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Air Canada eUpgrade program (October 2020 onwards) [read wiki BEFORE asking question]

Old Jul 13, 2021, 7:50 pm
FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides
Last edit by: Adam Smith

Note: This is a long wiki, with nearly 50 Q&As. If you only see 3 or 4 questions, then find and click on the "Show more" link which can be found at the very end of the last text you see in this wiki window


Table of Contents (note the links below only work on desktop if you have expanded the wiki as described above)


Basics Back to top

Q: What is an eUpgrade?
A: eUpgrades (sometimes referred to as “eUps”) are a benefit of elite status with AC that allow elites to upgrade to a higher cabin (business class / Signature class, a.k.a. “J”, or premium economy, a.k.a. “PY” or “PE”).

Q: Are eUps automatic, like on Delta/AA/United?
A: No, you have to request one online or with a phone agent. You have to have sufficient eUpgrade credits (which, like the concept of eUpgrades, are often referred to as "eUps"), with an expiry date at least equal to the date of your flight, to make the request. If you don’t request an eUp, AC has no problem letting you sit in your original cabin, even if it means letting seats in J/PY go out empty.

Q: How many eUpgrade credits do I need for my flight?
A: Here's the official eUp chart (last updated by AC in October 2020; current as of at least December 2023)

Q: How are the number of required eUpgrade credits calculated for multi-segment itineraries? Is it by adding the cost of upgrading each segment individually, or for the end-to-end journey?
A: As long as your travel is continuous (without a >24hr stopover), then the number of eUpgrade credits required is for the end-to-end journey. Example, if you are travelling from YVR-YYZ-FRA, then the cost of upgrading both segments will be the same as though you had just a single segment from YVR-FRA. In some cases this may mean that a shorter segment is "free" (has no marginal cost). Note that you must clear each segment individually.

If you request an eUpgrade for AAA-BBB-CCC, but only the BBB-CCC segment clears, you will be charged eUp credits applicable only to the upgraded leg.

Q: I’m booked in economy on an aircraft with both PY and J cabins. Can I request an upgrade to both?
A:
No. You can request PY only, or you can request J and be listed for both J and PY.

Q: Can I confirm an upgrade to PY, then request an upgrade to J?
A:
Nope. Once you confirm a PY upgrade, that’s it.

Q: If I don’t clear my upgrade to J, can I still get upgraded to PY?
A:
Yes, if your upgrade doesn’t clear until the gate, you will be on the list for both J and PY, including the seats newly-vacated by people booked in PY who cleared their eUp to J at the gate.

Q: Are eUps guaranteed once they're confirmed?
A:
Not quite. For example, you won't get bumped out of an eUp just because somebody with higher status requested one after yours was confirmed. However, in very rare circumstances, for example if your plane gets swapped for one with a smaller (or no) business cabin, you might lose your eUp. See this thread for details. Further note that Air Canada generally takes the approach that a downgrade-from-eUp for operational reasons (equipment change, broken seat, etc) shall not receive any meaningful compensation, since you flew in the cabin you paid for.




Timing & Availability Back to top

Q: When can I request an eUpgrade?
A: You can request an upgrade as soon as you book the flight, with the exception of the travel companion benefit (person on same flight but not on same PNR; see below for details). Travel companion eUpgrade requests need to be made by airport staff after the flight opens for check-in.

Q: When can I confirm (or "clear") my eUpgrade?
A: You have to be within the "clearance window" that applies to your status and fare type. The windows are detailed in the AC eUp requirements document.

Q: Can you be more specific?
A:
All upgrades that clear in advance of the gate are subject to upgrade space being available. In addition:
  • for flexible fares (Latitude and Premium Economy Flexible): If upgrade space is available (more on that below) you can confirm an eUpgrade immediately after booking, even months in advance.
  • for non-flexible fares (Standard, Flex, Comfort, Premium Economy Lowest): You have to be within the clearance window in the document linked above, which ranges from 3-14 days, depending on fare brand, route, and status.
Exception: if you have no status, you can only clear an upgrade on a Latitude or Premium Economy Flexible fare 7 days in advance (non-flexible fares cannot be upgraded).

Q: What does "upgrade space" mean?
A:
Upgrade space (also known as R space - see below) refers to the number of seats that Air Canada are prepared to let people upgrade in to, in advance. This is not the same as the number of business seats that are available for sale. If Air Canada think that they will be able to sell all of the business seats on a plane (by the time of the flight) then they might not make any upgrade space available for that flight, even a full year in advance.

Q: I see a lot of people talking about "R space" or "R0", what does that mean?
A:
In short, R is the fare bucket Air Canada uses to make eUpgrade space available. If R is greater than zero, there are eUp spaces still available. If R = 0, then anyone who's requested an eUp will be waitlisted.

Q: What if I only want to upgrade to Premium Economy?
A:
Replace "R" with "N".

Q: The AC website tells me whether my upgrade request will be confirmed or waitlisted. Is it reliable?
A:
No. The website may tell you you’ll be waitlisted, when in fact your upgrade will be confirmed right away. Or it may say there’s space available even though you’ll be waitlisted. This is true of both the upgrade availability displayed during the booking flow as well as the eUpgrade website. The only exception being that if you’re outside your clearance window, the website should pretty reliably tell you that you’ll be waitlisted.

If the website tells you you’ll be upgraded, then waitlists you, you may be able to phone in to have the eUpgrade cleared, or not. If there’s R space, it’s likely they will be able to clear the upgrade.

Q: I’m waitlisted on a flight that’s R0. Will AC release more R space before the flight? Do I have to wait until the flight to find out whether I’m upgraded?
A:
AC might release more R space tomorrow (or clear your upgrade without creating any R space). Or they might never clear any more upgrades on that flight. If you’re still waitlisted, your upgrade may clear at the gate.

Q: What does “at the gate” mean?
A:
The upgrade list is typically processed 5 minutes after check-in for the flight closes. Check-in generally closes 45 minutes before domestic flights and 1 hour before international flights, meaning the upgrade list gets run at T-40 or T-55, as applicable (although occasionally it will be delayed). Even if your upgrade doesn’t clear at that point, it’s theoretically possible to still be upgraded if someone else in the cabin doesn’t show up.

Q: Is there a way to check my position on the upgrade list? To ensure I am on the list?
A: The mobile app will have a "Standby and Upgrade" list available at T-24 hours on the Flight Status page. Note that the order of the list may not be the order in which they process eUpgrades and only people checked in will show on the list. If you are upgraded you will receive a check mark beside your name?

Q: I boarded the plane but am still hoping for an upgrade; however, my name is no longer on the list? Does that mean I won't get upgraded?
A: Once you are marked as boarded in the system your name will no longer appear on the mobile app. There is much debate on what policy is once boarded; however, many feel "You Board, You Lose" and once boarded you are not likely to be upgraded using eUpgrades as the gate agents must process that transaction manually.

Q: So is there a chance that my upgrade might clear after I have boarded?
A: Probably not. Although this has happened on occasion, it's not a normal or automated or routine occurrence. Generally speaking, once you have boarded your name is removed from the upgrade list and you'll be sitting in the seat you boarded for. See this thread for details.

Q: How can I find the R space for my flight?
A:
Using a paid service like ExpertFlyer. If you ask nicely and don't overdo it, many FTers with EF accounts will help you in the Official Fare Bucket Check Request Thread.

Q: So, WHEN should I check for R space for my flight?
A:
This depends on your status and what kind of fare you have, so please read and keep in mind the confirmation windows mentioned above.
  • If you have (or are about to purchase) a flexible fare (Latitude and Premium Economy Flexible), then by all means check now since your upgrade could also clear immediately. If your plans are flexible, this can be a useful strategy to help find specific flights that could clear immediately well before the ‘normal’ confirmation windows.
  • If you don’t have one of the flexible fares mentioned, R space viewed on something like ExpertFlyer is only useful when you get close to your confirmation window. Checking before that is probably a waste of time.

Q: I heard a rumour that paid Latitude fares can eUp even when R=0. Is this true?
A:
Sometimes; it's complicated. Senior execs at Aeroplan have said that “in some cases” a Latitude or PE Flex cash fare (including Flight Pass Latitude Bookings) might clear an eUp even when R=0, but they've also been very clear that they will not be releasing the exact method by which this is determined, and that the same thing is less-often true for award Latitude / PE Flex. In other words, it may happen but don't assume it, and there are lots of times when it simply never happens.

Q: My flight shows R=1 (or more), and I'm within my window, but my upgrade has not cleared.
Answer depends on how close you are to the flight.
  • Within 36 hours of departure Your upgrade can't clear until the gate.
  • More than 36 hours from departure: Cancelling the request and then requesting again may solve it. Or you may be able to solve it by phoning in. Or you may not, because it's AC.

Q: I have a pending upgrade and I am looking at the mobile app - who are all those other people listed?
A:
The list shows everyone who wants to sit in a cabin that they're not currently confirmed in. If you see a name listed for both PY and J, they're trying to upgrade from Y; names listed only for J are trying to upgrade from PY.

Q: What are my chances of clearing an eUp for [FLIGHT] on [DATE] if I have [STATUS]?
A:
All we can do is make an educated guess. Lots of business travel gets booked last minute, or pilots need to reposition, or any of a dozen other things that might turn J9 in to J0 just before departure.

Q: But the seat map shows [x] seats occupied. Surely that means my odds are [good][bad]?
A: STOP LOOKING AT THE SEAT MAP. STOP LOOKING AT THE SEAT MAP. STOP LOOKING AT THE SEAT MAP.

Seriously, stop looking at the seat map. The seat map is not an accurate guide to the number of seats available in the cabin. Many people do not select their seats when booking, which can mean more seats have been sold than show as occupied on the seat map. On the other hand, due to IT glitches, seats are sometimes shown as blocked when there are waitlisted eUps or staff members on passes (see this thread for details). So the seat map may show more seats available than there truly are, or fewer. Or it may be correct. There’s no way to know for sure.

So stop looking at the seat map.

Q: I see people talking about "Aerolotto", what is that? Can I bet eUps?
A:
Aerolotto is a slang term for waiting at the gate to see if your eUp clears, or you're stuck in the original seat you paid for.

Q: I want to upgrade my flight on date X, but all my eUps expire on date Y, where Y < X. Can I upgrade?
A: NO. To eUp any flight, at any time, you need to have credits that are still valid on the date of the flight.



Earning and Validity Back to top

Q: How long are eUpgrades good for? When do they expire?
A: It depends on when the eUpgrade is deposited in your account.
  • eUpgrade earned January 1st - June 30th: Valid until January 15th of next calendar year
  • eUpgrade earned July 1st - December 31st: Valid until January 15th two calendar years later

Q: When do I need to use them by?
A: An eUpgrade needs to be used for a flight departing prior to 23:59 local time (where your flight departs) on the day your eUpgrade expires.

Q: Can I delay picking my benefits package until after July 1st to have eUpgrades have the later expiry year?
A: Yes. Picking your benefit after July 1st will have your eUpgrades deposited with an expiry year two years after the deposit date.

Q: I have an Amex Reserve / VISA VIP card that offers eUpgrade rollover. When I try to apply eUpgrades to a flight next year, it doesn't work. Why?
A: The eUpgrade rollover feature does not extend the expiry date of your eUpgrades. Those eUpgrades will expire, and you'll be issued new eUpgrades with a new expiry date. The T&C of these programs state that the rollover eUpgrades will be deposited by March 30, but it in 2022 and 2023 they were deposited before the end of January. Because of this quirk, it is not possible to use eUpgrades that would be rolled over. This thread on Aeroplan rollover benefits has more detailed information.

Q: Can I buy eUpgrades?
A: No. Generally you can only earn eUpgrades through a benefit package or SQM thresholds.



Upgrading Multiple Passengers Back to top

Q: I want to use my eUp credits to upgrade somebody else. Is this possible?
Are they on the same booking (“PNR”) as you?
  • Yes: You can upgrade a maximum of three passengers on a booking. If the booking has more than three passengers, you can't request an upgrade for any of them, before the day of travel. You can split the booking so that it has at most three passengers, then upgrade it, although splitting bookings can come with other, negative consequences.
  • No, but they’re on the same flight: You can request the upgrade at the airport on the day of travel; AC refers to this as upgrading a "travel companion".
  • No, and they’re not on the same flight: No, unless you’re Super Elite. If you’re Super Elite, you can designate a nominee, and you can upgrade this person on any flight they’re on. Your nominee selection stays in effect until January 17th of each year, and you only get one per status year. You cannot upgrade anyone else on your nominee's PNR.

Q: I'm trying to upgrade a travel companion on my flight, but the agent has no idea how. What do I do?
A: Tell the agent to go to the "customer" tab, select "upgrade", then select "use other FQTV".

Q: What's the maximum number of people I can upgrade on a flight
Are you Super Elite?
  • No: 5 (yourself + two people on the same PNR + two travel companions)
  • Yes: 6 (yourself + two people on the same PNR + two travel companions + nominee)

Q: I am SE and want to upgrade my nominee but they are on a PNR with multiple people and the system won't let me? Why not? What now?
A:
You can't have multiple people on the same PNR living in different cabins so the eUpgrade system will not allow you to request the eUpgrade. You may need to call in to AC (or Aeroplan if it is a flight reward) and ask them to split the PNR so that the person you want to upgrade is on their own PNR, at which point your eUpgrade should be fine. This shouldn't impact the ticket or incur a fee. But once you split the PNR you cannot join it back.

Q: I am SE and want to upgrade my nominee and their companion traveling on the same PNR. Is this possible?
A:
No.

Q: Can I upgrade my nominee on a flight that departs after January 17th?
A:
Yes, you should be able to upgrade them on any flight, regardless of departure date (subject to having eUps with sufficient validity).



Payments and Refunds Back to top

Q: If I don't get upgraded, or my flight gets cancelled, do I get the eUps back?
A:
Yes, eUps get refunded if your upgrade doesn't clear or your flight is cancelled (whether AC cancels it or you do). This should happen automatically shortly after the flight in most cases. If your eUps don't get returned to your account, fill out the form on this page.

Q: The eUpgrade I want to use has an additional cost. When will I be charged?
A:
eUpgrade add-ons are charged to your credit card when the eUpgrade is cleared, although AC may place a hold on the card before that.

Q: I'm a Super Elite and I'm still being charged for add-ons. Why?
A:
Super Elites are only exempt from eUpgrade add-on charges on international business-class flights (except for Standard tickets.)

Q: Will I be refunded my add-on payment if I cancel a booking that successfully cleared an eUpgrade?
A: There are no refunds on add-on payments.

Q: I paid extra for a Preferred Seat in Economy, does that fee get refunded if my upgrade request is successful?
A: There is no refund on preferred seats if you are upgraded.

Q: Do I earn Status Qualifying Dollars (SQD) for any eUpgrade add-on fees?
A: Yes, eUpgrade add-on fees paid where applicable earn SQD. This applies to fares paid in cash and with Aeroplan points. The SQD from the add-on will post as a separate transaction and may not post at the same time as the SQM/SQS/SQD from the flight itself.

Q: Who earns the SQD? If I upgraded someone using my eUps, do I get it?
A: SQD is earned by the passenger who was eUpgraded – who paid for the eUps or for the add-on doesn’t matter.



Priority for eUps Back to top

Q: What is the priority for eUpgrades?
A:
Upgrade priority at the gate:
  1. Cabin: If you're in PY, you're ahead of everyone in Y
    • Note: for upgrades to PY only, the requested cabin also appears to matter - AC appears to process anyone who requested, and didn't receive, an eUp to J, before those who requested an upgrade to PY (i.e. a 25K on a Flex fare who requested, but failed to clear, an upgrade to J would get a PY upgrade before an SEMM on a Latitude fares who only requested an eUp to PY). Note that this has not yet been extensively tested by FTers and is based on order on the publicly available upgrade list
  2. Status: There are several sub-priorities within status, listed in order of importance:
    1. Elite status; VIP > SE > 75K > 50K > 35K > 25K
    2. MM status; 2MM+ (no distinction between 2MM, 3MM, etc) outranks MMs, who outrank those with MM status
    3. Do you have a Premium credit card (TD/CIBC VIP or Amex Reserve) or not? (Other cards convey no eUp priority benefit)
    • To illustrate: any VIP > SE 2MM+ with credit card > SE 2MM+ > SE MM with credit card > SE MM > SE with credit card > SE > any 75K
    • If two passengers are on the PNR, the priority might be based on the highest status, regardless of who requested the upgrade, per this post
  3. "Fare": Brand comes first (PF > PL; LT > CO > FL > ST), so a low Comfort fare is higher priority than Flex M. Within a brand, fare class matters. If you bought your ticket through another airline, and you don't have a brand, they infer a brand based on the fare class.
    Fare class hierarchy:
    • PY fares: O > E > A > N
    • Y fares: Y > B > M > U > H > Q > V > W > S > T > L > K > G
  4. Check-in time: As indicated by your sequence number

Upgrade priority prior to the gate is similar, with possible exceptions for full-fare (Latitude / Premium Economy Flexible) bookings. In the old system, a 25K on a Latitude fare would be ahead of a SE on a Premium Economy Lowest fare prior to the gate. Time of upgrade request replaces check-in time.

Q: How can I tell where I rank for an upgrade?
A:
After check-in opens, the AC app has an upgrade list where you can see the people on the waitlist for J and PY. Note that the list is not only for eUps, but also includes customers on standby and some employees travelling on passes, and possibly others.

Q: How do those other things rank relative to eUpgrades?
A:
Staff on pass travel generally rank below eUps, while others may effectively rank ahead of or behind eUps.

Q: Is the app always correct?
A:
Unfortunately not. Sometimes the order is wrong, and sometimes people are missing from the list entirely even though they’re actually on the waitlist for an upgrade (and we have numerous reports of eUps clearing even when people weren’t showing on the public list)



eUpgrades & Partner Airlines Back to top

Q: Can I use eUps if I credit my mileage on an Air Canada flight to another airline?
A:
Yes. To request an eUpgrade, your Aeroplan number has to be on the file. Crediting to another FFP requires changing your Aeroplan number after check-in.

Q: Can I use eUps on partner operated flights (such as United, Lufthansa, etc)?
A:
No, you can only use eUps on flights operated by aircraft with "Air Canada" written on the outside.

Q: Can I use eUps on an Air Canada operated flight that was booked through a partner?
Answer depends on what type of booking you have made.
  • Cash tickets (i.e. not points): Yes, but with some complexity as to when and how you can request the upgrade.
    Is your AC flight a codeshare (a flight marketed by the other airline but operated by AC, e.g. marketed as UA5678, operated by AC as AC1234)?
    • No: you should be able to request it as usual via the eUp site
    • Yes: you can eUpgrade that -- but not before the day of the flight. You may only request an upgrade with an Air Canada agent at the airport, or at the departure gate on your day of travel.
  • Points tickets (United MileagePlus, Avianca Lifemiles, etc): No. These tickets cannot be upgraded.



Other Types of Upgrade Back to top

This wiki/thread only covers questions related to upgrading a ticket using Air Canada's eUpgrade currency. Please check out other threads to post questions or find out about other ways to upgrade:
Print Wikipost

Air Canada eUpgrade program (October 2020 onwards) [read wiki BEFORE asking question]

Old Jul 6, 2021, 6:34 pm
  #481  
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Join Date: Sep 2014
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Posts: 18,877
Does @Dave510 have a similar experience to what was discussed and analyzed here?

eUpgrade Available on AC.com, but all flights revert to waitlisting
24left is offline  
Old Jul 6, 2021, 6:59 pm
  #482  
 
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Posts: 1,289
Originally Posted by Adam Smith
Yes and no. The key is you need to expand the options for economy/premium economy to see what's available depending on the type of fare, because upgrades may be available from Latitude/PE Flexible but not for the other fare brands. Those have expanded access to upgrade space beyond the R fare bucket that supplies Flex, Standard, etc.

If it shows an upgrade is available for the fare brand that you purchased, then you may have a case.

But looking at the flights you've screenshotted there, AC133 should have space for upgrade from any fare brand (R7), while it's somewhat surprising that any fares would be showing an upgrade available on AC135, since it's J3 C1 D0 Z0 P0 R0. But I'd bet that if you expanded the options, you'd see only Latitude/PE Flexible say they'll be upgraded, and that the others will say you'll be waitlisted.
Thank you, I wasn't award that Lat has an expanded upgrade inventory compare to other economy fares, nor that expanding the available fare options would show whether or not e-ups were available for non-Lat fares (when expanded, there is neither the "Upgrade for x eUp credits" nor "Waitlist" message). Learned something new today!

Originally Posted by 24left
Does @Dave510 have a similar experience to what was discussed and analyzed here?

eUpgrade Available on AC.com, but all flights revert to waitlisting
That's exactly it! Thanks for the investigation into it in that thread, now I know what to look for going forward.
Dave510 is offline  
Old Jul 7, 2021, 9:07 am
  #483  
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: YVR
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Posts: 229
Originally Posted by Aker
Thanks guys.

I am on hold with the SE desk to try and see what to do. After booking it did allow me to waitlist eupgrade the YUL --> YVR portion for 4 credits per person. It also did book into "X Class".

SE desk confirmed the upgrade to J right away.

Now checking to see if I change the booking to PE Flexible which books into "E Class" if they can confirm that upgrade to J and I would save more points.
Just following up on my previous post. So I tried to book these into PY Flex and upgrade, but the upgrade was waitlisted. I figured I would spend the extra 20k AP points or whatever per person to get business class roundtrip on all flights except the YUL --> YVR portion.

So I booked 3 pax on the same booking with the following flights/classes:
OUTBOUND:
YVR-->YYZ business class
YYZ-->ATH business class
RETURN:
ATH-->YUL business class
YUL-->YVR economy class

2 out of the 3 pax on the booking have 50k status (my wife and daughter). Other pax does not have any status.
When I went to my wife's upgrade account it would not let me upgrade or waitlist upgrade on the last leg.
I called AC concierge and she said I would have to call aeroplan and they should be able to get the last leg upgraded as it was a business class lowest reward ticket. I called AP and they said no we can't upgrade that portion because it will cost more AP points and they would have to reprice the ticket.

Called AC back and spend 2 hours with them and they were unable to help even waitlist upgrade the last leg.

I then called AP and asked them to split the booking so my wife would be by herself and other pax & child were on another res.
I was then able to waitlist upgrade my wife's booking using her EUPS and my daughters using her EUPS w companion.

Another call to AC to tell them it is a latitude booking which booked into X CLASS so it should clear automatically as there was space in J available.

Another 2 hours waiting for her to check with her help desk before coming back on and saying they were unable...
Originally on a previous reservation with the same itinerary I was able to get AC to confirm the J upgrade so I gave her that booking reference. Another half hour and she came back and said she was able to confirm it...

Super frustrating and lots of time wasted... I really should have just forked over the extra 60k AP points to get it confirmed and not have to jump through hoops. That said, the agent did say she was super confused as Economy X class is a bottom fare ticket which in this case it was not. I did explain to her that it only cost me 4 upgrade credits per pax so it couldn't have possibly been a bottom fare class ticket.

Anyways, now we know it is possible.
Perhaps they did the upgrade under IROPS but I don't believe so.
Aker is offline  
Old Jul 7, 2021, 12:19 pm
  #484  
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: YOW
Programs: AC-SE100K, AC-3MM, Marriott- LT Titanium, SPG RIP
Posts: 2,958
Just booked DUB-YYZ-YOW in Business Lowest. Fare basis is PAEROEL

The last leg YYZ-YOW is in economy. My booking shows X. I tried upgrading online and it says "Waitlisted". R=7 at the moment.

Not really looking forward to the multiple calls to try and explain that X is actually Latitude and they should release the seats...

I have read the above posts, and am wondering if there are any specific words/terms i should be using when I call (or words to avoid all together)??

Thanks
Plumber is offline  
Old Jul 7, 2021, 12:20 pm
  #485  
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Originally Posted by Aker
2 out of the 3 pax on the booking have 50k status (my wife and daughter). Other pax does not have any status.
When I went to my wife's upgrade account it would not let me upgrade or waitlist upgrade on the last leg.
You can't upgrade a 3 pax booking unless 1 of them is SE, and has made another one their nominee. This has been the case forever.

Originally Posted by Aker
I called AC concierge and she said I would have to call aeroplan and they should be able to get the last leg upgraded as it was a business class lowest reward ticket.
Please don't call the concierge for issues that are not "day of travel". It even asks when you call if you're traveling today, and it redirects you to reservations if you're not.

It's incredibly infuriating to be unable to get through to the concierge line (indefinite hold) when you're suffering a flight cancellation, only to read stuff like this on FT the next day.

Originally Posted by Aker
I called AP and they said no we can't upgrade that portion because it will cost more AP points and they would have to reprice the ticket.
Because when you tell Aeroplan you want to "upgrade", to them that means "rebook in a higher cabin".

Originally Posted by Aker
Called AC back and spend 2 hours with them and they were unable to help even waitlist upgrade the last leg.
No idea why this took 2 hours, as it was a very simple issue.

Originally Posted by Aker
I then called AP and asked them to split the booking so my wife would be by herself and other pax & child were on another res.
I was then able to waitlist upgrade my wife's booking using her EUPS and my daughters using her EUPS w companion.
As expected.

Originally Posted by Aker
Another call to AC to tell them it is a latitude booking which booked into X CLASS so it should clear automatically as there was space in J available.
1. It's not a Latitude booking
2. "Space in J" is nowhere near sufficient to clear any eUpgrade
3. You need R space

Originally Posted by Aker
Another 2 hours waiting for her to check with her help desk before coming back on and saying they were unable...
Originally on a previous reservation with the same itinerary I was able to get AC to confirm the J upgrade so I gave her that booking reference. Another half hour and she came back and said she was able to confirm it...
At this point, they were probably just trying to get you off the phone.

Originally Posted by Aker
Super frustrating and lots of time wasted...
Because you were trying to do so many things that are not within policy, and you were telling them it's allowed, even though it's not.

Originally Posted by Aker
Anyways, now we know it is possible.
That is absolutely not the takeaway here. If you want to draw any conclusions, it's that if you're willing to waste 4.5+ hours of AC's time, they'll break rules to make you go away.
canadiancow is offline  
Old Jul 7, 2021, 12:26 pm
  #486  
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Originally Posted by Plumber
Just booked DUB-YYZ-YOW in Business Lowest. Fare basis is PAEROEL

The last leg YYZ-YOW is in economy. My booking shows X. I tried upgrading online and it says "Waitlisted". R=7 at the moment.
When is the flight?

Not really looking forward to the multiple calls to try and explain that X is actually Latitude and they should release the seats...
What makes you think you're in Latitude on that leg? The old rule that if you're in business on an international leg, you'll be in Latitude on a domestic leg disappeared a long time ago, I think. So if you buy a P fare YEG-YYC-LHR, for instance, you may end up in M on the YEG-YYC leg.

So why would an Aeroplan ticket be more favourable than a revenue ticket?
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Old Jul 7, 2021, 12:29 pm
  #487  
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Yeah, it's definitely NOT Latitude. That basically disappeared when branded fares were introduced.

You are seated in economy on a business fare.

I assume this flight is more than 14 days away? That would be why you're waitlisted.

You'd need to be in a flexible fare for it to clear ahead of time. But if you book a business flexible reward, you'll be in J on all AC segments anyway.
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Old Jul 7, 2021, 12:30 pm
  #488  
 
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Thumbs down

Originally Posted by Adam Smith
When is the flight?



What makes you think you're in Latitude on that leg? The old rule that if you're in business on an international leg, you'll be in Latitude on a domestic leg disappeared a long time ago, I think. So if you buy a P fare YEG-YYC-LHR, for instance, you may end up in M on the YEG-YYC leg.

So why would an Aeroplan ticket be more favourable than a revenue ticket?
Flight is Dec 12

Maybe my assumptions are all incorrect... I was going on the previous posts that were able to get X cleared into upgrades (or maybe i misunderstood).

Thanks
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Old Jul 7, 2021, 12:38 pm
  #489  
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Originally Posted by Plumber
Flight is Dec 12

Maybe my assumptions are all incorrect... I was going on the previous posts that were able to get X cleared into upgrades (or maybe i misunderstood).

Thanks
It will clear when your clearance window opens on November 30 (if my math is correct).

"X" (fare class) is mostly irrelevant with branded fares, for both revenue and reward. It might have a slight impact on number of credits, but upgrades are based on brand, and your brand is "business lowest" (which, unfortunately, is not a case they seem to have considered in the charts).
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Old Jul 7, 2021, 12:39 pm
  #490  
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Originally Posted by Plumber
Maybe my assumptions are all incorrect... I was going on the previous posts that were able to get X cleared into upgrades (or maybe i misunderstood).
I don't think we have a definitive answer to this. @YOWgary pulled a couple of data points, but as @canadiancow pointed out, it's not a Latitude booking. This is something different (Business Lowest booking with one segment in Economy), and as far as I know, AC has not published anything on how this works, and it's not clear they've decided all the details themselves. Here's what @YOWgary wrote after his chat with Mark Nasr on the subject of mixed cabin rewards:

Originally Posted by YOWgary
Any mixed-cabin segment on AC metal is eligible for eUpgrade just like an Economy or PE flight booked as an award on its own. I asked if there are specific rules about which exact fare type mixed-cabin awards will book into, and it sounds like they won’t set long-term policy on that until they have more data on "booking volumes and behaviours”, so for now mixed-class segments are assigned fare classes (and presumably priced) based on availability in each case.
Hopefully Mr. Nasr or someone from his team is reading this and will try to clarify the situation, both for customers and AC staff.
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Old Jul 7, 2021, 1:37 pm
  #491  
 
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I believe the only thing we've identified with certainty is that "Economy (X)" no longer refers to any one thing.

I currently have "Economy (X)" bookings that are booked as Economy Standard, others as Economy Latitude, and others as Business Lowest.

As I noted in my original breakdown on this, the final rules for this were clearly marked as being work-in-progress once flight volumes got closer back to normal, so I suspect we're simply looking for certainty before it exists.

I agree with Cow that Aker's experience above does not represent any expression of "what the rules are".
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Old Jul 7, 2021, 4:56 pm
  #492  
 
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Originally Posted by canadiancow
You can't upgrade a 3 pax booking unless 1 of them is SE, and has made another one their nominee. This has been the case forever.

Never knew that and AC SE reservations didn't tell me that so not sure how I was supposed to know? Had she said that then that would have been an easy, "split the res".



Please don't call the concierge for issues that are not "day of travel". It even asks when you call if you're traveling today, and it redirects you to reservations if you're not.

It's incredibly infuriating to be unable to get through to the concierge line (indefinite hold) when you're suffering a flight cancellation, only to read stuff like this on FT the next day.

TO BE CLEAR, I always call the concierge number but YES I DID select option 2 "if you are not travelling today".



Because when you tell Aeroplan you want to "upgrade", to them that means "rebook in a higher cabin".

Only called them because AC res said to.



No idea why this took 2 hours, as it was a very simple issue.



As expected.



1. It's not a Latitude booking
2. "Space in J" is nowhere near sufficient to clear any eUpgrade
3. You need R space

Right, which there was R space available...

At this point, they were probably just trying to get you off the phone.

Doubtful, she was really nice from the get go, just didn't understand the X class. I just told her I was confused as I should have been when my previous booking was the exact same and they got it cleared.

Because you were trying to do so many things that are not within policy, and you were telling them it's allowed, even though it's not.



That is absolutely not the takeaway here. If you want to draw any conclusions, it's that if you're willing to waste 4.5+ hours of AC's time, they'll break rules to make you go away.
**Response to Cow's comments above in the quote. Not sure how to separate**

I didn't tell the AC rep the first time it was a latitude booking. She told me, "I see it booked in a latitude class so it should clear instantly as there is R class available".
Not trying to scam the system but if it was cleared an hour before and there was R space available, not my fault their system didn't recognize it.

Last edited by Aker; Jul 7, 2021 at 5:03 pm Reason: added comment
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Old Jul 7, 2021, 5:01 pm
  #493  
 
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Originally Posted by YOWgary
I believe the only thing we've identified with certainty is that "Economy (X)" no longer refers to any one thing.

I currently have "Economy (X)" bookings that are booked as Economy Standard, others as Economy Latitude, and others as Business Lowest.

As I noted in my original breakdown on this, the final rules for this were clearly marked as being work-in-progress once flight volumes got closer back to normal, so I suspect we're simply looking for certainty before it exists.

I agree with Cow that Aker's experience above does not represent any expression of "what the rules are".
I agree with this. To be frank, there are no published rules on this which is my understanding so I guess it is a case by case basis. Would be helpful if this does get cleared up at some point. Seeing as I have a lot of eups expiring end of this year it was best for me to burn the eups and save the AP points.

Last edited by Aker; Jul 8, 2021 at 6:13 am
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Old Jul 7, 2021, 5:50 pm
  #494  
 
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My eupgrade waitlisted for J cleared today without any further intervention. This is a reward latitude booked last week for 2 months from today. Now hoping the flight remains scheduled . Thanks to everyone who answered my questions.
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Old Jul 8, 2021, 8:31 am
  #495  
 
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Hey guys, quick question. Been using eUps quite a few times in the past year since the new changes were implemented and they went through just fine. I have a flight YVR-YYZ on Jul 11 on AC122 and requested PEY to J using eUps. My clearance window is 4 days. In the past I'm usually cleared by the night of Jul 7. But now it's already Jul 8 and I haven't received any clearance. Should I be concerned? What is going on? Plenty of J space on the flight left since they switched equipment from 788 to 773ER.

Thanks for your help.
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