Braindrain

For myself, I've even convinced my wife to take UA because of the E+. And, she's part of the normal travelling public who really doesn't care about getting an extra 500-1000 AP miles for a US connection but wasting a couple of hours because of it.

IF UA was allowed to fly to/from Cdn points, I'd be there in an instant.

Clipper801

AC's international Hospitality Service seat pitch is 31-34" for A330 and 32-34" for other aircraft types. The A345 was advistised to have 33" seat pitch. I wish that they are more clear in their web site. Depending on the particular seat, it could be 31", 32", 33" or 34". The question then is if you get an extra 15% seat pitch, 31/32" vs. 35/36", will you be prepared (or there will be sufficient passengers willing) to pay an extra 20-25% (cost of goods sold + profit margin) for the extra comfort? $1,000 vs. $1,250. If the answer is yes, then the business model may make sense. The second question is whether this should be a free perk for P/E/SE or *Alliance Silver/Gold? If the answer to this 2nd question is also yes, then the supplementary question is whether they should be "automatically" assigned a seat in this section because of their FF status, or on a 1st come 1st serve space available basis at airport check in only thus freeing up the maximum no. of E+ seats for those willing to pay the fare premium for a confirmed seating. Should a non status passenger willing to pay the extra$$ has priority over P/E/SE who get the seat for free? If so, the perk is that you can sit in those seats for free but on a space available basis.

Crampedin13A

I'd be happy if they removed the E- seating on the 319's in rows 12-15. But since we are all knowledgeable FT'ers we know not to get cramped in those rows.

Braindrain

Another benefit of AC having E+ is that this is a tangible benefit that most people can see. If it's advertised that you pay $X to get E+ or get it free because you're P/E/SE, there may be even more people enticed to fly AC just to get P and free E+. I know a lot of my colleagues at work would switch from WestJet because of it. (They still fly WestJet, BTW, even after giving them the Flying 101 course.)

When I was in YHZ the other day, there was a WestJet flight to YYZ departing just before the same AC flight. They announced their "free inflight tv" about 3-4 times before and during boarding. When it as AC's turn, it was the standard "Executive and E/SE passengers board first" mantra. I don't think that's a benefit that the average Joe Public cares about.

Ken hAAmer

On a few routes, UA has also introduced their P.S. service, where they have an expanded F/J section and the remaining econo seats are all E+. Seems to be very popular and highly regarded.

mtacchi

LOVE the UA E+ service. In fact, I purposely book my US travel on UA if its not going to be in F, because I love it so much. The fact AC doesn't have it is insane. How many flights need 6 more seats..ok a few, but the vast majority of flights leave with 6 empty seats. It would make a huge difference to many of us if that product were offered here.

Instead I fly from YVR to ORD tommorow on United. I could go via YYZ for more points and hassel, but when it was booked it was done in Y and it was beyond the upgrade window, so I picked UA for the E+. (in the end I am upgrading with a CR1, but that wasn't the case when I had booked it.)

rolyjp

I fly at least 170 segments yearly and because of UA's E+, 70% of these are UA, on routes that I do have a choice between AC and UA. Whether I use my UA 1K status or AC SE on my bookings, E+ is always offered and confirmed. Since all my tickets are paid for out of my pocket, executive class or upgrades are not a consideration with my AC flights because of the lower priced fares I purchase. E+ is a great alternative.

ACORD

Let us not forget the AC City Pass....

For a restricted economy fare price you get to travel in the business class cabin: More space than E+, better food than E+ and free drinks.

Although only available on a limited set of routes (happily the ones I fly on) it sure beats having a few extra inches of leg room.

why fly

[QUOTE=Al B]For me it's a no-brainer. I look at a couple of rows with UA @ 36-37" knee space which are eligible only for fuller fare or UA preferred pax and then look at the rest of their aircraft with 31". I look at AC with almost every seat row @ 34" - on a longer haul flight there is no choice, as I'm guaranteed non kneecapping space on AC but may end up in the knee reconstruction zone of UA non Y+.
3" doesn't sound like all that much, but geez it's a huge difference on long haul for a 6'1 bloke like me.
QUOTE]
Well AC does NOT have 34" legroom in its planes! Also its got NARROW width.
AC NEW 345 is 33" pitch and 17" width
ac 767 is 32-33 and 17" width
UA E+ 777 is 35" and 18"width
UA E+ 747 us 34-36 and 17" width.

UA economy is 31" nasty... {but its a market for the Holiday flyer}
If you have status with UA you BOOK exit rows E+ seating and BLOCK the seat beside you.[nice perk for status flyer}
However its interesting how many people say thats the #1 perk for flying UA!
All AC would do is lose a 6 seats?? Not a bad trade-off. IMHO.

YOWkid

Not a bad trade-off? That's a pretty bold statement to be making. You see, I don't think AC is making a mistake per se, but maybe it's just not making and giving itself a comeptitive advantage over the others.

But, that being said, cabin experience is a little more important to me. If I'm treated well and I get good service and respect, I'm willing to forgive AC on the 32" seat pitch...

If I'm flying to the US, you can bet that I will try to fly UA from the start -- not for E+ through; but rather, for the 100% status miles.

why fly

This month I will go with UA for 100% status miles 100% premier bonus and 100% promo Bonus... YIPPIE I go to HKG in a week and SYD in a month.

bobsyouruncle

I agree that cabin service is important but, and I believe I speak for all my taller brethren, seat pitch is more important to us tall folk. I can put up with poor service as long as I am comfortable and can stretch my legs. That is one of the main reasons I fly UA and one of the main reasons I would rather connect through ORD, SFO or DEN on UA when going to the US rather than through YYZ on AC.

tcook052

NZ unveils new premium economy cabin:

http://home.businesswire.com/portal/...39&newsLang=en

EL SEGUNDO, Calif.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Feb. 23, 2005--Air New Zealand today announced the new range of classes that will be available to travellers on its fleet of refitted Boeing 747-400 aircraft and eight new Boeing 777-200 aircraft this year. In addition to its "Business Premier" and "Pacific Economy" Classes, Air New Zealand has established a "Pacific Premium Economy" Class, making it the only airline to offer premium economy seating on flights to New Zealand.


"This is just the beginning," said Gus Gilmore, vice president of Air New Zealand - The Americas. "New planes, new in-flight entertainment systems, new seats, new uniforms and a new food and beverage service are just some of the developments we are working on to enhance our long-distance offerings. It has been quite a journey and we look forward to delivering a superior product to our customers in the second half of this year."

The new three-class configuration is expected to be available on flights from San Francisco to Auckland by August 2005, then on flights from Los Angeles to Auckland and Los Angeles to London by end of the year. Enhancements to each of the cabins will include:

-- Business Premier: Air New Zealand's replacement class for its First and Business Class long-haul products will provide customers luxurious comfort and service at a Business Class price. It will feature the revolutionary lie-flat seats, which includes a comfortable, 22-inch-wide leather armchair that converts into a 6-foot, 7.5-inch bed, an ottoman footrest that doubles as a visitor's seat, direct aisle access for all passengers, in-seat power and a high resolution 10.4-inch screen to view the on-demand entertainment system.

-- Pacific Premium Economy: Air New Zealand's newest class of travel, will be located in the premium cabin and feature the largest pitch in its class at 39 to 40-inches, a generous seat-width and on-demand entertainment on a personal 8.4-inch-high resolution screen. Customers will enjoy many of the comforts of the premium cabin, including the same beverage service, LED mood cabin lighting and in-seat power for electrical devices.

-- Pacific Economy: Air New Zealand's refreshed economy class will feature on-demand entertainment with 8.4-inch high-resolution in-seat video screens and offer travellers more personal space with its 34-inch seat pitch, one of the most generous of any long-haul carriers flying into New Zealand from North America.

Based on sales dates, final pricing and exact aircraft configuration for all three classes will be announced over the upcoming months. Exact fares for Pacific Premium Economy have yet to be finalized, but are likely to be around 25 percent more than Pacific Economy.

The $112 million upgrade of the 747 fleet is already in progress, with suppliers well into production of key components including seats and interiors. The refit of the first aircraft is expected to begin in April and be flying by July. The first of Air New Zealand's new 777 aircraft is expected to be in service in October.

mtacchi

AC is really missing the boat on this. People can live without the J class service, which is currently marginal at best, if they just had more room.

I love UA and its E+

ylwae

...although someone posted in this forum that the boxes for AC's planned IFE will be under the floor and entirely out of the way. Can't speak to the truth of that release, of course.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=402476