AC now ranked "one of the worst performers" for OTP
Apr 28, 2019, 7:35 pm
#16
Join Date: Sep 2018
Programs: Aeroplan
Posts: 53
That would beat running through Pearson to make a US connection to find out your "on time" flight isn't actually boarding until God knows when
Apr 28, 2019, 9:46 pm
#18
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Oakland CA
Programs: DL Gold, AS MVPG, Globalist
Posts: 1,008
Yeah, agree so much is self-inflicted.
On a recent set of 4 flights, 4/4 were at least fifteen minutes late. Reasons:
- Couldn’t get a gate on at least one end (3/4)
- Lav service only emptied one of two lav tanks. (1/4)
- One of the computers at the gate was innop, meaning boarding delays and delays helping pax with ticket issues. (2/4)
- En route winds added 30 mins (1/4)
Of those exactly one wasn’t caused by AC.
On a recent set of 4 flights, 4/4 were at least fifteen minutes late. Reasons:
- Couldn’t get a gate on at least one end (3/4)
- Lav service only emptied one of two lav tanks. (1/4)
- One of the computers at the gate was innop, meaning boarding delays and delays helping pax with ticket issues. (2/4)
- En route winds added 30 mins (1/4)
Of those exactly one wasn’t caused by AC.
Apr 28, 2019, 11:25 pm
#19
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SFO
Programs: AC SE MM, BA Gold, SQ Silver, Bonvoy Tit LTG, Hyatt Glob, HH Diamond
Posts: 44,323
Yeah, agree so much is self-inflicted.
On a recent set of 4 flights, 4/4 were at least fifteen minutes late. Reasons:
- Couldn’t get a gate on at least one end (3/4)
- Lav service only emptied one of two lav tanks. (1/4)
- One of the computers at the gate was innop, meaning boarding delays and delays helping pax with ticket issues. (2/4)
- En route winds added 30 mins (1/4)
Of those exactly one wasn’t caused by AC.
On a recent set of 4 flights, 4/4 were at least fifteen minutes late. Reasons:
- Couldn’t get a gate on at least one end (3/4)
- Lav service only emptied one of two lav tanks. (1/4)
- One of the computers at the gate was innop, meaning boarding delays and delays helping pax with ticket issues. (2/4)
- En route winds added 30 mins (1/4)
Of those exactly one wasn’t caused by AC.
And I'm counting the lav issue as "ground crew didn't do their job".
I don't know how a gate computer not working would be an issue. They generally have 3+ and use 1-2 for boarding on the small flights. They have and use more on the large flights. And they can very easily use any computer at any gate to deal with "ticket issues". That was one they easily could have prevented.
Apr 29, 2019, 3:15 am
#20
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: YYC
Programs: AC SE
Posts: 829
out of 26 AC flights since Jan 19 i have yet to have an one time departure. WS out of 6 flights all on time arrival and departure. Frontier out of 2 both on time. United out of 2 both on time. Lufthansa 3/4 on time and Vienna 2/3 on time.
Apr 29, 2019, 6:32 am
#21
Suspended
Join Date: May 2018
Location: ord
Programs: UA 1k SPG Platinum
Posts: 365
I generally get pi??ed off with flight delays But one thing I like about AC is they don't cancel their flights as easy as US airlines in bad weather. It kills there OTP, but generally you get a flight. US airlines start cancelling flights days before storms, just to protect their OTP. Great for them, but bad for everyone else. I spent extra nights in Chicago/NYC this winter because of this.
? does AC have less maintenance people, or are its A320 so old that they are what makes so many delays?
I always wonder how AC has become the worst on time performance?
Last edited by mellon; Apr 29, 2019 at 6:37 am
Apr 29, 2019, 7:30 am
#22
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 96
but this doesn't counter that argument as AA/UA/DL as a whole are not as exposed to weather as AC in the winter months. Unless they have identical routes/times, your post doesn't add anything to that argument supporting it or otherwise
Apr 29, 2019, 7:37 am
#23
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 669
What happens if it’s your return flight? It’s a lot better for 99% of pax if AC works some magic and get a few flights moving. I had my UA flight cancelled 2 days before a storm hit Chicago this winter. It was actually not even snowing when my flight was suppose to depart. I was not happy being in Chicago for the 2 extra days. AC on the other had had delays and cancellations, but they were still getting pax out by subbing in larger aircraft.
Just look at NYC flights. During bad weather, AC reg subs in 767’s at the last min to get people home. Yes, these flights can be hours late, but guess what, you get home. US airlines just starting cancelling and it becomes your problem for a few days.
Apr 29, 2019, 8:17 am
#24
Original Poster
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: YYG
Programs: airlines and hotels and rental cars - oh my!
Posts: 2,995
DL has hubs in Minneapolis, New York, Denver and Detroit, cities that get exactly the same type of winter weather (or worse) than YYZ or YUL. AA has hubs in JFK, LGA and ORD, probably three of the worst airports in North America for consistent, year-round delays. UA has its hubs in ORD, DEN and EWR, which are also far more consistently prone to delays than YYZ or YUL.
Weather is NOT a factor.
Apr 29, 2019, 8:25 am
#25
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Canada
Programs: UA*1K MM
Posts: 23,300
Why? AC give you the option of changing/cancelling your flight for no charge in major weather. Therefor there is no reason to cancel flights in advance. You can just change your outbound flight. Plus, the weather can/does change.
What happens if it’s your return flight? It’s a lot better for 99% of pax if AC works some magic and get a few flights moving. I had my UA flight cancelled 2 days before a storm hit Chicago this winter. It was actually not even snowing when my flight was suppose to depart. I was not happy being in Chicago for the 2 extra days. AC on the other had had delays and cancellations, but they were still getting pax out by subbing in larger aircraft.
Just look at NYC flights. During bad weather, AC reg subs in 767’s at the last min to get people home. Yes, these flights can be hours late, but guess what, you get home. US airlines just starting cancelling and it becomes your problem for a few days.
Your personal experiences are irrelevant, the numbers speak for themselves. By your logic, both my AC flights were on time in 2019, therefore AC has an 100% OTP!
Now, the regular AC faithful have come up with "oh but others cancel way more!" - which again, numbers show otherwise. AC cancels a higher percentage of their flights, even though they operate 3x less flights than the big boys.
I am amazed that people are so keen to make more excuses for AC than AC does themselves!
Apr 29, 2019, 9:52 am
#26
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 669
Oh not the weather argument again. Please - it's been disproved so many times it's not even funny. Yes, AC faces winter delays by flying out of hubs like YYZ, YUL and YYC. So does Westjet, yet their OTP is significantly better every single time - in spite of operating out of the exact same airports as AC. Why can they do it and AC can't?
DL has hubs in Minneapolis, New York, Denver and Detroit, cities that get exactly the same type of winter weather (or worse) than YYZ or YUL. AA has hubs in JFK, LGA and ORD, probably three of the worst airports in North America for consistent, year-round delays. UA has its hubs in ORD, DEN and EWR, which are also far more consistently prone to delays than YYZ or YUL.
DL has hubs in Minneapolis, New York, Denver and Detroit, cities that get exactly the same type of winter weather (or worse) than YYZ or YUL. AA has hubs in JFK, LGA and ORD, probably three of the worst airports in North America for consistent, year-round delays. UA has its hubs in ORD, DEN and EWR, which are also far more consistently prone to delays than YYZ or YUL.
Weather is NOT a factor.
Apr 29, 2019, 9:54 am
#27
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SFO
Programs: AC SE MM, BA Gold, SQ Silver, Bonvoy Tit LTG, Hyatt Glob, HH Diamond
Posts: 44,323
Proactively cancelling flights at a hub soon to be affected by weather gives people opportunites to rebook via other hubs in advance, and/or cancel their flight since there is always a generous waiver associated with weather events. If I am going YYZ-EWR-XXX, and EWR is affected, I am happy to have the opportunity to rebook ahead of time to YYZ-ORD-XXX, instead of waiting until the snow hits. Waiting until the weather hits and getting caught with your pants down (like AC does), means more people get stuck.
However, this really has nothing to do with OTP.
Apr 29, 2019, 10:15 am
#28
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Canada
Programs: UA*1K MM
Posts: 23,300
Agree, totally irrelevant. The argument was, AC's OTP is bad because they dont cancel as many flights, thus are prone to more delays.
And as shown, thats utter nonsense, because they cancel a higher percentage of their flights than anyone else in North America.
And as shown, thats utter nonsense, because they cancel a higher percentage of their flights than anyone else in North America.
Apr 29, 2019, 11:49 am
#29
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: sqrt(-united states of apologist)
Programs: *$ Green
Posts: 5,403
Another thing to take into consideration with regards to block times is that shortening the block can allow you to change your connections/network planning and "game" aircraft utilization into something more favourable especially if you know you can handle a tighter connection.
If I was AC and I had to choose between gaming block time for network planning/aircraft utilization vs. OTP stats, I'd likely choose the former (unless the latter costs more than the revenue gained by the former).
Apr 29, 2019, 12:24 pm
#30
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Canada
Programs: UA*1K MM
Posts: 23,300
I'd love to see AC turn around times, but I m willing to bet, they would be the same if not longer than the competition.