Question: Really old A320s on LGA/Toronto route.
#31
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: YUL
Programs: AC SE (*A Gold), Bonvoy Platinum Elite, Hilton Gold, Amex Platinum / AP Reserve, NEXUS, Global Entry
Posts: 5,691
So, their fleet is safe despite its age, and AC is actually in the process of upgrading the fleet with a mix of 737-Max and C-Series purchases.
Tell me again, what was your point?
#32
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC
Programs: Aeroplan 75K | Latitude Flight Pass junkie
Posts: 1,548
I know I will be laughed at for this question, but was about to book flights from New York to Toronto on Air Canada and noticed that the planes of choice on this route are really old A320s.
Most are from 1990-1992. Which is basically the very first generation of A320 with the CRT screens, old 1980s software, no GPS, etc. I know plenty of airlines use 20+ year old planes, and many parts get replaced over the years.
But should I be concerned at all about the safety (especially considering the 2 incidents from the past 3 years involving AC a320)?
Or should I fly with WestJet that uses much newer 737-800s? WestJet is a bit more expensive for these same dates and arrives in Terminal 3, which is less convenient for Pearson Express service.
Most are from 1990-1992. Which is basically the very first generation of A320 with the CRT screens, old 1980s software, no GPS, etc. I know plenty of airlines use 20+ year old planes, and many parts get replaced over the years.
But should I be concerned at all about the safety (especially considering the 2 incidents from the past 3 years involving AC a320)?
Or should I fly with WestJet that uses much newer 737-800s? WestJet is a bit more expensive for these same dates and arrives in Terminal 3, which is less convenient for Pearson Express service.
When you get on-board, you won’t likely even notice the plane’s age as they were fully refurbished not much more than 10 years ago. They’ll look positively futuristic compared to most United narrow-body airplanes.
As another commenter said, there are more cosmetic and interior maintenance issues with these aircrafts like finicky headset plugs, or non-functioning features on the IFE.
#33
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Toronto, ON
Programs: AC 75K
Posts: 6,358
The OP is referring to technology on the flight deck, not cabin technology for passengers.
#34
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 105
But this in itself is not relevant to safety, obviously. It just adds to the weight of the aircraft and it burns a bit more fuel, adding to the reason for AC to upgrade them soon.
I loved the on-time arrival charts and other factual data. I am a data junkie
Fot those interested, a European A320 pilot did AMA on Reddit last year: https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/6chejy/i_am_an_airline_pilot_flying_the_a320_across/
A lot fascinating stuff for the airline lovers.
As far as the topic is concerned, I feel much better and safer. My question was based not on the hard logic or facts, but on illogical anxiety. And I understand that.
To add to the argument against the newer planes, Delta's spanking new a330-300 recently had a huge problem with one of its new GE engines that caught fire.
#35
Suspended
Join Date: Sep 2014
Programs: AC SE100K-1MM, NH, DL, AA, BA, Global Entry/Nexus, APEC..
Posts: 18,877
Thanks for letting us know. Hopefully the "collective" here have been helpful and perhaps entertaining. Have a great flight.
#36
Join Date: May 2012
Location: BKK/SIN/YYZ/YUL
Programs: DL, AC, Bonvoy, Accor, Hilton
Posts: 2,917
You really do not want to go there because Delta is renowned for its maintenance philosophy and is considered one of the best when it comes to preventative maintenance. Delta and Air Canada have two very different approaches to fleet maintenance and upkeep.
You may be unaware, but Delta is also an industry leader in predictive analytics. I expect that Air Canada was relying on Johnny the mechanic's bunion pain to predict a problem while Delta was one of the first to implement the maintenance and service strategy.
Delta’ still has its own dedicated inhouse aviation maintenance capabilities and can do complex overhauls. Air Canada closed its major maintenance facilities. Delta's larger fleet means that if a repair is needed, it can be done quickly, and not delayed because the removal of the plane would disrupt the airline schedule. In plain language, Delta can handle the older aircraft because it has the ability to service them with loving care.
You may be unaware, but Delta is also an industry leader in predictive analytics. I expect that Air Canada was relying on Johnny the mechanic's bunion pain to predict a problem while Delta was one of the first to implement the maintenance and service strategy.
Delta’ still has its own dedicated inhouse aviation maintenance capabilities and can do complex overhauls. Air Canada closed its major maintenance facilities. Delta's larger fleet means that if a repair is needed, it can be done quickly, and not delayed because the removal of the plane would disrupt the airline schedule. In plain language, Delta can handle the older aircraft because it has the ability to service them with loving care.
Last edited by Transpacificflyer; May 8, 2018 at 9:49 pm
#37
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: YYZ
Programs: FOTSG Tangerine Ex E35k (AC)
Posts: 5,612
I generally feel two things on AC planes.
Either happy and comfortable in J, or miserable and uncomfortable in Y.
I’ve never felt unsafe on an AC aircraft. Including the older ones, not that I track FINs and check she’s so I can’t tell you what the oldest one I’ve been on is.
Would I prefer a more modern plane? Sure maybe. Would I book another aircraft type of it meant not getting in somewhere at a crazy time ... sometimes... But for comfort issues over safety ones.
I’ve never felt unsafe on an AC aircraft. Including the older ones, not that I track FINs and check she’s so I can’t tell you what the oldest one I’ve been on is.
Would I prefer a more modern plane? Sure maybe. Would I book another aircraft type of it meant not getting in somewhere at a crazy time ... sometimes... But for comfort issues over safety ones.
#38
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: YYC
Programs: BA bronze, Aeroplan peon
Posts: 4,742
I can think of all sorts of things I'd rather be on than AC metal. The Orient Express. The Queen Mary 2. Even Via Rail's The Canadian. Modes of transport that actually have food worth eating. Even within airlines, I can think of many that are nicer than AC.
#39
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: YYJ
Posts: 4,137
I generally feel two things on AC planes.
Either happy and comfortable in J, or miserable and uncomfortable in Y.
I’ve never felt unsafe on an AC aircraft. Including the older ones, not that I track FINs and check she’s so I can’t tell you what the oldest one I’ve been on is.
Would I prefer a more modern plane? Sure maybe. Would I book another aircraft type of it meant not getting in somewhere at a crazy time ... sometimes... But for comfort issues over safety ones.
I’ve never felt unsafe on an AC aircraft. Including the older ones, not that I track FINs and check she’s so I can’t tell you what the oldest one I’ve been on is.
Would I prefer a more modern plane? Sure maybe. Would I book another aircraft type of it meant not getting in somewhere at a crazy time ... sometimes... But for comfort issues over safety ones.
#40
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: YOW
Programs: AC E75 / Marriott Titanium Elite
Posts: 952
When flying Y I much prefer one of the A320 family to any of the widebodies. I try and book away from the newer aircraft when flying, say, YYZ-YVR since the narrow bodies are way more comfortable. Last time I flew YVR-YYZ on the 787 my back was sore for a few days after due to the narrower and harder seats.
I just arrived home on time LGA-YYZ-YOW on two separate A320 birds. It will be sad to see them go when their time does come sooner than later. While I flew the DC9s and others as a kid, most of my AC flying life has been on the A319/320 and in recent years the 321. Hundreds of flights with that distinctive/annoying engine hum.