Aug 12, 2020, 12:02 am
Last edit by: Adam Smith
You must call in for stopovers, multi-city, or complicated routings, until the new booking system launches in 2021.
I hope others will significantly improve this wiki!
There are four zones: North America (inc Central), South America, Atlantic (including India and Western Russia), Pacific (inc Eastern Russia) and the chart is based which one you start from and which one you end up in, there's ten of these.
Cost is based on distance, which zone pair your flight is in, which class you are flying in.
Partner airlines (again) are a better deal because while Air Canada will calculate cost on a wide ranges but partner airlines are fixed to the bottom of the range.
YQ is eliminated. There's a 39 CAD fee for booking a ticket which contains a flight on a partner airline. Aside from this, there's no incentive any more to book a return flight it seems and every incentive not to.
Note: The partner booking fee is refundable, so it's basically a YQ, rather than a booking fee.
Most flights are devalued. However, the elimination of YQ sweetens this significantly. Within North America, a lot of flights became cheaper, YVR-HNL very significantly. YVR-TYO is much cheaper while YVR-AKL is a little cheaper.
A vastly more powerful booking system is promised for 2021.
There are a lot of new tricks to be learned. https://princeoftravel.com/blog/new-aeroplan-flight-rewards/ is a good start.
Information that is harder to find:
I hope others will significantly improve this wiki!
There are four zones: North America (inc Central), South America, Atlantic (including India and Western Russia), Pacific (inc Eastern Russia) and the chart is based which one you start from and which one you end up in, there's ten of these.
Cost is based on distance, which zone pair your flight is in, which class you are flying in.
Partner airlines (again) are a better deal because while Air Canada will calculate cost on a wide ranges but partner airlines are fixed to the bottom of the range.
YQ is eliminated. There's a 39 CAD fee for booking a ticket which contains a flight on a partner airline. Aside from this, there's no incentive any more to book a return flight it seems and every incentive not to.
Note: The partner booking fee is refundable, so it's basically a YQ, rather than a booking fee.
Most flights are devalued. However, the elimination of YQ sweetens this significantly. Within North America, a lot of flights became cheaper, YVR-HNL very significantly. YVR-TYO is much cheaper while YVR-AKL is a little cheaper.
A vastly more powerful booking system is promised for 2021.
There are a lot of new tricks to be learned. https://princeoftravel.com/blog/new-aeroplan-flight-rewards/ is a good start.
Information that is harder to find:
- SE IKK redemption from the old program can be changed ("within reason") without repricing. Dates, routings, no problem. Origin/destination should be fine. But nothing that would have required a repricing under the old program. This is from Mark Nasr in https://www.facebook.com/pointsmiles...44878252851420
- The "Activity" page only shows you the most recent ~48 transactions. See this post for information on how to get older data.
- A partial refund may not be possible (e.g. if you book RT and outbound flight is cancelled by you or AC, to delete the first flight segment, you have to cancel the entire ticket and rebook the inbound at a potentially higher fare. It seems supervisor can grant exceptions.)
2020 Air Canada Aeroplan Program
Aug 13, 2020, 10:58 am
#301
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SFO
Programs: AC SE MM, BA Gold, SQ Silver, Bonvoy Tit LTG, Hyatt Glob, HH Diamond
Posts: 44,323
So anyone talking about speculative bookings, "If you made a flight reward booking prior to November 8, you can still change or cancel it once the new program launches by calling the Aeroplan contact centre (1-800-361-5373). Both changes and cancellations will be subject to a flat $100 CAD fee, per ticket, plus applicable taxes. When changing a flight reward, your new itinerary will be subject to the pricing and policies of the new Aeroplan flight rewards."
So bear that in mind.
https://www.aircanada.com/content/da...-policy-en.pdf
"All fees are charged by Air Canada in CAD. Note that fees may be waived for eligible Elite Status Members."
It's not really clear exactly will happen, but I agree the bloggers have said it.
That's one thing I'm hopeful about. For the times I redeem miles on AC, if I can book a lower cabin and use my always-expiring eUps, then I can save a few points.
So bear that in mind.
"All fees are charged by Air Canada in CAD. Note that fees may be waived for eligible Elite Status Members."
It's not really clear exactly will happen, but I agree the bloggers have said it.
That's one thing I'm hopeful about. For the times I redeem miles on AC, if I can book a lower cabin and use my always-expiring eUps, then I can save a few points.
Aug 13, 2020, 11:34 am
#302
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: YOW
Programs: AC SE, FOTSG Platinum
Posts: 5,726
what tool should one use to calculate distances between cities? gcmap.com or something else?
I don't spend a lot of time in Google Sheets, but if someone can educate me on a better option, I'm happy to make it viewable.
Aug 13, 2020, 12:08 pm
#303
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SFO
Programs: AC SE MM, BA Gold, SQ Silver, Bonvoy Tit LTG, Hyatt Glob, HH Diamond
Posts: 44,323
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-...miles-aqd.html has all the distances AC uses for crediting miles.
But unless gcmap is coming up at 10999 miles, I'd probably just trust it. It may be off by a few, but it's not going to be off by a few hundred.
But unless gcmap is coming up at 10999 miles, I'd probably just trust it. It may be off by a few, but it's not going to be off by a few hundred.
Aug 13, 2020, 12:22 pm
#304
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2015
Location: BOS, YVR, ZRH
Programs: *G
Posts: 17,398
Am I missing something? As a Brit who likes to ski in Canada a couple of times a year, I'd like to make Aeroplan work for me - but I can't get my head around what seems to be a very low earning rate.
Suppose I budget £2K for a LHR-YVR flight. Depending on when I book and travel, my options might be:
- BA First: 23,615 avios
- BA Business: 14,169 Avios
- Air Canada Business: 9,110 new Aeroplan points (today's exchange and tax rates)
- Air Canada Business credited to Aegean: 18,892 miles
Under the new Aeroplan scheme, how would I ever earn enough points to treat myself? Maybe I'm not their target cstomer, but I really can't see why I'd sign up.
Suppose I budget £2K for a LHR-YVR flight. Depending on when I book and travel, my options might be:
- BA First: 23,615 avios
- BA Business: 14,169 Avios
- Air Canada Business: 9,110 new Aeroplan points (today's exchange and tax rates)
- Air Canada Business credited to Aegean: 18,892 miles
Under the new Aeroplan scheme, how would I ever earn enough points to treat myself? Maybe I'm not their target cstomer, but I really can't see why I'd sign up.
Aug 13, 2020, 12:48 pm
#305
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: YYC, Canada
Programs: AC 35k
Posts: 1,898
PoT is reporting the distance will be calculated based on total distance by segment not as the crow flies... that's going to make a big difference.
Aug 13, 2020, 12:54 pm
#306
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: SFO/YYZ
Programs: AC 25K, AS MVP Gold, BA Bronze, UA Silver, Marriott Titanium, Hilton Diamond, Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 2,466
EDIT: Actually I suppose that’s wrong because of the bounds aspect but there are less ridiculous boomerang examples illustrating the same thing.
Last edited by nexusCFX; Aug 13, 2020 at 1:02 pm
Aug 13, 2020, 1:00 pm
#307
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: YYC, Canada
Programs: AC 35k
Posts: 1,898
Hasn’t that been understood since the announcement? If they did it as the crow flies I could fly YVR-HKG-SFO with a <24hr in HKG for 12,500 miles in economy.
EDIT: Actually I suppose that’s wrong because of the bounds aspect but there are less ridiculous boomerang examples illustrating the same thing.
EDIT: Actually I suppose that’s wrong because of the bounds aspect but there are less ridiculous boomerang examples illustrating the same thing.
Aug 13, 2020, 1:08 pm
#308
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: SFO/YYZ
Programs: AC 25K, AS MVP Gold, BA Bronze, UA Silver, Marriott Titanium, Hilton Diamond, Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 2,466
I said as such in the correction I added on. It would have to break as two separate one ways. One less ridiculous case which I believe would work is TPE-SIN-BKK which is about 2900 miles. With a distance based chart I didn’t think this would be considered 1500 miles like TPE-BKK would.
Aug 13, 2020, 1:10 pm
#309
Suspended
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: YYJ
Posts: 2,230
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-...miles-aqd.html has all the distances AC uses for crediting miles.
But unless gcmap is coming up at 10999 miles, I'd probably just trust it. It may be off by a few, but it's not going to be off by a few hundred.
But unless gcmap is coming up at 10999 miles, I'd probably just trust it. It may be off by a few, but it's not going to be off by a few hundred.
Aug 13, 2020, 1:37 pm
#310
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: トロント
Programs: IHG Gold
Posts: 4,820
Aug 13, 2020, 2:35 pm
#311
Join Date: Feb 2003
Programs: AC SE MM, too many others
Posts: 1,407
Yes, overly positive hype in many cases. There are definitely positives:
- YQ gone
- Wide-open availability (for a price)
- points savings on short-medium haul
Negatives:
- long-haul has potential to be 2x points or worse and minimum 10 - 15% more at best
- earning is going to be tough without status (yeh, credit card earnings)
- partner rewards may be better than AC metal in many cases (+ve or -ve depending on perspective)
- YQ gone
- Wide-open availability (for a price)
- points savings on short-medium haul
Negatives:
- long-haul has potential to be 2x points or worse and minimum 10 - 15% more at best
- earning is going to be tough without status (yeh, credit card earnings)
- partner rewards may be better than AC metal in many cases (+ve or -ve depending on perspective)
But yes, if you are below 50k status earning is harder.
Aug 13, 2020, 2:45 pm
#312
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SFO
Programs: AC SE MM, BA Gold, SQ Silver, Bonvoy Tit LTG, Hyatt Glob, HH Diamond
Posts: 44,323
While reviewing the thread, I saw a lot on the increased "cost" of some rewards, but not so much on this. What I find interesting is that it does align earning on the program with routes where AC faces more competition - notably some of the US cross border ones and maybe some core Canadian routes. Your $800 flex ticket from YYZ-LGA will now (I think, and yes, depending on status) give you much more bang for the buck - but for your $5000 J ticket from YYZ-HKG it's essentially a wash (and maybe even a touch worse).
However, it would be really challenging to fly that trip and not have at least P25K, making it realistically 20k vs 23372.
And if you're E50K+, it's better now.
Status earning has not changed.
Aug 13, 2020, 3:32 pm
#313
Join Date: Feb 2003
Programs: AC SE MM, too many others
Posts: 1,407
Assuming you mean round-trip, and you have no status, sure, it's 15k vs 23372.
However, it would be really challenging to fly that trip and not have at least P25K, making it realistically 20k vs 23372.
And if you're E50K+, it's better now.
Status earning has not changed.
However, it would be really challenging to fly that trip and not have at least P25K, making it realistically 20k vs 23372.
And if you're E50K+, it's better now.
Status earning has not changed.
But isn't it harder to earn SQMs because of revenue based earning, or am I missing something (or maybe I just go back and read this thread more carefully)
Aug 13, 2020, 3:38 pm
#314
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2012
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Posts: 44,323
SQM earning isn't changing from today's AQM.
Aug 13, 2020, 3:50 pm
#315
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: YXU
Programs: AC SE100K, Marriott Bonvoy Titanium Elite, IHG Platinum Elite
Posts: 326
My wife and I were looking to do YYZ-MLE at some point in the next year or so. Under the current pricing this would be 150k per person round trip in J. Under the new pricing, the range is 85k-200k each way, which means at a minimum an increase of 13%, though theoretically an increase of 167%.
I've never redeemed miles before so forgive me if this is a dumb question, but if we were to book now and change the dates after the new system kicks in, would the point cost be the same or be adjusted based on the price under the new system? (I know with cash fares you pay whatever the fares are that day, but I'm unsure if reward tickets are the same).
I've never redeemed miles before so forgive me if this is a dumb question, but if we were to book now and change the dates after the new system kicks in, would the point cost be the same or be adjusted based on the price under the new system? (I know with cash fares you pay whatever the fares are that day, but I'm unsure if reward tickets are the same).