posted about hundreds of times when somebody else "discovers" them.
Thanks for the heads up, sorry about the noob mistake! I am not sure what you mean about the fuel surcharge and UK fee, I included that when I said "all in" $550 cad. Were you adding this to the $197?

I don't understand if they have these rates all the time why do they advertise worse rates than this. The way they advertise is one way before tax and surcharge so this is $98.50 US each way before tax and surcharge? for a flight to LHR?? I don't remember seeing fares like this. Is this common for all carriers?

Sorry for the noob questions, I do appreciate any wisdom you can pass on.
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Old Aug 5, 07, 11:10 pm
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Quite often the fares ex-USA are cheaper than ex-Canada.
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Old Aug 6, 07, 12:04 pm
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ITA Glitch?

Originally Posted by Rejuvenated View Post
Quite often the fares ex-USA are cheaper than ex-Canada.
I guess I didn't expect them to be that much cheaper. What I don't understand is no matter what the actual price is, why doesn't ITA see the regular base pricing as the round trip price instead of one-way? Travelocity and Expedia show the ITA price, which as I said originally is roughly double the base fare on AC.com. Why would anyone buy a ticket from Travelocity or Expedia when they can get a ticket for roughly half the price before taxes and surcharges from AC.com with regular base pricing?

One example of what I am seeing (in USD): Nov 13-20 DTW-LHR AC.com $517.54 (all in) and the cheapest on Travelocity on any airline for the same dates is $685.20 (all in). Not a huge difference on this one example, its roughly half of the base fare, but why doesn't the cheaper AC.com fare show up on Travelocity? Is this a different fare basis? Am I doing something wrong that is preventing Travelocity from showing all the fares?

Do other airlines do this? How do you know when they are offering these fares if ITA software can't find them? Do I need to do some more reading on how to use ITA? Is this price difference simply because the AC.com flights are in a different fare class than the ones quoted on ITA? Does ITA quote all available fares by default, or is there a setting that I don't know about?

I checked all kinds of dates for DTW-LHR and AC seems much cheaper even in September. When I see $850 on ITA and $650 on AC.com using the same dates, (I believe it includes all fees, surcharges, etc so it is an apples to apples comparison) am I seeing a difference in the fare basis or is this something to do with regular base pricing?

I do apologize if these are stupid questions, I am trying to learn as much as I can to maximize the quality and quantity of my air travel. If someone could take a few minutes to enlighten me by answering any or all of my questions, It would really be appreciated.
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Old Aug 6, 07, 12:56 pm
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Quite often, many special fares are only available through booking on ac.com only. Hence you are seeing that gap in pricing when you look up travelocity or expedia since they can only quote the ARC fare in some cases. In this case travelocity or expedia can only cross their fingers that someone would be stupid enough to book through them or not bother browsing through ac.com.
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Old Aug 6, 07, 3:10 pm
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Originally Posted by Shareholder View Post
This is nothing new, it is a regular base pricing from many US east coast cities. .
These fares are available from the west coast too, Seattle, Portland, etc. The irony is that the Seattle flight is about $300 cheaper than the same itin out of YVR, but if you book on the Seattle flight, you may go SEA-YVR-LHR.
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Old Aug 6, 07, 3:38 pm
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Not only LHR. But often SEA-YVR-HKG is cheaper than YVR-HKG for the same date. And yes you do have to originate in SEA if you purchased that fare because if you no show the SEA-YVR portion, the remainder of your bookings will most likely be cancelled. It is only one the return where you can forfeit the YVR-SEA portion.
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Old Aug 6, 07, 4:32 pm
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Sorry wrong thread.

Last edited by ALW; Aug 6, 07 at 9:05 pm
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Old Aug 6, 07, 5:46 pm
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Originally Posted by Kanada goose View Post
These fares are available from the west coast too, Seattle, Portland, etc. The irony is that the Seattle flight is about $300 cheaper than the same itin out of YVR, but if you book on the Seattle flight, you may go SEA-YVR-LHR.
Dare I say, west coast too? This is a regular occurance and as I noted in my original post, has been discussed a few thousand times here on FT. YOU HAVE NOT DISCOVERED THE WHEEL...NOR IS THIS A SPECIAL SALE. If you fly from the UK to anyplace, European carriers will charge less than BA if you transit through their airports. If you fly BA via LHR, its fares will undercut those of those same European carriers. So too does this happen with AC if you fly through YVR or YYZ or YUL overseas from the USA. THIS IS THE OLDEST FARE ANOMOLY GOING!!!!!!!!!!
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Old Aug 6, 07, 6:25 pm
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But the OP needs to be aware that he fare in N class probably would not get any EQMs and I suspect change fee is 200 or higher.
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Old Aug 8, 07, 8:51 am
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These fares are showing up on airfarewatchdog, it says they are available on orbitz and ac.com. The orbitz price is a little higher, I guess they add some booking fee? I don't know Orbitz at all, do you get EQM? At these fares? I don't see how to show the fare basis, but I do see "web special" so I am thinking no EQM. I went back to do some more reading and found out about this airfarewatchdog. Are they any good? I guess it is something new because I am not sure if they have their facts straight, according to them this is an "* Unadvertised sale. This sale is not advertised and could disappear at any moment.", rather than just regular base pricing.

The fares are still not on ITA as I mentioned in my original post. My mistake was thinking that all fares would be seen using tools such as farecompare, ITN, and ITA. I had read about fares "loading" and such and thought I had a pretty good handle on things. I also learned ITA saw some of the fares, when someone mentioned SEA-LHR and SEA-HKG, I checked them and ITA was right on SEA-HKG but not SEA-LHR.

It would be nice if people responded to the actual questions being asked or contributed something useful instead of posting what I feel are confusing, out of context responses. On the other hand, thanks Rejuvenated, I never heard of ARC before you mentioned it. This is the kind of information that is useful to me. ITA doesn't match, and this tells me there is a reason why. Sorry to have to ask more, I checked the FT glossary, and did a search through the forum, found something about members of ARC, what is ARC?

While I am new to FT, I have taken the time to read the FAQ's and the mileage runner's tools posts. I have done my part, I am not in the mileage run forum posting about the Air Canada Fall Seat Sale. I appreciate this fare anomoly being pointed out to me as I am here to learn, it would also be helpful to know if there are US carriers that are doing this from YYZ to their US hubs and then on to LHR for $200 r/t ++. I don't think it would be of interest to me, unless it earns EQM, but others may be interested in a cheap fare. I apologize if this has been discussed thousands of times here already.

One more question: if AC.com says a flight earns 100% status miles, does it? I am not sure if this is the same as an "if a tree falls" question, I don't mean it to be, so if it is could someone let me know.
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Old Aug 8, 07, 10:51 am
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Originally Posted by Shareholder View Post
THIS IS THE OLDEST FARE ANOMOLY GOING!!!!!!!!!!
And doubtless the most hackneyed spelling anomaly on FT...

Originally Posted by yyzjim View Post
One more question: if AC.com says a flight earns 100% status miles, does it? I am not sure if this is the same as an "if a tree falls" question, I don't mean it to be, so if it is could someone let me know.
Anecdotally, no. See http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=649305
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Old Aug 8, 07, 1:31 pm
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Originally Posted by yyzjim View Post
On the other hand, thanks Rejuvenated, I never heard of ARC before you mentioned it. This is the kind of information that is useful to me. ITA doesn't match, and this tells me there is a reason why. Sorry to have to ask more, I checked the FT glossary, and did a search through the forum, found something about members of ARC, what is ARC?
Airlines Reporting Corporation. Usually on a SABRE system, when one searches for the lowest fare on it and something pops out, then that is what is called an ARC fare. But usually TAs will have a special code given to them through their agreements with certain airlines that will allow them to issue the tickets with a discounted fare. In which, they only pay they airlines that amount when the bill comes.
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