garykung

It is a lawsuit. No defendant will ever offer something other than cash.

It is a settlement. So you practically can add anything into it. It is a matter if the defendant will accept it.

Adam Smith

That's a ridiculous and completely untrue statement. And contradicted by the second half of your post. And by a previous post you made in another AC lawsuit thread, referring to "non-monetary" variables in the terms of a settlement. And while the details of that settlement were not made public, it was noted in the thread that the plaintiff's status on FT went from none to SE almost immediately, suggesting that part of the settlement included restoration of SE status, which is something other than cash.

The cost to AC of offering eCoupons is far less than the equivalent amount of cash. It would be entirely logical for AC to offer eCoupons as an alternative to offering cash. Just as it offers eCoupons instead of cash in denied boarding situations. And many customer service situations.

Finkface

I have a feeling he means he was awarded interest for the period of time it took to recover the duplicate charges, which is customary. Not a monetary award as in a per hour rate for the time he spent on this. We will see if/when he comes back to address this. I suspect he was just made whole by way of a refund of the duplicate charges plus interest. But I could be wrong.

garykung

There is a reason why you don't understand, as you are mixing up things together.

I would say no one would disagree that when there is a settlement, there will be a settlement agreement. Of course - it is up to the parties to negotiate the end outcome.

While you may see eCoupon makes sense, eCoupon will in fact create many unintended consequences. To begin with - eCoupon creates a future obligation that AC must commit. Also - eCoupon has its own T&Cs, you will have to incorporate the T&Cs into the settlement agreement. Bottom line - in case of any problems arise using the eCoupon, there may be a Round 2 against AC for breach of contract. On the other hand - cash is king. AC pays the settlement by cheque. Once the cheque has been cashed, that's the end of it.

Also - if the settlement includes cost, would you believe that AC would do this (issuing a cheque) and that (issuing a eCoupon)?

Previously, I have involved a case dealing with airline miles. Instead of the miles, I was paid in cash (equivalent to the cost of the miles you can purchase publicly) as settlement.

The purpose of settlement is to simplify things. No defendant would create obstacles unless it has to do so.

Also - per CTA rule, DB compensation must pay in cash, i.e. in form of cheque. When you volunteer, that's actually customer appreciation. Those are different.

Adam Smith

I'm not mixing things up. You made a definitive, absolute statement: "No defendant will ever offer something other than cash."

That's simply not true. Even if defendants may prefer to settle things in cash, that doesn't mean they will never do anything else, which is what you said.

So what? Legal e-mails AC Customer relations: "Please issue $500 eCoupon to Mr. So-and-So, e-mail [email protected]". Future obligation satisfied.

You're making this sound more complicated than it actually is. "Defendant will deliver the Plaintiff future travel credit ('eCoupon') with Air Canada worth $500, good for one year from the date of issue". Boom, done. If you really want to get pedantic about it, copy + paste eCoupon T&C, 30 seconds.

eCoupons are simple, there's a well established system for them and a large team of not-highly-paid customer service people to administer them and resolve issues. You're thinking like someone in a large corporate litigation, not at a retail level.

Cash is king, but $1 of cash is worth $1. $1 of eCoupon, AC values at far less than $1. If the plaintiff values an eCoupon at $1, or close to it, AC gains by using an eCoupon.

As I said, it's not hard to issue an eCoupon. If OP got $50 for his/her time, sure, probably more hassle than it's worth. If OP wanted thousands of dollars of damages and settled for a refund plus $1,000 compensation, it's worth taking 5 extra minutes to issue the eCoupon (AC internal cost: probably closer to $500) on top of the cheque/EFT/CC refund/whatever form the refund of the overcharges will take.

Great. Doesn't mean every case is settled only in cash. Someone might come to an agreement where the airline issued them miles.

Like, you know, when Aeroplan settled a class action lawsuit where it awarded the plaintiffs 2 billion Aeroplan miles (i.e. a defendant offered something other than cash!).

Or when BA settled a lawsuit about surcharges with the option of cash or Avios (another defendant offering something other than cash!).

Not restricted to the airline business. Zappos settled a suit in exchange for 10% discount codes. So did Ticketmaster.

Seriously, 5 minutes with the Google machine and you'll find dozens of examples of class actions with non-cash compensation like points and discount codes. You'll even find plenty of discussion of how those types of settlements are bad for consumers and how they should perhaps be curbed.

The purpose of settlement is not solely to simplify things, it's to make them go away more cheaply and/or quickly. If a non-cash component achieves that better than cash would, a non-cash component can be perfectly appropriate.

No, IDB compensation doesn't have to be in cash. The customer has a right to receive cash, if they choose, but the airline has the ability to offer non-cash equivalents (you can read more on the CTA's APPR website). I haven't heard AC doing any denied boarding announcements in a while, but I have, in the past, heard GAs offer pax 1.5-2x the cash value of the IDB compensation in the form of travel credit, which confirms that AC values that credit (e.g. eCoupons) at significantly less than they do cash. The passenger can insist on getting, say, $400 cash instead of an $800 travel credit, but they're allowed to accept non-cash compensation if they choose. Nor does the cash equivalent have to be a cheque like you say - cash, bank drafts, and electronic bank transfers are all listed as being acceptable, per that same APPR website.

garykung

Actually, the obligation does not get satisfied until it has been used.

You clearly have never gone through a settlement process...

I can tell you this - all major companies take litigation seriously regardless of the "level" of the court.

You are talking about class action. Class action has a different way because there is a cost to the settlement administration, which is paid by the defendant. That's why there are always some funny money going around to reduce costs.

Still the primary form is cash.

Jagboi

That's both a very definitive and wrong statement. There can be many cases where the cash is not at issue and it can't provide an adequate remedy. One example I saw was a patent lawsuit, where there were multiple inventors named on the patent, yet one had plagiarized others work and wasn't a true inventor and shouldn't have been named as an inventor. The remaining inventors went to court to get the rogue inventors name removed from the patent, and that was the remedy the court granted. Cash wouldn't have solved the issue and was irrelevant to the fact situation.

tcook052

While I have no stat.'s to prove it I'd wager it's the complete opposite, that the vast majority of IDB compensation is settled with a travel credit as it's not widely known pax can demand cash instead. The option to accept either cash or a travel credit isn't mentioned in the gate area announcements I've ever heard and little wonder as the airline knows there's a decent chance the credit will never be used.

ac/elite

A lot of defendants will offer something other than cash. That is a ridiculous statement. I actually have specific experience with an airline making an offer other than cash. When I was practicing law, I had a client who was injured when something fell on him out of the overhead bin. The airline (not AC) and my client settled for gift cards (this was before the days of e-coupons). Both sides were very happy with the settlement. My client intended to continue flying with that airline and was very well compensated.

TomMM

People that were a part of Schlesinger v. Ticketmaster would disagree.

Often1

Most lawsuits are resolved prior to trial and judgment. When a lawsuit is resolved, the parties are free to agree on pretty much any resolution which is not illegal. Absent minor children, class actions and a few other categories, the court is not even involved other than the parties notifying the court that the matter has been resolved.

Resolutions often involve non-cash aspects. For the same reasons that passengers accept non-cash resolutions in place of cash in the first place. For instance, $1,200 in credit against future travel rather than $800 in cash. Good deal for both in some circumstances and not in others. That is why these things are called settlements. Because both parties agree,

None of this is rocket science. It is how disputes get resolved.

Adam Smith

Okay, folks, I think we're drifting off topic here...

If @Steinbock would like to share some information on the settlement, such as whether any non-cash compensation was included (to the extent the terms of the settlement allow), great.

Otherwise, let's leave the general discussion of lawsuits and settlements to some other venue.

Adam Smith
AC Forum Co-Moderator

nikkijoie

Hello Fellow Travelers,

I am fed up with Air Canada also. Here's my case:

1. I purchased a ticket for US$458.90 with Air Canada to fly from Seatac, Washington, to Hong Kong, SAR China, with transit in Vancouver, Canada.

2. This flight was scheduled for June 19th, 2021 so I took my COVID test on June 17th at Seatac Airport at XpresCheck laboratory operated by US Careways LLC, which cost me US$250 plus US$20 parking (total US$270).

3. On June 19th, 2021, I checked in and boarded Air Canada flight# AC8090 at 10:00 a.m. at Seatac flying to VYR transiting to HKG on Air Canada flight# AC007 leaving at 1:00 p.m..

4. Air Canada airport staff checked all my travel documents: a negative COVID-19 PCR test document, my HK hotel reservation, my HK government QR code and found all my documents were in order so I flew to VYR.

5. At VYR, Canada, Air Canada staff did not allow me to board my connecting Air Canada flight# AC007 by claiming that my COVID-19 test document did not contain the accreditation laboratory certification.

6. Air Canada staff made a mistake when they claimed the accreditation laboratory certification was missing on my COVID test result document, which is not true because it was on the document.

7. Air Canada staff removed my baggage from flight# AC007 and I was detained by Canadian Immigration for a mandatory 14-day quarantine, which was in effect then if I could not find a flight leaving VYR that day.

8. The Canadian Immigration officer in charge took pity on me and helped me to find an outbound flight back to Seattle on Alaska Airlines flying at 5:10 p.m. that day, which cost me US$270.

9. Subsequently, I had to purchase another ticket with Cathay Pacific to get to Hong Kong, which cost me US$1,057.70, and also get another COVID test US$250 plus US$20 parking.

10. I want Air Canada to reimburse me $1,225.43, which is all my additional out of pocket expenses that I have incurred directly from the result of Air Canada’s staff mistake at VYR when they kicked me off their connecting flight AC#007 on June 19th, when they mistakenly claimed that the accreditation laboratory certification was missing on my COVID test result document when it was always on the document and I can prove it with the document that they inspected.

11. I used the same COVID test result document from XpreCheck laboratory to board my flight on Cathay Pacific on June 29th, 2021 and arrived in Hong Kong successfully with no issues at all.

Now I need to serve my legal complaint court documents to Air Canada, i.e., legal language - serve the complaint documents to defendants! Does any have a good address for Air Canada to serve them with legal documents? I supposed I can send via certified registered return signature service with USPS and send the legal documents to their corporate head office. Does anyone have a better idea? Thanks.

Regards

niikkijoie

flyerCO

FT isn't a legal forum. You need a lawyer.

You need a lawyer. Your injury was by a Canadian company, and happened in Canada, not US. Suing in US courts is likely to result in dismissal of case. Also even if you can sue in an US court, serving a foreign corporation is not as simple as sending a letter certified mail.

I'll leave it at that as there's no need to say more, except to reiterate, you need a lawyer..

nikkijoie

Thank you for your input, flyCO. I'll keep your suggestion in mind.

In addition, I have lodged my above complaint with Canadian Transportation Agency (CTA) in July 2021 and have a case number from CTA but I am still waiting to be assigned to one of their agents to start work on my above case. Does anyone have any kind of success working their complaint through CTA? Thanks.

Regards

nikkijoie