YOWkid

But, I really think Collonette and his advisors are meeting at Place de Ville to figure out what to do next...

msn

I think not. That decision has already been made.

why fly

And its NO ???

After Burner

Maybe the "buffoon" hasn't heard about the AC crisis yet. Even if his advisors tried to tell him, it would be drowned by the constant noise of sewage flowing from that large, lopsided hole in the front of his face.

why fly

Maybe the "buffoon" hasn't heard about the AC crisis yet. Even if his advisors tried to tell him, it would be drowned by the constant noise of sewage flowing from that large, lopsided hole in the front of his face.[/B][/QUOTE]
The Buffoon is busy trying to get himself some new trains!

RampPilot

In fact, it is. Right now there are only around 7000 ATPLs in the country, and ACPA represents more than half of them.

This is aside from the fact that any pilots they did find would have to be trained on the aircraft which alone would take over a month. Pilots new to the airline would take much longer as they learned the new SOPs.

If they tried this, it couldnt happen overnight.

airbus320

And now the conjectures about the role of the government...

http://makeashorterlink.com/?H2A3263C4

Altaflyer

Or he is contemplating a further study and analysis of the situation, or studying whether a study is needed. Incredible.

In the end, I suspect that the pilots may very well dig in, the judge may have little choice but to lift the bankruptcy protection (although I don't know much about the law in this area) and the gov't may indeed ride in and dump a tonne of our $$ to rescue Milton & Co. It is truly annoying to think they will get a bailout. If there is a bailout may it have many strings and short leashes.

msn

Interesting thought. I guess all the former UA pilots wouldn't be given permission to fly equivalent aircraft under executive order?

LeSabre74

If it weren't for the potential disaster ahead, the irony would be too sweet. If ACPA hadn't spent years fighting common-employer status for CALPA, the CALPA members would have no cost advantage over ACPA!

That said, you have to question allowing Jazz to fly up to 110 seat aircraft. What's the point of having a separate brand if they were to fly routes interchangeable with mainline? Limit the size of regional aircraft to 90 seats, work out some reasonable way for ACPA pilots to be hired by Jazz without a huge drop in seniority and hope that leads to a solution
to the impasse.

msn

No - The matter is one of hubs and spokes versus direct flights. Jazz is certainly feeding the Air Canada mainline operation and delivering passengers into the international route network. On it own, Jazz is flying low volume routes which make money based on providing transportation on a competitive basis to cars, boats and whatnot.

You know yourself that if you can drive somewhere in two hours, you look long and hard at flying - after all, why should you? Time demands? Flying a short distance is relatively time inefficient unless there is a barrier to direct movement, such as a route from Victoria to Vancouver.

For longer flights, the math gets easier, you fly - but when the costs get out of hands, you revert back to the car. Jazz will be able to take more people, with lower frequency, to more destinations, with fewer planes.

Air Canada will assert itself for heavily traveled routes and long haul international - the nature of the aircraft that are flown today makes a nature delineation point at the 110 passenger level. No one would look at a Boeing 717 or a CRJ and think he was going to fly Toronto to London, unless the London in question is London, Ontario, not London, England.

LeSabre74

msn, I agree with many of your points, but from a marketing perspective I don't think it makes sense. Branding is supposed to create a distinct idenetity for a product. If AC and Jazz are to be interchangeable on domestic routes, what's the marketing point of a separate brand?

From a logistics side, how could they handle Jazz and AC pilots "bidding" on certain routes? Suppose Jazz has all their crew flying and is successful on bidding on a particular route for the next schedule? Do they go out and hire more crew, only to have the situation change in the next sked?

RampPilot

Nope. Pilot's licensed in the US cannot fly Canadian regestered aircraft in Canada. The UA guys would have to come up here and write exams for the Commercial Pilots license, ATPL, INRAT, Radio operator, and Take flight tests before they could fly up here.

msn

In the very unlikely event that the pilots would not fly, I can forsee a temporary waiver of all these issues - the act of doing is not so important as the message of the willingness to do.

As to the branding issues - you must think that Air Canada is genuinely interested in branding!

As soon as Jazz has the ability - staff, ground operations and equipment - it will "ask" for given routes, more likely, AC will offer the routes, and then operate them. AC will sell tickets just like normal. After all, the passengers don't see what's on the tail when they are in the plane, do they?

On the bidding, it's a one-way trip - to Jazz or not to Jazz, hence the pilots's concerns. Unless Air Canada starts doing some heavy lifting - and quickly at that - those jobs will be gone forever.

LeSabre74

A waiver would be more politically palatable than having to invite foreign carriers in, especially after Papa Jean has made such an issue over Canada's sovereignty. You'd have to assume there would be some breaking ranks at ACPA as well. at that point.

Well, then that was awhole lotta money wasted In that case they should have left the livery the same and just called Jazz: Air Canada Regional.

One more question, I assume a 100 seat jet would be the A318 or B717? Given commonality it would seem likely to be the A318. If so, wouldn't the AC pilots already be qualified to fly it, whereas Jazz pilots would all have to be trained? Wouldn't the same go for maintenance?